Vanderbilt vs. Duke vs. Penn

<p>Vanderbilt has quickly closed the gap with Duke, and will very likely surpass Duke in the future. Vanderbilt has all of the intangibles over Duke (e.g. nicer campus, better location, etc). When the gap was wider between the schools, students had the tendency to overlook Duke’s unfortunate location of Durham due to prestige. Thankfully, elite students have realized they can have the same top-notch academics, but in a fun and exciting city like Nashville. </p>

<p>All the top universities are holistic and seek to build each class. Academics alone will not get you in the most selective U’s. They may place more or less weight in different areas but they all have the luxury of selecting which top academic students they want. Vandy didn’t all of the sudden start to care more about SAT’s and the other top 20’s didn’t stop using test scores. So why have the scores skyrocketed at Vandy? Why are more top students selecting Vandy? These things don’t randomly just happen. Something great is happening there. High school students should take a close look at VU and see why.</p>

<p>Top students in 2014 are looking at colleges holistically and they have the luxury of selecting which university to attend. Academics alone will not attract the best students. Students today want a university that can offer more than only academics. VU gets it. </p>

<p>Thanks to the ■■■■■ @alicejohnson aka @supernova123 ( who has been banned again I think) we got some good discussion on this topic. Great comments from @oliver007 and @faline2 both of whom seem to have BOTH duke and Vandy connections</p>

<p>ennisthemenace – I don’t think I need to say it, as others before me have already pointed it out, but you have absolutely no way of supporting a statement like that. </p>

<p>What do you hope to gain by posting in this thread? You’ve failed to effectively substantiate any of your claims. Do you really think any student smart and conscientious enough to be in the position of choosing between schools like Vanderbilt and Duke is going to even consider any of what you’ve said?</p>

<p>

Not true at all, Duke is better represented than Vandy at every elite professional program and fellowship competition. Just because Vandy, Duke, and Stanford all have the same range of test scores, that doesn’t mean these schools have similar undergraduate reputations because they don’t.</p>

<p>@ennisthemenace, you continue to vaguely cite statistics that are based on the Vanderbilt of 5, 10 or 20 years ago. I nor anyone else doubts that Duke was a significantly better school 5, 10, or 20 years ago. Now, the gap is small, and these other statistics will soon catch up with the quality of the new student body. While Duke may maintain a slight edge academically, there are many factors that would make a student pick Vandy over Duke. I think we’re all beating a dead horse at this point.</p>

<p>Though I did get a good laugh about the poster mocking Vandy’s dorms compared to Duke’s. That has to be a joke, right? Either way, I was amused. </p>

<p>@ennisthemenace‌ “I just don’t understand why anyone would pick Vandy over Duke”</p>

<p>My son chose Vandy over Duke. He loved Nashville (and the weather.) He liked the social vibrancy on campus. He liked Vandy’s undergrad focus. He liked Vandy’s curriculum in his major better. In engineering, Vandy is generous with AP credits which allows one to get a masters in their fourth year. Vandy was less expensive and not qualitatively different. He didn’t get caught up in rankings. He chose based on where he wanted to spend 4 years. He had a harder time giving up Carnegie a Mellon SCS since it would definitely open up doors in his field, but the cost would have been too much of a gamble. He had an amazing first year experience…it would not have been the same anywhere else. He is a brilliant kid and feels challenged and average at Vandy. He and his fellow students, like pancaked, are the future alumni base of Vandy. They will leave loving their four years at Vandy and eager to help out future graduates. </p>

<p>Also, S had the option of staying in Nashville this summer and doing research or a nicely paid internship…as a rising sophomore. </p>

<p>

I’m glad to hear that your son enjoyed his freshman year at Vandy. The cost is a definite issue if Vandy was the cheapest of the bunch and the option to receive a masters in the 4th year sounds pretty intriguing. I’m glad to hear that S is flourishing.</p>

<p>

That’s what Wash U has been saying for a decade now and their undergraduate job recruiting hasn’t improved for their graduates nor have their law school and biz school admission results been any better. Reputation takes a lot of time to develop and do you think schools like Duke and Penn are resting on their laurels? They are rapidly improving as well by hiring more prominent faculty, improving their student body quality, and enhancing the undergraduate social experience.</p>

