I’m considering ED at Cornell, CMU or Vanderbilt engineering. I know CMU and Cornell has a much higher ranked engineering program, but many people told me that both schools are one of the most stressful schools in the nation, which is really making me reluctant to apply to either of the two schools. Vanderbilt, although it might not have the best engineering program, seemed like a more easygoing school with more out-of-school life. On the other hand, many people told me that engineering courses are almost equally stressful no matter what school/program I enroll in.
I would like to know:
- Internship opportunities at Vanderbilt Engineering?- When I visited Vanderbilt they told me their school of engineering has somewhere around 90+% hiring rate. However, is it possible to get good internships at Vanderbilt? I have heard that engineering companies/firms like to select students from their local area, and I am guessing not too many engineering-related internships are located in Nashville, Tennessee, which means I will have to apply to internships at Atlanta, NY (my area) or even some west coast cities. I would like to hear how well my Vanderbilt Engineering resume would compete against other top students from Berkeley/GT/UMich etc…
2.How is engineering at Vanderbilt viewed in the industry?- Since Vanderbilt is not the highest ranked engineering school I know, and it is located in Nashville, Tennessee, I have no idea how engineering degree from Vanderbilt would fare against CMU/Georgia Tech/UMich type of big city, highly ranked engineering schools. An engineer who visited my school said that they like to select students form local area schools, and Vanderbilt is in Nashville, and I am not so sure if I want a job in Tennessee.
- Is Vanderbilt Engineering Stressful? Also, I heard that they do not offer Co-op programs, which i have no idea what that means.
^Co-op = Internship
“engineering courses are almost equally stressful no matter what school/program I enroll in.” There is no “easy” engineering programs
Co-op is like a longer internship that takes a semester rather than just a summer. Vandy will help u wit internships but not co-ops
My son just went through the same decision process, picked UMich over Vanderbilt, GT, and Rice and Alabama. No engineering program is easy but the very best ones have smarter students, more clubs and projects, and excellent internship and placement opportunities. His cousin goes to Caltech, and the internships are pretty amazing ($5K+/mo) there.
When touring , we were not as impressed with engineering at Vanderbilt compared to UMich and GT. There was a huge difference in the quality of student projects, support for engineering students (this is very important!), research opportunities, and industry connections. I would say that the classes are not much different at any of the universities on the undergrad level, but research quality and scope is a lot different. The type of universities are different too: Vandy, Rice, etc are small, intimate environments with small class sizes, the big publics have more of everything but you have to work to find what you want.
He didn’t apply to Caltech, CMU, or MIT because of the high stress level of the students.
I would apply to a variety of them and see where you are admitted. Cost is also a huge factor, you may get scholarships or better FA at some of them. Your perspective may also change by admitted student days.
Vandy has a brand new engineering building opening this fall, I’d definitely check it out before making any decisions.
If it were me, I wouldn’t touch Cornell with a jousting pole. Just a personal preference, but the culture, the climate and the stress are not things I would even consider entering, especially ED. But don’t let me sway you - that’s just my take.
CMU is wonderful, as is Vanderbilt. Really, it is less about the program than what you do there. If this were a question of MIT/Caltech/Stanford vs. Vanderbilt, no question you should choose the first three. However, I really think Vanderbilt’s engineering program is growing and getting better every year, as is the reputation the university has worldwide, which brings with it more recruitment and internship opportunities.
I think you absolutely have to visit and see what is the better fit. STAY OFF US NEWS OR ANY OTHER RANKING SYSTEM!! I can’t STAND us news, and there are worse still. I could construct a college ranking for you that puts your local community college ahead of Stanford if I wanted to, simply by the methodology. If you want a reputable ranking system that I agree with, consider Forbes or QS, although I don’t like that international students and faculty are considered markers of high quality (essentially like saying the students can’t speak English, but that’s okay because neither can the faculty!) Do not rank your way into a decision. Research, network with professors to get information, really explore to see what is best for you. You may find you love all three or none. But it is vital that you do your homework on this.
My son had to choose between Vanderbilt and State Flagship for engineering. Flagship was ranked higher because Flagship received twice as much grant money for research. However, the rankings were based on the graduate engineering programs, and Flagship had 4 times as many grad students as Vandy. So Vandy actually had twice as much money per student.
It’s just a reminder to look beyond rankings. Vandy has a lot to offer its students besides engineering. For an undergraduate, I think one of the most important things is the academic advising, which isn’t a ranking factor.
