What are my chances?

Colleges and Universities A-Z Swarthmore College
1

<p>I live in New Jersey</p>

<p>I am taking AP Physics C and AP Calculas AB this year, junior year, and AP Statistics, AP Economics, AP Psycology, and AP Chemistry next year.</p>

<p>My GPA is 3.7778 and WGPA is 3.8889
I got a 29 on ACT, When i retake it I'm hoping for a 30 or 31</p>

<p>On my SAT, i have got a 710 in math, 630 in reading, and 590 in writing, but that was only the first test, and i felt like it went horribly, so i am hoping for higher scores in the next 2 takings (would you recommend only taking the SAT 3 times, or 4 or 5??)</p>

<p>I have a black belt in Tae Kwan Doe, won 1st prize of a photo contest at school, snowboard, tutor students in mathematics and physics as a hobby, and help out at my church for about an hour and a half each week. I am in photo club, science honor society, martial arts club, mu alpha theta, and Joshua Generation.</p>

<p>I'm hoping to double major in Nuclear Physics and Philosophy, and if at all possible, triple major in general mathematics (I'm sure thats harder to do than i understand at the time).</p>

<p>I have affected plenty of my teachers, and one english teacher even told me that because of a discussion we had, she changed her mind about how she wants to raise up her child, so I'm pretty sure any recommendation from a teacher will be a big positive.</p>

<p>I would like to know how i compare to the average accepted student at Swarthmore, and approximately what are my chances. Is there a weak spot in my profile that i should make stronger, or some area I should dedicate more focus??</p>

<p>Thank you for your time!!</p>

2

<p>i’m not sure what your chances are, you didn’t include info regarding your ethnicity which is an important aspect of swat admissions. my guess is that your chances are not very high, but that is not the reason i choose to comment here. i’ve been on this soapbox in the past and this particular thread illustrates what i believe to be the deficiency in the growing de-emphasis on the importance of standardized testing in favor of grades and class standing by adcoms. this op has a terrific gpa, provided that he is on a scale of 4 and not 5, however the results of the standardized testing is average at best. to me, that illustrates that this op will have to work a lot harder at swat than the average student at swat. i don’t believe that the comprehension and writing scores are merely average, but are deficient, at least for swat. this school, i find, places an incredible emphasis on written skills and those scores indicate that this place will swallow the op alive. the only aspect of the op’s cv that is at all intoxicating is the gpa. in light of the standardized test scores, the gpa (note to myself, listening to megadeath while trying to compose a coherent sentence is not easy) can therefore be excused as nothing more than illusory. sure, the excuses come fast and furious that op may not be a good test taker (but good enough to score a high gpa?) or that the op didn’t have the same financial advantages as other who could afford prep courses. that rationalization doesn’t discount the proper slotting of the graduating senior in the college application process. the student with the higher standardized test score is simply more prepared to succeed in college or at least at a place like swat, than the high gpa, low standardized test score student. of course that does not take into account diligence and ambition which will always negate high sat scores. not being able to quantify the amount of diligence and ambition in each application (sometimes you can, though) the standardized scores provide a snapshot of every applicant at this one equal moment of their lives without the arduous task of determining whether a high school practices grade inflation or deflation. yes, i am cognizant of the arguments that sat scores are not predictive of how one will fare in college. my argument is that it does measure the intellectual preparedness of each student as measured against another. sure, adcoms can’t accept or deny based soley on sat scores, that would be ridiculous, however, to build a class of intellectual equals the sat’s are a better indicator than gpa’s of a students intellectual standing.</p>

<p>so, as to the question at hand, even if the op hits the swat lottery and gets in, my recommendation is to pass and attend another place more attuned to the demonstrated intellectual level of the op. it would make his life more pleasant and less stressful.</p>

3

<p>@Guy12: Swat would be a reach for you. Unless you can win some national award, or make a finalist, there is nothing that will set you apart from the pack, best I can tell. If you really love the school, apply anyway, why not…They gotta let someone in.</p>

<p>@Duhvinci: I think SAT scores (and ACT) are misleading on so many levels. A child with natural talent and knowledge may score perfectly, but if they are unmotivated, nothing will prepare them for a college courseload or life change. From personal experience, I scored VERY high (years and years ago) but was a lazy student and barely scraped by in state college. On the other hand, a highly motivated student with lower scores will out perform the opposite any day. Add passion for the subject matter to the mix, and SAT scores do a poor job of gauging how the student will do at Swat or any other institution.</p>

<p>There are too many variables to standardized testing. The schools the student attended, the economic background of the student, possible learning disabilities of the student, state, etc, etc, etc, all come into play. (Example: A student has a learning disability in math, scores 800 verbal and writing, but a 650 in math…Should that be a measure for a philosophy major?) (example: The Standardized scores for South Carolina are significantly lower than for Virginia).</p>

<p>The more rounded approach to admission, with a de-emphasis on scores, or with an appreciation of the many variables that can effect the scores, seems more realistic to me; especially if the goal is to find and attract the “best”. </p>

<p>Taking a 360 degree view of the student, including grades (motivation), class rank (ambition), standarized scores (talent), teacher recs (personality), EC’s (Passion, Leadership, commitment), work (work ethic), writing (introspection) seems to me to be a better predictor of future success. Although I would much rather plug my kids scores into a computer and get a list back of where she is accepted, (so I can avoid the stress of waiting), in reality she applied to some reaches (swat included) that I hope look beyond her scores to see what an incredible person she is. </p>

<p>Just my opinion. I like debate, even with people listening to Megadeath at 1:30 in the morning!</p>

