<p>I think the OP is on to something, but I would say that character, contribution, and self-sacrifice are the most important signs of success in life.</p>
<p>So, clearly, the military academies should be at the top of the list.</p>
<p>Hunt- That doesn’t work because inherent in military personnel’s work is complicity in the oppression of others, which sometimes (often?) breaches ethics. You only cheer for one side, but did you ever think what if you happened to be the father/mother of that child (and you are all innocent) who just happens to be collateral damage from bombing raids and whatnot in a war that the US started arbitrarily? To completely overlook those things as an act of murder because you’re so focused on your side is selfish. Now, I know this story is more complicated and clearly military personnel have their own ethics but sometimes they don’t have a choice.</p>
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<p>I was talking to midmo.</p>
<p>And oh please, nearly every parent on here has said in one way or another “You can be successful coming out of a state school” and CLEARLY defined success in terms of having a good job afterwards. You can say that but then expound on the opportunities they were able to take advantage of and their personal development as a result.</p>
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<p>I feel bad for saying this but I think these problems can be prevented if parents who are not financially stable or don’t foresee being financially stable in the coming decades would not have children. I think it’s irresponsible to have children when you will disadvantage them in life/when the parents themselves have a hard time meeting their own needs. Ultimately, it’s their choice but I imagine a lot of hardships would be prevented this way.</p>
<p>A quick glance at these articles reveals that some of the Fortune 100/500 CEOs attended schools like UT Austin, Ga Tech, U of OK , Auburn, SMU and Hebrew University of Jerusalem in addition to the top 20school/Ivys. Funny, Princeton is nowhere on either list…</p>
<p>[Where</a> CEOs at America’s Largest Companies Went to College - US News and World Report](<a href=“http://www.usnews.com/education/best-graduate-schools/top-business-schools/mba-jobs/articles/2010/11/15/where-ceos-at-americas-largest-companies-went-to-college]Where”>http://www.usnews.com/education/best-graduate-schools/top-business-schools/mba-jobs/articles/2010/11/15/where-ceos-at-americas-largest-companies-went-to-college)</p>
<p>[Where</a> Fortune 500 CEOs Went to College: The Colleges That Made Them CEOs - US News & World Report](<a href=“http://www.usnews.com/education/best-graduate-schools/top-business-schools/mba-jobs/slideshows/the-colleges-that-made-them-ceos]Where”>http://www.usnews.com/education/best-graduate-schools/top-business-schools/mba-jobs/slideshows/the-colleges-that-made-them-ceos)</p>
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Sorry, you just lost this thread.</p>
<p>Oh wait-- found William Ford Jr. , of Ford Motor Company, on this list, [Where</a> the Fortune 50 CEOs Went to College - TIME](<a href=“http://www.time.com/time/nation/article/0,8599,1227055,00.html]Where”>http://www.time.com/time/nation/article/0,8599,1227055,00.html) and he attended Princeton. Surely it was his college degree that landed him the job. :rolleyes:</p>
<p>Check the list, though, and see how few went to top colleges/universities:</p>
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<p>I’m sold. Princeton must truly be a magical place if “people” (plural) can graduate and become “a garbage man.”</p>
<p>LOL, bovertine. How many princeton grads does it take to create a garbageman? Only one, but he has to be seriously trashed :)</p>
<p>Is that factored into college ranking? (just in case if anyone is wondering why I am able to post in the middle of day, if I had a real job, I am currently on a 20 people conference call).</p>
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I attended a community college for 2 years. They arguably have a larger crosscut of diverse life perspectives and backgrounds. There were older married, single, or divorced students, people with day jobs, poor inner city kids, middle class kids who had some reason they couldn’t leave home yet, smart people, not-so-smart people, people with children, black, white, hispanic, rural, city, etc.</p>
<p>*Well, yes, but imagine if that same kid attended a different university that afforded him 10x more opportunities and 10x greater exposure to diverse life perspectives and backgrounds.
*</p>
<p>Pretty sad.
Someone is already trying to convince themselves that they have accomplished all they are going to accomplish even though they are still in college.
What points me to that conclusion?
Statements like
</p>
<p>Ya- the fact that you managed to enter a competitive college & manage not to be expelled, should be the epitome of your life’s accomplishments.
:rolleyes:
I actually expect a lot more from someone who has been blessed with many advantages in the type of contribution they could be making & yes I would think they were pretty sad if they ended up at Starbucks baring mental/physical illness.</p>
<p>Someone with a more modest background who is able to make life long contributions to the global/neighborhood community, who is able to keep learning about & from others, is much more impressive than someone who attended a college with a big name to put on sweatshirts 
but thought that that made them an intellectual/humanitarian.</p>
<p>jym, that’s exactly my point. why is it that when you tout successful people, it’s about who became CEOs or are now earning a lot of money and then proceed to point out that few of them went to name-brand colleges? My point is that it doesn’t matter they’re CEO-- they’re education and character matter more.</p>
<p>bovertine, that is correct grammar. It means each person can become a garbage man. It’s like saying “Many will live a life of luxury” instead of “Many will live lives of luxury.”</p>
<p>nychomie,</p>
<p>Why does one’s education matter? Isn’t the value of an education based on what you do with it? Don’t CEO’s run companies that create value fro consumers and jobs for EE’s and taxes for governments? </p>
<p>Isn’t that enough? </p>
<p>You can’t say an education matters in a vacuum. </p>
<p>It depends on what you do with what you learned not what brand name you have on the paper hanging on the wall that very few people even look at once you get the job. </p>
<p>And what about character? Again isn’t that a function of how one deals with others not something you can evaluate in snap judgements as it is an unmoving unfluid thing. </p>
<p>OJ Simpson had great character until the world found out he liked to play with knives.</p>
<p>Hunt, I was just going by what you said. You said success should be defined by “character, contribution, and self-sacrifice” and argued that graduates of military academies are the best examples of success by those standards. </p>
<p>Well, I said they don’t have a monopoly on character and that in fact, many of the things they do are actually questionable. You also can’t exercise character when you’re not in complete control of your actions (they have to carry out demands, no questions asked). Their contribution and self-sacrifice for our freedom comes at a VERY heavy cost. Besides, a lot of them choose the military for reasons other than “contribution” and “sacrifice” though they might claim otherwise.</p>
<p>To the contrary, the point is that many people can get “top flight” educations and build wonderful characters at a huge variety of schools, and become wildly successful by many definitions. It is not simply attending an Ivy or top 20 school that offers this. They are great schools to be sure, but I know plenty of people who I feel got wonderful educations and are wonderful people who didnt attend a top 20 or a LAC. I am glad I attended a LAC, but I do not look down on those who did not.</p>
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But just because you have a job though doesn’t mean you’re living a fulfilling life.</p>
<p>"My point is that it doesn’t matter they’re CEO-- they’re education and character matter more. "</p>
<p>Well, you are not going to argue your way out of this one. That grammar is just plain wrong, guy.</p>
<p>I think nychomie is a fraud. Not because he makes grammatical errors, but because his positions are so exaggerated that he comes across as a parody. </p>
<p>Since you addressed me directly upthread somewhere, I will sign off by declaring that I am unapologetic about thinking it is reasonable that the big cash spent on college is recouped at some point. I suspect the money managers at the elite colleges share that view, since they depend on alumni donations to keep some of their programs going.</p>
<p>Jym, being CEO doesn’t necessarily mean you received a top flight education and built great character.</p>