I definitely agree that the number of actual cases is probably 3-4x the number known cases. In addition to the asymptomatic, you have plenty of familiesof 3-5 where they all got sick within days of each other. Family member #1 is positive, why bother with testing the rest. And then I suspect a lot of college students didn’t get tested either. And then the ones who just didn’t want to or care. A favorite coworker recently mentioned how he thought he had it back during the peak months. He detailed a horrid set of symptoms over the weekend and then went back to work Monday still very sick, because he didn’t want to get a doctors note. He was offended that his boss would make him get one to prove he was sick. I am so glad he is in a different building, but I’m sure that kind of thing happened a lot in my workplace.
But, the question becomes - how long does natural immunity last? If it’s 3 months like many experts are still saying, that would negate almost all of the people. If it’s 6, you would still be within that window, though time is running out for many. Since the number of cases has dropped so rapidly, I suspect 6 is more accurate, but if it’s longer and will protect against the variants? Who knows.
I agree it’s likely some accurate info has been censored, yet I don’t understand why a physician would post a study and discussion of Ivermectin on YouTube…what are they trying to accomplish with that? Why wouldn’t they go thru normal channels, for example, get the study peer reviewed and published in a medical journal? It also seems the timing of this YouTube posted discussion was after many other Ivermectin studies failed to show any benefit treating covid patients.
With respect to those time frames, are they at least or at most? Seems that lots of people here are assuming at most, even though that may have not been said.
However, there was a study in Denmark finding that natural infection was about 80% protective against subsequent infection, but only 47% protective for the 65+ age group. Other studies found that antibody levels in those known to have had natural infections were rather variable.
Too many people seemed to be unwilling to have an outdoor socially distanced Thanksgiving or other holiday family gathering. They also might not have wanted to stay in a hotel instead of their relative’s house if the visit was more than a day trip. Hence all of the COVID-19-lottery family gatherings, some of whom won the super spreader prize. Others cancelled in person gatherings because the people were unwilling to stay outdoors.
And here’s an even scarier article. 50% of those hospitalized died.
It’s easy to make stats seem very scary, but it doesn’t matter how many articles we see about negative vaccine side effects. They won’t come close the numbers compared with covid side effects and deaths.
Exactly. From the NPR article re: cases of myocarditis after MRNA vaccine…even if the 300 or so cases of myocarditis in those 30 years old and under were caused by the vaccine, the benefits of vaccination still outweigh the risks, per the CDC:
It’s good for doctors and patients to be aware that there might be a connection between the messenger RNA vaccines and heart inflammation, and to report to their pediatrician anything they see in that first week after vaccination. But it is also important, the CDC notes, to recognize that even if this does turn out to be an extremely rare side effect of the vaccine, “most patients who received care responded well to medicine and rest and quickly felt better.” And the serious risks of COVID-19 — even for young healthy people — outweigh the risks of any possible side effects from the vaccine.
The good news is the CDC and many other health experts are investigating, and there will be an advisory committee meeting to review the generally transient and mild cases of myocarditis post-MRNA vaccination next week. Meanwhile, if anyone experiences chest pain at any time, whether after vaccination or not, they should go to the ER.
I understand why social media is censoring discussions of unproved Covid treatments. They lead to people drinking bleach or overdosing on hydroxychloroquine and doctors less scrupulous or knowledgeable than the ones in the story experimenting with off-purpose drugs. Unfortunately, it also fuels conspiracy theories.
But my elderly, immunocompromised, cancer patient MIL does and will have to continue to do so as long as this virus is around, which will be longer if people will not get vaccinated.
And she cannot be a complete hermit - she has to go to doctor’s appointments, chemo treatment, etc.
And unfortunately with the rise of the delta variant, I’m afraid that these stories will become more prevalent.
I heard Ashish Jha on MSNBC yesterday talking about the delta variant. What they are finding is that before some people in the same household for instance would not catch Covid, with the delta variant, all in the household (or office) are catching Covid. Also they are finding that if you received both doses of the 2 dose vaccine, they are effective against the delta variant. But if you’ve only had one dose, it’s not very effective.
This isn’t the clip I saw but another from the Today Show
As I had said earlier, the vulnerable will continue to need protection as appropriate given their vaccine status, and should be able to depend on the more able to step up to help with that. I’d want to make sure my family member is receiving the best possible care, and I’m sure you would too. Sometimes taking those actions helps reduce ongoing fear, but it won’t remove the ever-present awareness that is required in the world of Covid. Vigilance and fear are not quite the same thing.
