My daughter is applying for classical vocal performance programs. Her first priority is to participate in the best choral groups, but she also loves doing musical theatre. I’m just wondering which schools of the ones she applied to below will allow opportunities for her to do some musical theatre. (She’s not applying to OCU or Westminster CC, so those schools aren’t possibilities). Here are the schools:
Oberlin
St Olaf
Lawrence Conservatory
USC
U of Texas, Austin
Luther College
Concordia College
Michigan (I know there’s no chance here)
IU (I assume not here either)
Millikin (ditto?)
Thanks!
Why no chance at UM and IU?
I’ll comment on a few schools as many are in my area. Plus my D auditioned for VP and MT (ultimately going the VP route).
LACs - flexible
St. Olaf - great choirs - you can do choir, solo work and musical theatre here.
Lawrence - great choirs, opera work and acting - I don’t believe they do much MT - I think it’s more operetta if lighter - but check their website.
Luther - great choirs and solo/opera work - MT? Hmmm haven’t heard much about it there.
Concordia - choirs - I believe they do a variety of music as well but I’m not as familiar with their program.
University Conservatories - not as flexible
IU (where my D attended) - Music (which includes choirs) and MT are separate schools. If you are in the Music school you will be placed in a choir - however IU is not known as a strong choir school. It’s not part of their mission/fabric like at St. Olaf.
At IU (and I would guess schools like Michigan and USC), it is difficult to cross over to MT. They are separate - and the schools do not make an attempt to work together. Note, however, one of the 6 “operas” that IU does annually now is shifting over to MT (since opera has to survive financially). Last year was South Pacific and this year is Oklahoma! While it will probably never be Rent, they have been doing some of the classics of MT. Mainly opera students are cast in this. So maybe an opportunity.
If you like IU your D can also check out the BSOF degree in the music dept. My D was able to put Theatre as her OF (outside field) and participate in Theatre and MT classes. My D did no MT productions as she was always in the operas. It’s one thing to take some classes (possible), it’s quite different to be in a production (nearly impossible due to ensemble and performance conflicts bx the 2 schools). Still my D enjoyed the extra training in acting and MT - and did do the MT junior showcase.
I would advise looking closely at each schools’ website and check out the productions for the year. Then call and ask how easily it is to do work in all areas. If they don’t have a straight-forward answer (meaning a “yea some students do a little MT, I think”) that’s probably a no. If they answer it very straight forward with examples then I would take them at their word. Most LACs know it’s a competitive advantage. It just depends a bit on who answer the phone.
Hope this helps you.
@bridgenail that’s extremely helpful! So IU’s choirs aren’t strong? That’s going to be a sticking point for my daughter, because that is her #1 passion. And IU was near the top of the list of what I thought would be a good fit for her. I have to admit I didn’t even research their choirs because I just assumed they’d be good. I looked at the BSOF, and I was concerned because it’s not a “BM” degree and it’s also not through Jacobs. Maybe those are non-issues; sounds like your daughter still got the normal BM performance education.
What about Michigan’s choirs? And Oberlin’s choirs?
Thanks again!
Oberlin’s VP department is more focused towards Opera Theater than Choir. The Collegium Musicum which focuses on Medieval and Renaissance music is exceptional, but I just don’t think that choir is as much of an emphasis at Oberlin as at other schools. The Americana singer Rhiannon Giddens who is also in the group Carolina Chocolate Drops came out of the opera theater program so one is certainly not tied to opera at Oberlin. But sorry I can’t pontificate on a large choir program because it simply is not there.
So it may be true that at UM a VP major will have trouble crossing over into the MT department however I just attended the musical “Spring Awakenings” last weekend at UM, put on by the student group MUSKET which I believe is not an official music school group. Many of the performers were music, theater and dance majors and the production was wonderful, performed at the Power center. Worth looking into because I think it is open to any UM student and I believe they do 2 productions a year.
BSOF is through Jacobs. It’s most popular for the OF to be arts administration or composition but theatre is another possibility. My D is in an MM program and during auditions it was never commented on that she had a BS from Jacobs as opposed to a BM. If you have more question on this PM me or go to the Jacobs school website under degrees and requirements to learn more.
As for choirs Oberlin and IU share the emphasis on opera as opposed to choirs. They focus on the soloist voice and not blending. Has your D talked with her teachers about her voice for choir work? My D was told not to do choir singing in high school but continued as her teacher guaranteed she wouldn’t be required to blend (so she could sing without damaging her voice). For some people this is an issue. For others it is not. Your D may be able to do both.
