Source please!
I asked if anyone had seen data. I posted earlier a report of a gunshot victim who waited over a week for surgery: https://www.washingtonpost.com/health/2021/08/16/joel-valdez-houston-covid-hospitals/
Here is a report of long wait times for ambulances, and long lines waiting for ER spots in Fla https://www.wfla.com/news/pasco-county/spike-in-covid-hospitalizations-causing-ambulance-shortage-and-long-911-wait-times-in-pasco-county-fire-chief-says/
There are tons of these stories being reported in covid hot spots (which is much of our country), so I asked if anyone had seen an dataâŠa source that might be aggregating this information. Bottom line, time is of the essence in treating medical emergencies, and in places where the system is overburdened, a lack of timeliness typically leads to relatively poorer outcomes.
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I am pleased some companies are getting serious about this. One corporation I work with announced employees need proof of vax or corporate approved exemption or will be terminated for cause 9/30/21. No unemployment benefits for those termed for cause.
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I went for a haircut today with my stylist that I believe has done everything right during the pandemic to keep himself, his staff and clients safe. Once he dropped the mask mandate, he let his clients do what was comfortable for them. If one arrived with a mask on, the staff working with that client would put a mask on. All his staff was vaccinated, so while I felt comfortable going there, I wore my mask the two times I went once the mask mandate was removed.
So today my stylist is telling me a story about 4 anti vax clients. He told them separately, that while they have the choice not to be vaccinated, he is really angry that they donât respect his wishes. He stated that he may require proof of vaccination within the month, not just trusting the clients to tell the truth. He said two of them actually told him that that would have no problem bringing in a fake vax card 
He said to me, he can not be responsible for the slip of the scissors when their bangs turn out way too short! 
While he hates to lose long time clients, he is willing to do so if needed.
Based on the bragging Iâve seen/heard from antivaxxers about their willingness to lie about having gotten vaxxed, or to use a fake card, I think this is a very real concern.
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It also disturbs me when a politician ( who is vaccinated) gets covid leads the âother sideâ to claim some type of moral victory almost rooting and cheering about it.
Are you talking about Trump? Iâm pretty sure he got the vaccine after having COVID.
I think the gist of what many are saying here is that we donât have time to screw around with this. We donât have time for people to try home remedies or to finally realize that their friends on FB really donât know anything and havenât the educational or experiential chops to argue about vaccine side-effects and/or the efficacy of other treatments and/or how disease management works. We donât have time for you to wonder and be empathetic about those people or their personal choice option. We. Donât. Have. Time. Vaccines donât work that way. They work on the collective model. Otherwise, the virus has some place to go and mutate.
The economy can only take so much before things get really ugly and stay that way for a long time. Jobs are lost, and the domino effect happens ⊠again, only this time itâll be even worse. Retirement accounts, savings, home and food security, etc. etc. Not to mention the hospitals being upside down again. This affects all of us. Full stop. If we have to do this again, itâs going to be a mess, and the rest of us are going to know where to to lay the blame.
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no - the recent politicians - one for instance Gov. Abbott
You mean the guy who is fully vaccinated and also had the booster (as far as I know, heâs not immunocompromised so wasnât qualified to get it in the first place) and immediately had expensive monoclonal antibody treatment that others have to wait in line for? The guy who received treatment that other people canât afford? The guy whose friends in the Texas Senate donât support the vaccine because itâs not FDA approved yet sing the praises of the antibody treatment (hey guys, thatâs not approved either). The guy whose supporters are now demanding blood products from donors who never received the vaccine because they donât want their âtaintedâ blood? 
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Letâs be careful and not go down the rabbit hole of political discussion, please.
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Donât forget: Our insurance premiums are going to go up. A LOT. The more folks who are hospitalized going forward, the more our premiums are going up.
Oregon Health and Science University Hospital posted this graphic on their FB page yesterday:
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Full FDA approval for Pfizer may be coming on Monday? https://www.nytimes.com/live/2021/08/20/world/covid-delta-variant-vaccine
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OHSU is in Portland, in Multnomah County and Hillsboro, in Washington County, which have 63% full vaccination rates.
The numbers posted suggest the following:
- 94% vaccine effectiveness against needing hospitalization.
- 97% vaccine effectiveness against needing to go into the ICU.
- 96% vaccine effectiveness against needing a ventilator.
(Edit: OHSU is in Hillsboro in Washington County as well as Portland in Multnomah County, but full vaccination rate in these counties is basically the same.)