@Checkbook : With engineering and STEM, my best advice is to actually sit in on some of the actual engineering courses and some of the weedout STEM courses when you visit, especially if the two options are generally perceived as good (and in such a case, generally the students will be excellent. Engineering programs at excellent schools and excellent engineering programs at even less prestigious schools get first pick at the best test takers). In STEM, persistence is a big thing that many schools (even, if not especially, elite private and publics), and teaching in some of those key courses that freshman and sophomore STEM majors take can make or break someone’s decision to persist regardless of how “smart” they are and how well they tested in HS and on standardized tests. Good STEM programs are essentially designed to “beat” those students. The question should always be, which one has the type of instructors/instruction that will promote how levels of success, both that and the support services and community among engineers can make a difference that goes beyond rankings and spending per student. Certain programs at some schools are generally just more “edgy” than others and has had noticeable effects on persistence despite the coursework being extremely intense.
For example, at Georgia Tech’s BME program, the PBL model dominates almost all of the courses and if you attend such a course, you find out it isn’t merely a gimmick. With engineering, I would never “Willy Nilly” choose a program based on rankings or money/student…would try to experience it beyond the marketing first because schools will go as far as even painting the experience of engineering and pre-med students as all roses. Another example is the University of Maryland College Park (I think that’s the Honors College), which from what I seen, looks better than many elite publics and private for STEM yet I am willing to bet they are not as rich as many of the other, perhaps more highly ranked places. They simply invested a lot in getting the education part right (through HHMI and other grants). At many schools, the per capita expenses go more so toward things like research, facilities and amenities and lesser the teaching mission which is a sensitive thing when it comes to STEM persistence (hence all the movements to change it at many places…of which public schools are generally on the forefront).
My older son graduated from Vanderbilt Engineering in 2010. His major was mechanical. He is quite math-science oriented and didn’t seem too stressed. He has been working for an oil and gas company in Houston since graduation and designs connections for fracking equipment. Although not as tough as Cornell, he was well prepared for his first job and passed the engineering intern exam at the end of senior year with minimal preparation. He loved Nashville and being at Vanderbilt.
Our younger son graduated from Cornell Engineering in 2015 with a B.S. in operations research and minor in business. What a fabulous combination! he finished second in his high school class and had all the appropriate test scores and activities like football and lacrosse. He was admitted ED. I can tell you that Cornell was extremely stressful, and he wasn’t even in the toughest engineering field. He said that missing a class was hard to make up. The other students at Cornell are very bright and that’s what makes it so tough. The TA’s are helpful and approachable and the professors are good, but students have to make it happen. I heard the average GPA for Cornell Engineering is 2.7. Our son finished with a 3.3. He is working as a financial analyst for a software company in Houston and loves it.
All in all, I felt that the Cornell engineering is something he will have forever. It’s definitely something to be proud of. He loved his business minor and often commented on how easy the classes were compared to engineering. I’m really glad he chose that, but I’m glad it’s done. He was also admitted to Michigan, GT, Notre Dame EA. We are from Virginia and he would have looked at UVA or Va Tech had he not gotten in to Cornell ED.
@Swimmer726 : Technically both student bodies are extremely bright and in fact, Vanderbilt students perform better(much) on standardized exams. I just suspect that Cornell has STEM programs that are more traditionally “elite” (as in they fit the stereotype of the weedout culture seen in STEM at elite publics and privates, where material tested in whatever way exceeds the level directly taught in class) and also have a monopoly on students who have been already extremely involved with STEM beyond HS grades and test scores (as do many places who are pre-dominantly STEM institutions or have more renowned engineering and/or STEM programs) and that is what makes the difference in competition. However, STEM at Cornell is like it is at a lot of other places (but some places have more generous curves than others. Cornell’s curves are more traditional I suppose, and thus grades end up looking like those at schools with lower level of grade inflation like Vanderbilt, Chicago, JHU, Emory, and a few others that are still under 3.45 average GPA or even still in the 3.3 range). They design assignments and exams that actually challenge MOST of the students, and then they curve to some mean (often B-, 2.7).
Even those at the top will likely sweat during an exam and the highest score will often not be in the 90s (or there will only be like 2-3 data points above 90 in another class). Many Vanderbilt STEM courses seem like they tend to aim for students stronger than those at “not competitive” schools (because the course is generally at a higher level), but ultimately the center of that pack such that exams and assignments do not end up curved (exams typically more “fair” versus material covered, even if it is a lot of material) but just automatically land at some target average (typically B-/B, so often non-engineering courses I’ve seen have tests with means between like 77-80 or 80-85). Students do tend to find the Cornell situation stressful and studies on that type of curve grading clearly reveal why. They find that when you give difficult (70-75 average) or very difficult (below 70) exams for a very selective crowd (as all selective privates have) that the correlation between the amount of work put into studying vs. the outcome diminishes. You must a) figure out how to study optimally for those types of exams (very tricky because they likely throw like 20-30 or more points of curveballs to yield such averages) or just be talented in the subject area to achieve consistency in performances. The difficult/very difficult situation does happen at Vanderbilt with some STEM professors I came across, but it overall didn’t appear as main-staple as it is at peer schools where low averages seem more common
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