<p>Duke will be establishing a Residential System like Yale which will blow Vandy’s Commons out of the water.</p>

<p>In 1992, UPenn had an acceptance rate of 40% and was largely considered the doormat Ivy (less selective than Cornell). The very fact that you are unaware of how rapidly Penn has improved contradicts your argument. </p>

<p>Also, your history of universities is completely skewed. In the 1960s, Vanderbilt and Duke had comparable acceptable rates/test scores. Both schools have ALWAYS been prestigious in the south. However, Duke (likely due to being in the ACC and not the SEC) diversified geographically at a faster rate (having a successful basketball team likely didn’t hurt). </p>

<p>However, Vanderbilt is on the same upward trajectory as Duke. The student bodies are comparable and Vanderbilt has been able to attract elite banks/consulting firms on campus. I believe since Vanderbilt is in a much better location, it is destined to surpass Duke. </p>

<p>WashU is not a fair comparison. Duke and Vanderbilt are both in high profile sports conferences which help name recognition. Vanderbilt also has the benefit of being in one of the hottest cities in America. </p>

<p>I need some help. Daughter accepted into Vandy. Got the Chancellors scholarship. Interested in Pre-med related majors. Has visited Vandy twice. DS is also accepted into Duke. Visited Duke twice. Latest during the BDD weekend. Came back and told me she LOVES Duke. Her reaction was very subdued after the MOSAIC weekend ( no enthusiasm - maybe visiting during the MOSAIC was a mistake). Said something like didn’t see Vandy as intellectual ( please don’t chide her on this, I know it is not true ) There is no chance of Financial aid from Duke where as Vandy has the National Merit and Chancellor’s scholarship. As a dad I am torn between sending to Duke vs Vandy. Based on @pancaked @faline2 and few other stalwarts here i know both are good schools and Vandy being on the uptrend. I can afford to pay for Duke but that also means I will not able to pay for her grad school or med school. My intention was to help her with post grad education. I am in pain trying to decide between Vandy and Duke. If you were in my situation what would you do?. I apologize to OP but I thought since this was Duke Vs Vandy thread I would post it here instead of starting a new thread. Thanks</p>

<p>Here’s a NYTimes article that profiled a student choosing between Duke, Vanderbilt, and Yale. </p>

<p><a href=“Vanderbilt Tops Yale, in a Squeaker - The New York Times”>http://thechoice.blogs.nytimes.com/2010/04/30/envelope-greshko-5/&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;

<p>@lovingasiandad - Is another trip to Vandy possible? Make appointments to meet with an advisor. Walk the campus and the town one more time. Unfortunately classes are over for the semester otherwise I’d have her do Dore for Day. Have her create the pro’s and con’s for each school. Since you can send her to Duke financially, it should come down to her decision. She has too excellent choices.</p>

<p>That’s a tough situation @lovingasiandad . Maybe make a new topic and see if other parents will weigh in.</p>

<p>Vanderbilt is cheaper than Duke? That is startling news to me! I doubt it. In fact, it is not true at all.</p>

<p>asiandad: Time to have a mature talk with your daughter! Don’t blow the chance to get a cheaper education at VU which is just as good as Duke. She cannot afford the luxury of passing this up and then getting into a financial jam for grad/med school. Believe me, when the teenage fixation with a vaporous aura of a school’s “prestige” wears off, she will regret it tremendously if she passes up the scholarship at VU. You need to persuade her constructively! This is not a matter for immature dithering. There should be exactly ZERO indecision on this point. A total no-brainer!</p>

<p>ennisthemenace: While almost every other poster here argues that VU and Duke are comparable, you alone have the compulsion to resort to hyperbole, and disproportionate statements (in favour of Duke) which do nothing but drain your position of credibility. Duke “blow VU out of the water” in anything??? On what planet? Get a grip! Your views are entertaining and risible, but really, get a grip.</p>

<p>Perhaps mommydearest’s child got financial aid at VU, thus making it “cheaper”?</p>