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@Lindagaf , earlier this week our builderâs wife suggested that I look into ivermectin in case our immunocompromised child (who was vaccinated) contracts Covid. Wonder where she got that idea?
The guy who is a human being? Seriously, I came here to reply to a question asked of me. I was trying to be respectful. I really donât enjoy this thread - so Iâm not responding anymore.
Living in an area of the US where many of these folks claim Christianity, I wonder how they reconcile doing these this and the âThou shalt not lieâ commandment. Iâve wondered about other things before too - like love one another, love your enemy, etc. (far more TBH).
I also claim Christianity and it bothers me to be lumped into the same group as those spewing hatred. As I said some time ago (perhaps on another thread), weâve quit going to our church over it. The Bible I read and follow apparently isnât the same as theirs.
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Iâm done with the vaccine reluctant.
Get the shot or no concerts, sporting event, public transportation, employment or eating out for you.
Someone I know from a youth sports context is the plantiff in a âyou canât make me get a shot to do my jobâ case . Seeing his name on the case confirmed my previous views about him
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Claiming Christianity doesât mean one wonât make bad choices or even deliberately commit a grave misdeed. But I think in this case it comes down to what is the worse thing in peopleâs minds: the lie or the vaccine mandate itself. There might be some lively debate over that topic at Bible Study. I do wonder whether professed Christians really are checking in with their respective churchesâ stance on the vaccine. IMO, if one says they belong to this or that church and professes those beliefs, then if the church has condemned the vaccine one should be able to get a religious exemption; if it hasnât condemned the vaccine, then one is sort of on the hook to better understand why.
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Just a couple of observations from watching those in my family who are vaccine reluctant. Approximately half of my family are like most âCC postersâ and their families while the other half have spent most of their lives in poverty. There are a lot more vaccine reluctant in the impoverished portion of my family and I spent the 1st half of my life living around and with those who are now vaccine reluctant. No one cared about âourâ health care while I was young and poor as I had very few doctors appointments and went to the dentist twice before adulthood due to lack of access that affects lots of poor POC.
Now that we are in the mist of a public health crisis that affects the possible health of us all, those same family members see the hypocrisy of a health care apparatus that ignored âusâ until âwe allâ were affected. Most of those family members are not affected by no concerts, sporting events, public transportation, employment or eating out because they live an entirely different existence from you and I. So the fact that a portion of the population is âdoneâ with them does not really matter, because they have never mattered to most Americans until now.
There are not any ânever vaxxersâ in my family, just a lot of distrust, which I have been trying to bridge with scientific data, factoids (like 96% of all doctors being vaccinated), and being a trusted member of my family. I am thankful for those who continue to advocate for public health and try to reach those who are reluctant, because I believe that the alternative (vaccination or catching Covid) could be deadly for some members of my family.
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Thank you for your post. H and I were talking about the difference between his school district and the surrounding ones. All areas are relatively low vax rates. But in Hâs school district - heavy majority are POC - there has been very little push back on the mask mandate. The surrounding areas are primarily white. Thatâs where youâll find the packed board meetings with parents shouting, cursing, threatening people over masks, CRT, transgender, etc. itâs been a zoo.
I feel like this group has the best chance to overcome the reluctance. Is there anything you can think of that will help this group feel more comfortable? As Ive mentioned before, our city brought the clinics to the large employersâ parking lots, went into poor housing complexes as well as the churches. The wife of the preacher at the largest and most influential AA church died from covid. The family pleaded to get people vaxxed and had a clinic at church. Very little response but they said any but helps which I suppose is true.
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Masks have been adopted in mass in my family no matter a family memberâs vaccine status and even the very young (3 year old) wear masks during their preschool days without any issues.
I think that it is going to take more time, plain and simple. It took me a few months to convince my mother to get vaccinated and it took my own householdâs experiences with vaccination, and some good old fashioned guilt trips (your grandkids would never get over losing you over something so preventable). I think every reluctant household will be different. Some will be convinced by trusted people, some will be convinced by full FDA approval, some will be convinced by the death of someone they know or love, some will be convinced by a work or school mandate, some will want to âjust waitâ, and some will not get vaccinated. The only thing I am sure of is that âtough talkâ by the âpro-vaccine at all costs crowdâ does not work and I believe it causes nearly as much damage as the misinformation campaigns that hinder mass vaccine adoption amongst the vaccine reluctant.
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