Vanderbilt vs MIT/Duke??

<p>I need help!!
I've been reading numerous Vanderbilt vs.... threads, but none of them are really similar to my situation.
I have been selected for the Cornelius Vanderbilt scholarship in the school of engineering, but I have also been accepted to MIT and Duke (and waiting to hear about HYP). I am majoring in mathematics and computer science but I am interested in public health (getting an mph or phd in biostatistics) I'm also a finalist for a Duke scholarship but I don't have that good of a shot.. I would be paying full price for any of the five.
I have been reading about Vanderbilt on this forum and other forums and I am really concerned. I know there have been numerous threads on the subject, and macaroni has brought up some points that are somewhat terrifying for me.
I'm black, and I'm concerned about the atmosphere at Vanderbilt.
And how do I find out if I would fit in at Vandy?? There are no overnights and I feel as though there are no opportunities to REALLY see the school.
I am very concerned about going to Vandy and being ostracized and unhappy. I've read it is like high school, with lots of cliques and cattiness?
I do party (not every weekend but occasionally, and prob more in college). I want to have a fun college experience, and I like having very close friends rather than tons of friends. I want to DATE. And I don't know how the dating scene is at Vandy, especially for minorities. My dad said to beware of the good ol' boy network at vanderbilt. I just don't know what to do!</p>

<p>I apologize for the long post. Basically, should I go with low fit and money? Or a better fit, and debt??</p>

<p>Getting a Vanderbilt education at no charge is an amazing opportunity. That said, I’ve got to believe the MIT degree brings with it specific opportunities just because of the name. Would you get any aid there at all? If not, I’d say go with Vandy.
It’s not that what’s being posted on the other thread about social issues has no validity–some of the points made are accurate. But you are clearly a focused and ambitious student and I’m sure you’ll do well and have a good experience wherever you go.
I would not choose Duke at any cost over Vandy at no cost.</p>

<p>My son is a cs and math major in engineering with the same scholarship. I can’t say anything about the public health slant as it relates to engineering students, because that is not one of his interests. He had a lot of options, also, and he would have been full pay, also.</p>

<p>His experience has been very good. Academically, one of the attractions of VUSE is that cs majors can use a lot of their AP credits and previous univ. courses (if they have them) to fulfill intro requirements, allowing them to move ahead in their fields, and add a second major (such as math) and/or an unrelated minor. A few are given the go-ahead to pursue a masters simultaneously, as is the case with my son. So, on VUs dime, he will finish in four years with BS in cs and math, and MS in cs. </p>

<p>He has had plenty of paid research opps (both school-year and summer), and has several peer-reviewed publications, including one on which he is the first author, leading to experience speaking at a national conference. The research experience led to a good internship and he had a high-paying job offer before the start of his senior year. His adviser probably would have been happier to see him go directly for a PhD at a top school, but he is postponing it for a year or so. </p>

<p>As for the social milieu, that is a great big can of worms, and the reason I swore off this site last night. I don’t know why I even looked at it today, but this will probably be it. Please don’t decide which college you are going to attend on the basis of posts from unhappy people you have never met, whom you know nothing about other than what they have told you, and are majoring in a completely different subject in a different college. The engineering school has a different group of students, with different interests, different background, less Greek participation, and a different set of activities. It probably does not have a larger group of black students, but I feel fairly confident that the overall racial/cultural/ethnic diversity is greater than Peabody and CAS.</p>

<p>Nobody on this site can give you the kind of information you want, because you don’t know who it is coming from, because it is not from a reliable cross-section of the student body, and some of it is just plain fraudulent (kids pretending to be students who are not–I’m not referring to the recent thread you alluded to, here).</p>

<p>I really encourage you to attend the accepted student day event. Of all the accepted student and related events my son attended at a variety of unis, the one VUSE offered was by far the most informative. Faculty, dean and students were available for quizzing. There were Q and A sessions for scholarship awardees. </p>

<p>If there is any way to extend your visit and set up private meetings with faculty, and arrange to sit it on classes, do so. The administration of VUSE is very undergraduate oriented, very accessible, and in our experience, very straightforward with their information. </p>

<p>While there are not official overnight events, you might want to ask the engineering undergraduate program director to provide you with the name of a student whom you can contact. Since many of your questions are social-life related, ask them to find you a student who can directly relate to your concerns.</p>