<p>loving asian dad, my Vandy son let go of 2 private full pay colleges he felt great affinity with. However, he took a great deal of pride in being a Chancellor’s scholar at Vanderbilt all four years. He knew he wanted to go to law school (which could cost 70 grand times three)…post recession, lousy job market, loan payments…he made the decision for Vandy. With gratitude. The whole time he was there he felt wanted, chosen, and encouraged to contribute in a way that fulfilled the promise the committee saw in him when he was in high school. Our flagship college of University of Virginia Law does not consider Vandy son to be financially emancipated till he is over 26. He is working for at least two years. But his pathway is definitely a high loan grad school. </p>

<p>We paid full freight to Duke for our first born. He loved the place, the sports and his friends. In what I refer to jokingly as the “We want to give our son a Pony” mentality, we were a bit delirious. He worked so hard! He was such a trooper! We had such fun touring colleges! in denial re graduate school actual costs.</p>

<p>Our parents had nothing to do with our own graduate degrees. We owed 10 thousand dollars, not 20 times 10 thousand. You hear a lot of people say things like “graduate school is On Them!” Yes, for some pathways. Fellowships in the hard sciences are out there for those who excel. Duke son will work full time and go to night school. But overall, the costs have inflated beyond the understanding of the grandparents or your friends. </p>

<p>Sit down and do the math with your daughter on two or three different med schools, assuming that she can borrow most of the tuition. Calculate the monthly payments. Your girl will need a car, a safe apartment, health insurance, a week or two off here and there, plane tickets, a phone, cable, computers, books. </p>

<p>I am sympathetic to your daughter’s being thrilled with her Blue Devil Day lookabout and re being less excited about her Mosaic Weekend. These things can be very ephemeral, and based on the most slight and irrational encounters. Duke son was indifferent to Duke–figured he would not be admitted. When he went to Blue Devil Day he had a negative experience. Pouring rain. The staff in the admissions building seemed a bit frantic. Each other prospie got “picked up” by a host. As darkness fell, a very strange young man appeared (obviously under duress), took him to the shuttle bus and off for an overnight at Duke main campus. He told our son that his frat put his name in to take a Prefrosh as a Joke. Then he dumped our high school senior and said he would be back about three in the morning…didn’t even leave him a key to his room. Son wandered off via shuttle to Baldwin on the freshman campus and attended the last Duke Symphony performance of the year. There he observed a community of musicians that would join.
I will never forget how he immediately bonded with the men and women in his freshman dorm, the praise for his teachers…Blue Devil Days forgotten. I believe this phenomenon could work out for your daughter as well if she picks her full tuition offer–ie her lukewarm Mosaic event fading into past experience. I honestly believe that Vanderbilt offers a magnificent premed program with a great overall undergraduate experience.
One of my best friends has a wonderful girl dead set on med school…a real vocation since her teens. Her dream had always been Harvard, and her Harvard visit was her favorite. She was the 1st person from her high school to be admitted there. No aid. She took a full ride to a top LAC. The pressure put on her family to send her to Harvard was intense! by disappointed guidance counselors, well meaning friends, the local Harvard alum who interviewed her. She is a junior in college now and her parents have spent less than 100 dollars. This school is sending her abroad to interview for sought after post-undergrad research jobs. She has a 4.0 in sciences. She went abroad for a semester. She is active in the arts on campus; she has dear friends. Every summer she has paid research jobs. I watched her a month ago taking around the high school senior finalists for her scholarship. What self esteem she has for having paid her own way! Her parents are making plans to find redirect their money to back her in medical school, to help reduce her loan burden. I am sure she will apply to Ivies again. But she may again choose the best med school/plus financial fit. It won’t hurt to be the recipient of a full ride on her applications to med school. Your daughter received an offer given to less than 1% of admitted students at Vanderbilt.<br>
Google Curmudgeon on the CC boards. He is an amusing writer and something of an expert on med school applications here. His daughter took a full ride to Rhodes College and turned down Yale undergrad a few years ago. She is currently at Yale Med School but she had many offers of admission to other fine medical schools. Definitely encourage your daughter to read that storyline. Yale Med School is not free tuition, nor was it her least expensive admission. But she was freer to choose due to her undergraduate decision. Regardless, good luck and congrats on her happy April whichever way things shake out.</p>

<p>@faline2, thank you for detailing your and other families choice making journeys. DS is currently in the similar position trying to make his decision and your stories are helpful confirmation for us.</p>