<p>I heard somewhere that poverty is defined as under $30,000. </p>
<p>Where I live, $30,000 is a very reasonable income, by no means poverty. I'd say, here, that's probably around "middle class."</p>
<p>I think some of the new financial aid initiatives (esp at Harvard and Yale) are going to help the middle class substantially. Harvard's new rule is that a family making up to $180,000 only has to contribute 10% of their income to tuition.</p>
<p>Go to Harvard, Yale, or Penn and the middle-class problem of affording an education is solved.</p>
<p>^ right. Admission to HYP is sooo easy, right? Sooo many options for the "middle class" people...</p>
<p>Why would colleges need more white middle class students? You've seen one, you've seen them all. :)</p>
<p>"I heard somewhere that poverty is defined as under $30,000. " the national poverty line is $20,000 for a family with 2-4 kids. so yes, middle class gets royaly screwed.</p>
<p>
[quote]
Lower class: boost for first gen, low income, URMs
Upper class: Legacies, Development cases, prep schools=boost
(another point is that ivies are looking for future successes)
[/quote]
Over all I agree the claim. But I don't in general against the 'prep schools=boost'. People pay for the prep schools. In capitalist society money should be able to buy some thing. Rich (I mean really rich that they make money by money) pay for their kids to prep school, if their kids get the boost of prep school or sat class, fine, as long as they got the same stats (sat, gpa, etc.) as the general pool as applicants. </p>
<p>
[quote]
The evidence is overwhelming that the poorer the high school student, the less likely it is that the student will even start college, or go to a good college, or finish college.
[/quote]
Or how many of them really have the DESIRE to go to college? I've seen plenty of first generation very 'poorer' immigrant parents whose kids go to quite elite colleges with high stats. They have the 'DESIRE' (both parents and kids) they made it work.</p>
<p>
[quote]
Middle class has nothing to offer.
[/quote]
Yes, they do. [sar on] they responsible for the biggest portion of tax[sarc off].</p>
<p>yeah, college admissions (specifically college finance) is pretty rough for the middle class...</p>
<p>it's like, you're not poor enough to get a lot of financial aid, and you not rich enough to pay for it. </p>
<p>A student whose family makes 55,000 dollars a year would go to Harvard for free. A student whose family makes 150,000 can pay for Harvard without a lot of financial aid. </p>
<p>But a student whose family makes say, 65,000 is in really bad luck. They don't qualify for harvard's (or any colleges ) free tuition package (<60,000) and they definitely can't afford to pay with a lot a financial aid.</p>
<p>Wow...ok, now i'm just rambling.</p>
<p>anywho...paying for college is tough for the middle class.</p>
<p>^ I thought that Harvard's FA package for middle class families was a sliding scale up to 10 % of the family's income up to 180,000 dollars. So wouldn't a family making 65,000 pay less than 10% of their total income, or do I just not understand their FA initiative?</p>
<p>yeah they do. Maybe not as much as poor people, but they still have woes. So much money from the middle class goes to the poor. We all worked hard, and we all should keep what we got. And people need to shut up about poor people no having oppurtunities in America, cos this country has the most class mobility in the world. In the other countries things are so bad, yet many people can move up. </p>
<p>BTW, i have lived both the life of a poor person and an upper middle class person.</p>
<p>I agree with the OP's claim. The middle class does have it harder in the college process. </p>
<p>I think the financial aid packages to the poor are necessary else they wouldn't be able to pay for anything. The rich can afford to pay. But yah, middle class is pretty much left to themselves. And while some top schools offer incredible FA packages to the middle class, the Harvard and Equivalent admission rate is ridiculously small. Even if 20,000 middle class students manage to make it to top schools that would pay for them, there's a whole of them left out that didn't make it to those universities.</p>
<p>The problem is that being born 'middle class', you really have no clue what the poorer students have to go through. I am by no means poor, but to think that I have a disadvantage is ludicrous. It's several times harder for a poorer student to post similar stats to me, an average middle-class student. If they get anywhere near the same stats as me, they deserve admission over me. Think resources and opportunities here, what they have to go through, etc.</p>
<p>^ I agree. I go to a pretty ghetto school and when some of the kids accomplish stuff that's harder to accomplish because of their socioeconomic status, well, it's admirable.</p>
<p>yeah but going to ghetto schools means that it is probably easier to get a 4.0, even if there are no ap's. Colleges don't hold you accountable if your school suxs but you did well.</p>
<p>^ But if you're in extreme poverty, I would assume there's a lot more to worry about than getting a 4.0.</p>
<p>I'm sorry, but the idea of the middle-class having it harder than the poor or working-class is ignorant. How is it easier?</p>
<p>the idea is in college aid and paying for college. Not overall generally (which may be up for debate). Many colleges implement extensive financial aid for thoses uder 50,000 a year. If someone make like 70,000-80,000, they are screwed, cos financial aid usually suxs, and they still don't make enough to cover the expenses of a 200,000 dollar expensive education.