<p>You probably already know this, but Vanderbilt’s engineering program is not the same as MITs. You may be substituting–at the intro level, at least–a certain amount of killer rigor for flexibility in course selection and room in your schedule for other interests. In my son’s case, the freedom to move on at his own pace, take advanced courses in cross-listed courses in econ and cognitive psych (AI-related), and pursue a humanities minor were quite valuable.</p>

<p>And unless your parents are really, really well-off, the financial advantages of this offer should be obvious. My kid is graduating debt-free, all college savings still in the bank, and a pretty swollen bank account because he had paid, interesting, research positions t/o undergraduate years. Now, none of that is worth it if you are miserable, which is why he made two trips before accepting the offer, talked to faculty, sat in on classes, hung around, etc. </p>

<p>He isn’t a racial minority, however, and he already had a gf who transferred to VU as a sophomore, so the dating question didn’t really come up. This is a major offer and I suggest you really try to do it justice and make a personal visit. No regrets in our case–but you are you.</p>

<p>I wish you the best of luck in your decision and your future. If you have some questions that I may/may not be able to address, send me a PM. I’ll keep logging in for a little while to check.</p>

<p>You would be crazy to shy away from Vandy based on Macaroni’s post - especially in light of the CV scholarship. Vandy is a great school. My daughter is a student there along with a good friend of hers who is also black and both are very happy there. I am surprised that you are not attending the Mosaic weekend - it would be a great opportunity to see for yourself.</p>

<p>midmo! thank you so much for your well-thought out post. There are so many aspects of Vanderbilt that I find pretty great. It was awesome to hear about your son’s experiences in the engineering school. Did he find the math classes clear? Did he have large classes? There were some negative posts on these aspects at one point… I may simply PM you these questions… not sure if you are coming back here.
I think it would benefit my own personality to be a scholar at a college. I feel this in itself would open up opportunities. Also, I want to have fun in college. I’m hardworking, but I have my moments. I’m not looking for an overly intellectual environment, but friendliness and a tight-knit community is incredibly important to me. I’m babbling a bit.</p>

<p>Anyway, @kreativekat, I had been hoping and hoping to get invited to MOSAIC, but alas, I was not :(.</p>

<p>^^^I sent you a private message. Feel free to send a PM with any other questions.</p>

<p>writer girl, we had a “favorite child” on this thread way back in 2004-5 when he was a senior in hs…he was from California and had an easy admittance into Berkeley, was admitted to Yale and had the CV to Vanderbilt engineering. </p>

<p>Midmo, frazzled1…help me out–with his ID so she can read his old threads…on the tip of my aging brain. What a charming person he was. He didn’t know much about southern states and I will also remind you that Vanderbilt was getting only 11 thousand applicants compared to this year’s 25 thousand and Vanderbilt was more regional just that many years ago compared to today. Anyway, he took the CV, and like Midmo’s son --he turned this into a golden masters degree, he loved the faculty and loved his friends and last we heard was back on the west coast working for Google. Like I said he had a lot of positive energy.</p>

<p>You should of course wait things out and look at your offers. My 05 high school son went to Duke and his friends all landed good jobs in a major recession but when he visits his brother in Nashville, he is a little jealous of the town gown setting. Nashville is just soo much more fun as a city than Durham IMHO. </p>

<p>Vanderbilt is a major player in health care so do not underestimate how many good choices you would have for minors at Vandy. </p>

<p>The best way for you to feel it out is to visit your top two colleges in April. My Vandy '13 son is incredibly fulfilled on an intellectual level in his Vandy classes, has garnered quite a bit of faculty support re internships, has tons of friends, has to work very hard for his grades and has a hard time giving up the many extra curriculars he likes to do daily, he takes full advantage of the cultural offerings at Vandy and in Nashville, plays some ball and runs, and has nothing to do with the Greek scene unless a really nice girl asks him to escort her to a party, which he has been known to do happily.
Oh and he lives with students from many backgrounds racially, religiously, politically and geographically but I won’t go into that out of some respect for his anonymity.<br>
His politics are very liberal. </p>

