Vaccine reluctance & General COVID Discussion

But what omicron has proven is the greater good has to be worldwide, not just wealthy countries. There are also places that are 90 percent vaccinated and cases are still rising (portugal).

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Agree, however SA, where omicron is thought to have originated, has a vaccinated rate of only 35%. They have enough supply, that’s not the issue. Vaccinations have slowed because of vaccine hesitancy. Now we have a variant of concern arising from that country. Would this have happened with higher vaccination rates? Maybe, maybe not. But it’s absolutely without a doubt more likely to occur when you have low vaccination rates.
The issue for omicron specifically is not supply. It’s apathy.

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This is certainly a global issue. I honestly don’t think we will ever reach “herd immunity”. As said above, we fret over vaccine reluctance in the US but really unless we are going to totally isolate our country (never going to happen) then we are always going to be exposed to covid from outside our borders. Vaccines are highly effective at reducing the risk of more severe health issues but in the end they aren’t completely stopping covid. I do think we should probably focus more on parts of the world that have very low vaccination rates to try and address the greater risks there as in the end that will benefit the world more then focusing on every last individual in this country.

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Just the basic vaccine reluctance is frustrating here still.

I have another prayer chain email today from my church talking about one person in the ICU on a ventilator that only a miracle will save and another that’s an update from a couple in their 50s where she was vaccinated and he wasn’t. She had mild symptoms and is over it. Overnight they had to intubate him.

All about politics really. Surely a couple of shots would have been better than the ICU and intubation. How “free” is he now? Since he’s young he has better odds of surviving. I wonder what his thoughts will be afterward. I wonder if his situation will inspire others (who know him) to change their minds.

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Allegedly becoming allergic to hair dye after a vaccine could simply be, like many other allergies, due to repeated exposure to allergens in hair dye. Many other vaccines have negative side effects. Maybe that person had just received a flu jab, or some sort of medication caused a side effect.

It boggles my mind that people can equate a possible sudden allergy to hair dye with a reason to not get vaccinated. Death and long term now-known and yet-to-be-discovered health effects trump alleged hair dye allergy, unfortunately.

My very good friend was quite sick with covid recently, despite being fully vaccinated. For context, myself and 7 others, including my friend, were at a dinner party. All fully vaxxed. One woman woke up feeling ill next day and tested positive for covid.

Of the eight people total, three ended up with covid. My friend who was quite sick was exposed for longer. No one has any doubt that he would have surely ended up in hospital if he hadn’t been vaccinated. He is still hacking away nearly four weeks on. That’s an anecdote that holds much more weight.

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I recently lost a close family member who was not vaccinated. I have not seen that his death has changed or inspired anyone else close to him.

Yes, and I read an article earlier today about a televangelist, Marcus Lamb, antivaxxer, who touted alternative therapies on his shows who just died from Covid and the family still supports the alternative therapies.

In the case of the family I know, the blame is being put on “politics” and the inaccessibility of alternative therapies (and protocols that are followed that they feel don’t work) - NOT the the fact that fact that deceased was not vaccinated.

Some people choose to believe everything but truth. They will blame anyone except the person who made a foolish choice. They will do these things perhaps because that’s what they genuinely believe, but also because they may want to conform to what others around them believe.

I have to wonder how anyone who hasn’t seen someone gasping for breath doesn’t want to rush out and get vaccinated. And I bet some of them are, quietly.

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Yes, and I read an article earlier today about a televangelist, Marcus Lamb, antivaxxer, who touted alternative therapies on his shows who just died from Covid and the family still supports the alternative therapies.

Yes, they believe strongly in Ivermectin (which the man was taking as a prophylactic).

The fact that it neither prevented his illness nor mitigated it whatsoever is entirely irrelevant apparently.

From his wife:
“She said that they attempted numerous “protocols,” including unproven ones that the organization has touted on their broadcasts, but that they did not work. His heart eventually gave out,” she added.

“It caused his blood sugar to spike and a decrease in his oxygen,” she said. “He 100% believed in everything that we’ve talked about here on Daystar
 we still stand by that, obviously.”

God gave them a miracle when multiple effective vaccines were developed in under a year - the fastest in history and unimaginable just a decade ago. Then he provided effective wide-scale distribution at no cost to the recipient.

You have to wonder what people would count as a miracle and the answer to their prayers if not that.

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My favorite story along those lines:

A man was trapped in his house during a flood. He began praying to God to rescue him. He had a vision in his head of God’s hand reaching down from heaven and lifting him to safety. The water started to rise in his house. His neighbor urged him to leave and offered him a ride to safety. The man yelled back, “I am waiting for God to save me.” The neighbor then drove off in his pick-up truck.

The man continued to pray and hold on to his vision. As the water began rising in his house, he had to climb up to the roof. A boat came by with some people heading for safe ground. They yelled at the man to grab a rope they were ready to throw and take him to safety. He told them that he was waiting for God to save him. They shook their heads and moved on.

The man continued to pray, believing with all his heart that he would be saved by God. The floodwaters continued to rise. A helicopter flew by and a voice came over a loudspeaker offering to lower a ladder and take him off the roof. The man waved the helicopter away, shouting back that he was waiting for God to save him. The helicopter left. The flooding water came over the roof and caught him up and swept him away. He drowned.

When he reached heaven and asked, “God, why did you not save me? I believed in you with all my heart. Why did you let me drown?” God replied, “I sent you a pick-up truck, a boat, and a helicopter and you refused all of them. What else could I possibly do for you?”

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I’m more worried about dying. I mean, for real? Someone would weigh an allergy to hair dye vs. death?
It’s mind boggling how people think.

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'Tis definitely sad TBH.

H and I just donated blood earlier today. Listening in to conversations around us there are a lot of people believing things like, “everyone has to die sometime” coupled with, “no sense worrying about it.” I mentioned, “true, everyone dies sometime, but I still wear seatbelts in the car to have better odds” and was immediately met by, “I’ve seen people who wore seatbelts and still died.”

It’s times like those when I let it go and figure when reason doesn’t work Natural Selection will play a part. With most past child bearing age it won’t play a big part in the future, but it’s playing its part in the here and now. The vast majority who don’t make it or are giving themselves a harder future health-wise are in that group.

Nearly 600k of the 750k or so US deaths were in those aged 65 and over. I don’t think child-bearing was an issue for them.

Which is what I said


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Because grandparents are sometimes involved in their grandkids’ child care, there could be a selection benefit in favor of having living grandparents. There could also be a selection benefit in favor of healthy grandparents over those with long term sickness from COVID-19 after-effects, in that sick ones consume more time and resources from the parents.

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@MaineLonghorn I love that story and was considering sharing it.

Of course, he was being terribly woke in that the truck wasn’t a Hybrid, the boat didn’t have all of the safety features that it could have had and he didn’t know how qualified the helicopter pilot was.

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I used to think I was an empathetic person, not so much anymore. I don’t like that I feel that way, but it is.

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