4

<p>Duhvinci,
While I may not always agree with the “tone” you use/advice you give in your posts, I think you are a straight shooter so I will ask your opinion on another student’s chances.</p>

<p>White, male from the northeast.
700 M, 780 CR, 790 W
Three SAT II scores submitted ranging from 740-770
~3.7 GPA from well known independent school with grade deflation compared to public schools. (only 2 students in graduating class have “A” average)
Hardest course load
Captain of 2 varsity teams
Excellent musician (submitted two CD’s)
Unusual summer lab internships
Older sibling is a Swat grad</p>

5

<p>momof3sons, I am pretty sure your son will be in if he applies ED, and has a very good shot at RD as well ( at Swat, or anywhere else)</p>

<p>OP, I think your test scores are low for Swarthmore. You could try ACT - you may have a better luck there. Do some practice tests before attempting whichever one you choose to take. You also need 2 SAT II tests.</p>

<p>Swarthmore does not have Nuclear Physics major, only general physics one. It also does not allow triple majors. You can have 2 majors, or one major and 2 minors at most. It has a unique honors program you may want to look into.
One of the things that will help you get in is to learn as much as you can about the school and be able to articulate why it will be a good fit for you. Applying with a major that does not exist in mind would be a bad sign in that respect.</p>

6

<p>imontoya: didn’t i say the same thing you did except more succinctly and intelligently? </p>

<p>mom: it’s way easier to determine which apps get passed to committee and which gets put away in the circular file. in the scenario you offer, aside from the cold hard numbers, the rest of the cv you present is quite boring. there are institutions that would kill for an applicant with those numbers, but, at swat, imo, those stats are a dime a dozen. if you’re not a discovery student, everyone has high 7’s on all three parts, if not 8’s even. in fact, what’s up with this app, is he weak in arithmetic? the math portion is the easiest to nail an 8. props for the near perfecto on the other 2 though. although noone can ever predict what will happen, i believe that, at swat and other sub 18% acceptance rate schools, the gaudy numbers only keep the door from slamming in their face. this may sound crazy, but it appears to me like almost every person here with the exception of me was a valedictorian coming in. captain of sports teams? we have tons of them here, most of them female. excellent musician? the line stretches out the door, most of them female and multiple instruments at that. unusual summer lab internships? there’s a kid here that toured one summer with a top five rock band, jamming with their lead g many times during rehearsals (ok, not fair, that would be me, good times.) just so you don’t think that i’m a spoiled little ****, please know that i came to the table with a few altruistic ec’s as well. in summation, your apps chances? can’t say, but he’s in the game.</p>

7

<p>one thing i forgot, the older sib being a swat grad. that should make it a layup, but a bulked up cv wouldn’t hurt.</p>

8

<p>For the OP, it seems that Swat would be a reach, but for the son of Mother, chances seem much better. But for both of these, I recommend writing a killer essay.</p>

9

<p>The reason I try to take a little more encouraging tone is that there ARE students with SAT scores in the 600s who will not only get into Swarthmore, but who will flourish at Swarthmore. We never know, looking at a simple one-dimensional list of stats on the internet, who might or might not fall into that category. I’ve seen students with an incredible EC that they didn’t even mention without prodding because they didn’t think it was the sort of thing colleges would care about. I very seldom feel like it’s appropriate to cut a high schooler off at the knees on a “what are my chances” thread because I would hate to discourage someone who might be, in reality, a perfect Swattie.</p>

<p>Having said that, I think the original poster is facing a long shot unless he/she is a hooked applicant (URM, first generation, etc.)</p>

<p>I think momof3’s applicant has a very good chance. Presumably he has talked to the coaches. Combine that with the music and you’ve got a competitive application. The sibling thing would generally be a plus.</p>

10

<p>@Duhvinci:</p>

<p>Nope and definitely not. </p>

<p>You did however confirm two things about your arrogance and reading ability. (not in that order).</p>

<p>Pouting intellectuals with anti-social tendencies come in every day asking me for a job. They make lousy employees and with the exception of a few notable idealist snobs seldom make a name for themselves. Ted Kazinski would be an example of the exception.</p>

11

<p>As much as I enjoy DuhVinci’s posts, for their naked arrogance and deliberate contrariness, I do agree with the previous poster that this attitude will not play outside the confines of this Board and Swarthmore (though I doubt these attitudes are well-received there if they are indeed expressed and I’m dubious there as well) and that DuhVinci will be well advised to tone it down a bit. Unless, of course, the posts are some big joke on all of us who read them and a comment on the self-satisfied seriousness that pervades here.</p>

<p>I left Swarthmore with a measure of DuhVinci’s “self belief” and quickly learned that most people JUST DON’T GIVE A ****.</p>

<p>The only way for DuhVinci to maintain this attitude and prosper is to have some qualities or talents that place him above and beyond the fray in which most of us mere mortals are forced to exist. I’m thinking, e.g., Derek Jeter, Steve Jobs, Bruce Springsteen, etc… that order of greatness.</p>

12

<p>swatgrad: i’m not contrarian, in fact, if all the messages i recieve are an indication, i may actually be in the majority, just not in the majority of the apologists that populate this board.</p>

<p>imontoya: if my reading ability is up to snuff (whatever the heck that means,) thank you for calling me an intellectual. it’s a badge i wear proudly.</p>

13

<p>Momof3sons - how large is your son’s class?</p>

14

<p>~180 students. duhvinci suggested a “bulked up” cv which I believe my kid has-I didn’t want to give all the details because at some point his privacy will go out the window and that’s not particularly fair to him. I stuck with the basic details.</p>