Really need more help for middle class adn upper middle class, since this is majority of america, and where most docotrs, engineers, teachers come out of. i guess i should get of my soap box huh?</p>
<p>
[quote]
The problem is that being born 'middle class', you really have no clue what the poorer students have to go through.
[/quote]
Not all 'middle class' being born as 'middle classe' some of us or their parents climbed out from the 'ghetto'.</p>
<p>
[quote]
It's several times harder for a poorer student to post similar stats to me, an average middle-class student. If they get anywhere near the same stats as me, they deserve admission over me.
[/quote]
Yeah, the key word is near/same the stats. I worked hard all my life to climbed out of the 'ghetto' so that my kid is able to go a better school district. There is no prep school, no sat prep for my kid. I believe fair competetion as much as work hard for your own luck......I'm not prepared to see we and our kids worked hard to climbed out of 'disadvantage' class, now been taken advantage by the 'disadvantage'. As A-Card posted:
[quote]
And people need to shut up about poor people no having oppurtunities in America, cos this country has the most class mobility in the world. In the other countries things are so bad, yet many people can move up.
[/quote]
I firmly believe one should learn to self help before ask for society help. And no other place like America provide the greate oppotunity for ppl to move up.</p>
<p>Execatly how long the AA has been applied in college admission? Check out these two threads. Not sure if this kid's dad got into ivy through AA. If yes. Then how many generations should be protected by AA?</p>
<p><a href="http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/princeton-university/443366-how-much-factor-race-princeton.html%5B/url%5D">http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/princeton-university/443366-how-much-factor-race-princeton.html</a>
<a href="http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/princeton-university/451916-chances-skyrocket-if-parent-gets-interviewer-position.html%5B/url%5D">http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/princeton-university/451916-chances-skyrocket-if-parent-gets-interviewer-position.html</a></p>
<p>The original idea of AA was to promot the disadvantages has had its positive effect for historical reasons. But after so many years of practice, got to the point that people acustom to hide behind it......Now you do start wondering if its good for advancing the society.</p>
<p>depends on what people are considering "middle class?" i saw a study that suggests that the term "middle class" is meaningless these days since a vast majority of people making $30,000 to almost 200k considered themselves "middle class." also, i think that the way this topic is phrased is a little insensitive. i think you should have geared it specifically towards paying for colleges but even that would be insensitive because all of the people i know who have gotten substantial FA to top schools still have to spend a lot of time working to buy books, clothes, food, etc. basically, i think that you should stop complaining and just be thankful that you have been presented with opportunities that many people in this world are less fortunate to have and would possibly "kill" (maybe even literally :P) for.</p>
<p>
[quote]
Yeah, the key word is near/same the stats. I worked hard all my life to climbed out of the 'ghetto' so that my kid is able to go a better school district. There is no prep school, no sat prep for my kid. I believe fair competetion as much as work hard for your own luck......I'm not prepared to see we and our kids worked hard to climbed out of 'disadvantage' class, now been taken advantage by the 'disadvantage'.
[/quote]
No worries there. The wealthier you are, the more resources you have, and the less you have to worry about. Chances are your upbringings and environment were much easier as were. A poorer student with the same stats as me is a significantly better achievement for him/her.</p>