<p>There are under 7000 undergraduates at Vanderbilt and their retention rate is very high. There is nothing wrong with choosing a different culture and college life halfway through if you need to do so for your own well being, like macaroni, who I remember well when she was still in high school and so pleased with her Vandy acceptance, dealing with illness and loss at home and later when she was online on this site promoting Greek life as a newish Vandy student. I considered exiting my undergrad school at this same juncture and it can be the right thing to do. Macoroni has every right to change her mind about everything and to change her environment. I think a few of her statements were unfair, not at all true for many students and provocative but sometimes a change can make a difference and I agree that other campuses have different cultures…Macaroni, I hope your final two years of undergraduate studies take place in a community that just sings for you. There are definitely aspects of Vanderbilt that jar on the nerves of my kid and myself at times. But the undergrad college has changed so much in the last five years. </p>

<p>I have an eldest son who went Greek at Duke and I can see that this was the right path for him. At Vandy there is a choice to create your own happiness and reality always. If you conduct your life in the 50% no sorority and 60% no frat scenes you don’t really have to be referencing the Greek scene all that much in your Vandy life. You don’t really have to spend time with people who are deluded and self important. I thought the beer cans covering the lawns on frat row on Easter Sunday a couple of years ago on our final visit were off putting to say the least but not a deal breaker at all. I don’t exactly like what the grounds under the tent city for basketball games at Duke looks like when they take the tents down either but I still love many aspects of Duke and do not think that some students who are spoiled/deluded/tacky/entitled/disrespectful are a reflection on my son or on the whole student body.</p>

<p>No college has it all and every college has what Hunt is describing. The X factor that gets rehashed over and over. Is the Univ of Chicago the place where fun goes to die? Is Swarthmore deadly serious? Is UVA full of die hard Frat and Sorority kids? Can Wash and Lee deliver a well balanced grad when it is so Greek? Is there no school spirit at Emory? </p>

<p>You haven’t lived through anything if you didn’t have a son matriculate to Duke the year of the Lacrosse scandal if you want to talk about Distortions published on this site. </p>

<p>Personally, I adore UVA, find Washington and Lee’s campus to be breathtaking, get a thrill out of Duke and revere Emory, a place where I once had nearby job. I also think Swarthmore is a national treasure. Oh…and Vanderbilt, while probably too Greek in some respects for my personal outlook, is a wonderful place in a really welcoming and enjoyable city. </p>

<p>You will figure it out re where you belong when all your offers are before you and you can visit the top two in April. </p>

<p>Regardless, enjoy visiting Vanderbilt and be proud at the amazing way you have been sought after. Less than 1% of the almost 25 thousand 18 year olds who will be opening Vanderbilt envelopes this year have the invitation you have received. Celebrate your invitation and give Vandy a serious lookover.</p>

<p>Evil Robot…or was it EvilRobot…google or search for his ID on this old site…that was his name…the guy who took the engineering CV and turned down Yale–just came back to me.</p>

<p>No need to link… I’ve been reading and rereading his posts almost religiously since I got the news!
I apologize Faline2, I PMed you before I saw this message.
The only issue is, I think I might want to join a sorority, but I’m not sure. So the prevalence of greek life may either be a huge problem or a nonissue…
I’m not even sure if Vanderbilt sororities (traditional ones) pick african american pledges?
There are so many things to consider</p>

<p>My son is a Chancellor’s Scholar. When and if you come to campus let me know and he will gladly introduce you to his African American friends and to girls in sororities and out of them so you can chat them up. Obviously there are great people in and out of Greek life. Because half the girls do pledge, no matter what else you do on campus, there will be independent and Greek kids working on the same projects…Alternative Spring Break for instance is a fun way to make 12 new friends every spring break and Greeks and non Greeks work together on sites. Ditto the paper, the band, myriads of clubs. You will feel better talking to current students while assessing your happiness quotient with Vandy.</p>

<p>I am aware of a few African American girls who pledged Panhellenic sororities while my D was at Vandy. D and frazzled1’s D are part of the same pledge class and I’m aware of a girl who was bisexual in that group and who was well accepted. Both my kids have very dear Jewish friends who loved their Vandy experience and who likely will be connected to them throughout life after college. I’m not doubting macaroni’s experience and I feel sorry for her that her college experience hasn’t played out like she had hoped. I’m just saying it’s not everyone’s experience. You have an awesome opportunity, writergrl - hope you can check it out on accepted students day in April.</p>

<p>My daughter was in a sorority (called “top tier” on CC) and graduated in 2007. African-American girls going through traditional rush were given the same consideration that all the other girls were - really. I can say this with absolute confidence. African American girls were in every group - they are welcomed as sisters, just like all the others. You will be fine! When they present you to the groups as a CV Scholar, that will be great and exciting. The girls will make every effort to get to know you. Sorority rush at Vanderbilt is fair, very fair. it’s the fraternity system that has major flaws. Be glad you’re a girl.</p>