They need to stop sharing if they can’t provide information to back up what they are claiming is true. My son’s hospital system sends him information about Covid stats within the system. It used to be daily, but now I think it’s weekly. Regardless, I seriously doubt his is the only system to do so. Between him, his contacts, and the multiple contacts here on cc I seriously feel we could fact check any system out there in the US.
I do not believe there is any major system that has not seen bad Covid cases while seeing a lot of bad Covid vax issues. I don’t believe it exists. If you or someone else is saying it does, name the system/city/state and we’ll check to see.
A single doctor (or 10/100/4% who aren’t vaccinated minus those who have true medical reasons) might not see cases because most doctors don’t work with Covid patients. None of those who famously make the news sources I’ve seen dissing Covid have worked with Covid patients at a hospital. They’re surgeons or pediatricians or similar. A hospital might not see Covid patients if they’re sent elsewhere to another hospital set up to handle the bad cases. But a system overall seeing no bad Covid cases and a lot of bad Covid vax effects? Name it and we’ll check. I doubt it exists.
If you can’t put the name up there for people to check to see if it’s true, please quit sharing the info as fact because it likely isn’t. One person saying so doesn’t make it fact.
Since you also have a child who medically-vulnerable, you understand that we rely to some extent on others to take Covid precautions even as we take precautions ourselves. My medically-vulnerable child can’t sit at home forever and would like to have a (relatively) normal first year of college. So, again, we need to rely to some degree on other people taking precautions.
We can’t mandate people do things in support of general public health (although, actually, we can and do in many cases).
There is a lot of support for the vaccine and that’s great for individuals and for the general population. There are a lot of people who, for whatever reason, have chosen not to be vaccinated, yet still take precautions for themselves and even for the general welfare of the community. There are also people out there downplaying the potential dangers of Covid. There are people out there equating mask-wearing with slavery, the vaccine with the Holocaust, and requirements for unvaccinated with yellow stars.
So, while I am careful to be understanding and empathetic (and to keep my worst thoughts to myself), I also encourage vaccination and I do my best to dispel myths and misinformation. If that makes me come across as “smarter-than-thou”, as you suggest, so be it.
Here’s the warning from a site I use to buy Ivermectin. It’s an animal wormer.
"Warning from the Manufacturer
COVID-19 ALERT CONCERNING DURVET IVERMECTIN PRODUCTS: WARNING! A number of Durvet products including Duramectin Equine Dewormer, Ivermectin Equine Dewormer, Ivermectin Sheep Drench, Ivermectin Pour On, Ivermectin Injection and Ivermectin Plus Injection contain the anti-parasite ingredient Ivermectin. Despite media reports that Ivermectin could potentially be used to treat people with COVID-19, these products are not safe or approved for human use, which could cause severe personal injury or death."
From what I recall looking at studies Ivermectin was showing promise in the early stages, but later tests from reputable places weren’t conclusive. Here’s an NIH evaluation from Feb. Someone might have more updated info somewhere.
In the meantime due to the internet and gossip, apparently a lot of people are trying it anyway on their own. That might be Natural Selection in action as I think about it.
But, Ivermectin is still in trials, so who knows? It could end up useful. Time will tell. Those who think no one cares about any potential medical advance and all the “good stuff” is being swept under the rug only need to do some quick Google searches to see what’s really going on. Anything promising out there is being tested by reputable sources. Any results are being looked at and evaluated.
Yes. But again it’s something that may prompt people to think twice before getting the vaccine. A young person who knows others of the same age who have had Covid with no apparent complications, and then knows still others who experienced or were even hospitalized for heart inflammation after getting vaccinated, may well take chances with Covid over the vaccine! Does that decision contradict the data? Not exactly, because the data simply aren’t complete yet - not for young people or their parents, and not for the CDC. I am personally relieved about the CDC taking this seriously now. Anecdotally, it appears to be more common and in a wider age group than the news outlets are able to report at this time. Eventually we will know more, but in the meantime I do know a few who are not opting for vaccination precisely because of their personal knowledge of others who experienced chest pain and unexplained heart issues following the vaccine. If you say “But Covid is worse” they won’t necessarily agree because they have seen Covid or have experienced Covid without the same complications. The rationale is pretty simple: they don’t want to end up in the hospital with heart problems if they don’t have to.