Like all things in music there is no easy answer. But IU is really focused on the soloist opera voice. It certainly does have “good” choirs but many freshman do not want to sing in choirs. They are looking to get into opera chorus and get on stage with full voice. I know at the grad level there are some good niche choirs but I don’t know how many undergrads participate in these. But my D paid little attn to the choirs. So you may want research them more to draw your own conclusions.
I do know a schol like St. Olaf is different in their emphasis. Choir is much more prominent. Lawrence also has a good mix of choir and opera work.
This is all really interesting. When my daughter first started private voice lessons a couple of years ago, her teacher spent A LOT of time “untraining” her choir voice. She had been in a high-level children’s choir for 6 years by then. I had forgotten that the two types of singing are somewhat incompatible because her latest voice teacher has never mentioned it to be an issue. She sings in two choirs in high school but she sings out because the sopranos are weak.
@bridgenail, we started everything too late to really make informed decisions. I just didn’t have time to research the nuances of the BSOF vs the BM, so I just played it safe. Plus we were running out of time because the deadlines were looming and decisions had to be made about the audition weekend and whether to spend time trying to do the videos for IU MT prescreening. I don’t know if they really explain the BSOF adequately on IU’s website, because I thought that she would still need to audition for the musical theater program and have to make the cut there in order to do the BSOF, but it sounds like your daughter just took MT courses and wasn’t really a part of the program. (?)
@cellomom2 that makes Michigan sound more appealing, as does what @bridgenail mentioned earlier about IU doing one golden age musical annually. Seems like there’ll be possibilities.
Choir is fun. But opera chorus at full voice with others at full voice is amazing. You have a good list of schools. Have her audition and see where she gets offers. That will help point the way. My D continued with some MT but her voice is suppose to be in opera and that’s what the auditions and undergrad work showed her.
@cellomom2 My DD’s voice teacher in college expressly forbid her to do outside performances unless she pre-cleared them for proper care of her voice. She was only allowed to do one that was written and directed by a composition student in the music school. So joining outside performaces may not be possible either. It is really something that needs to be addressed even at the professor level if the school does not have a known crossover history.
You guys are right. I’m thinking too much. It will all become clearer as she auditions/visits. All this info has been very helpful though–I know more what to expect. Choir may end up taking more of a backseat in the end.
Things can change dramatically from September to May. Let the process unfold and she will know what feels right ot her in the end. I think that keeping a lot of options open is best.
Yes my D only did MT and acting classes. She was in Jacobs. You can switch to a BSOF after acceptance. BUT it’s not necessary. It’s not common (most do BMs) but it worked for my D.
And Singermom07 is very right. The MT program did Spring Awakening my Ds soph year. She had done it at her high school. She wanted to do it but her teacher was not supportive. Then she was put in an opera chorus and that sunk her MT dreams. She was also unwilling to go against her teachers wishes. She would now totally agree that it was not a good move. But the adjustment to one form has been a process for her. But all is well that ends well.
@singersmom07 is dead on. To quote the good book: “and the first shall be the last”. For my D this is exactly what happened after both the undergrad and grad admissions process took place. Even though she had been admitted to all of her top choices the list inverted.Preconceived notions should be kept at bay. The best opportunities are never apparent until the very end of the process.
Well I’ve officially posted too much here. So have compassion for my weakness… Two more things:
We also experienced “and the first shall be last” effect both times too. The audition process is truly a learning experience. And student do get offers where they should. Just have faith in that.
And college is very different than high school for singers. In high school, my D could do it all. She felt very accomplished in MT, choir, acting and classical voice. But college is often a weaning process. The ability to be good in college in one genre takes another level of concentration, commitment and talent. The teacher will lead your D through this process.
All you need to do is get her to the auditions, stand aside and let the experience unfold.
Well no worries–I have appreciated every contribution to this thread. 
originally my D was going to apply to some music theatre programs too, but we found it it just was too much pressure for her to try and work up musical theatre repertoire as well as classical repertoire and prepare good quality prescreens. Her acting is great, her dancing is fine–she is definitely better than average and memorizes dance routines quickly. The sticking point was always doing the newer musical theatre selection, because she has no training in “belting.” The closest she can come to more modern repertoire is something like Sondheim (e.g. on the steps of the palace.) She does the “talky” singing very well. She may be capable of belting, but I don’t know if she’ll ever get the opportunity to get the training she needs.