<p>AHHHHHHHH! My son was also awarded the CV scholarship in engineering. I have been extremely concerned about how my nice, quirky kid would fit into this environment. Reading this thread I started feeling better–until I read the post above. Oh well…</p>

<p>Writergrl94–best of luck to you. You have terrific options! : )</p>

<p>? I’m confused about why post #11 would bother you.</p>

<p>FWIW, my son in engineering is also a nice, quirky kid. I hope you can make the Accepted Student Day, or visit on your own. You don’t really know anything about “this environment” based on what you read on this, or any, message board.</p>

<p>The downside of the “information” revolution. There is no message board god filling in with the back stories, supplying the missing pieces, exposing those with hidden agendas. Please check things out, carefully of course, for yourself.</p>

<p>And congratulations to your son–and to you.</p>

<p>midmo,
I thought the same thing, but I’m wondering if Cicada meant the thread above rather than the post above and if the macaroni thread may have been arranged above this one at the time.</p>

<p>^^Perhaps. Or maybe Cicada’s son is contemplating joining a fraternity, in which case the line about the fraternity system having major flaws is relevant. Since a minority of males join fraternities, and probably an even smaller minority of engineering males do, I tend not to think about the fraternity issue automatically.</p>

<p>Being a parent and going through the process is enlightening and educating. Here is what I have learned in a nutshell - (1) first decide which area you want to study, not specific major but broad based - like science, engineering, arts, etc. (2) choose the top schools that accepted you per their ranking (3) compare scholarships (4) compare statistics like (a) college visit experience (b) what do students do after finishing undergrad in your area of specialization? If they do higher studies where do they go? If they take up jobs what kind of firms hire them? If they switch fields what kid of area they move to? (c) diversity (d) city/location (e) etc. I would generally give very little priority to people’s opinion unless they are similar from all segments. Also, people who did not succeed well or do not have good academic results - I would give minimal importance under normal circumstances. </p>

<p>Now to the choices - MIT, Duke, Vandy - all are great schools. You want to major in areas like physics and engineering AND you have financial aids go to MIT. If you want to study bio sciences and engineering go to Vandy, etc. But, at an undergraduate level it is not wise to have a debt of a quarter of million dollars to go to a school unless your parents can easily afford it without loans. If you are ambitious and have enough steam you can always go to those schools and Ivy leagues for graduate degree. Bottom line - CV is a merit scholarship which in my opinion is prestigious and above all a top-20 school awarding you that to recognize your merit vs. some one asking you to pay a fortune for their name - really makes no sense. Just be within top 5% of your class at Vandy - world will be yours! Vandy also has sufficient diversity especially in engineering, medical and science streams compared to arts, peabody, music, etc. Students from over 100 countries come to Vandy. People may not know this, Math dept of Vandy now boasts of not one but, two Fields Medal winner professors - for those who do not know - Fields Medal is like Nobel Prize in Maths, in fact even harder - given once every 4 years and to exceptional geniuses in maths under age of 40! </p>

<p>Here are some more stats on Vandy - around 15% of the students are from TN. MOst of the 85% students from north and west. NY has I believe this year biggest rep. Vandy does an assessment on political outlook - and I guess liberal and conservative are 50-50 (you can check this public info with the admissions office). It is also one of the highest rated university from student’s satisfaction. Also, note the CV himself was a northerner who gave $1million to build this university in “south”! </p>

<p>I know quite a few who graduated from Vandy who are from diverse backgrounds - asian and latinos - they have excellent experience at Vandy.</p>

<p>So, my 2c, if MIT/ Harvard/ Duke/ Yale/ Cornell/ Columbia/ etc. pays you full tuition, go there. If not with CV scholarship - go to Vandy. </p>

<p>At the end - give more weight to statistics and facts than unknown people’s opinions (including mine:-) - good or bad. </p>

<p>Good Luck!</p>

1 Like

<p>What about Vandy or Duke both full pay for Pre-med?</p>

<p>I really like Vandy actually but Duke is an absolute powerhouse at sending students to medical school. The academic/research opportunities are probably a bit better at Duke with a top 5 medical school at your fingertips and access to more renowned faculty, especially if you major in Biology. Both schools offer a terrific undergraduate experience though so if you’re really leaning in one direction, trust your gut.</p>