What are some good Non-Ivy Pre-Med college programs

Pre-Med & Medical School Pre-Med Topics
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<p>The real question is, can you get the high GPA, and the impressive EC's and rec's. MCAT's are MCAT's, it doesn't matter what school you go to, it won't affect your MCAT. But all the other things are influenced by what school you go to. Let's face it - it's easier to get a high GPA and good EC's/recs at some schools than at others.</p>

22

<p>MCATs mean the most, if you cant get a high MCAT, kiss your chances at med school goodbye.</p>

<p>Trust me, the most successful doctors i have met graduated from state/city universities. In NYC alone, after the obvious columbia and NYU the college that sends the most students to medical school is City University of New York, Queens College. And its not like their numbers are far behind those of NYU and Columbia, they are right up there...and their students are sitting right next to ivy league grads in medical schools such as Columbia, Mount Sinai, Cornell. JUST DO WELL, where you go to college is such a meaningless detail when it all comes down to what you need for medical school. Have the grades, have the scores, have the experience and your set.</p>

23

<p>Oh come now. Even you, on a previous post, recognized the phenomenom of grade deflation, and I believe you even advised people not to go do grade-deflated schools if they wanted to maximize their chances of getting into med-school. And I see that it is now a consensus opinion on the MIT and Caltech sections of CC that they are not the best places to go for premed.</p>

<p>What that means is that there are certain schools that are better than premed than others. Caltech, for example, is not the greatest place. You want to go to a school that makes it easy for you to amass that academic record that will allow you to look good to the med-schools, and certain schools (notably Harvard, Stanford, Princeton, and schools like that) are better at that than, say, MIT or Caltech. </p>

<p>I will paraphrase a story I already told on CC about a guy I know from MIT who couldn't even get to the second-round at almost any med-school despite having good (30-ish) MCAT's, because he had relatively mediocre grades (about a B average) at MIT , but the only reason that was true was because he was getting double-degrees in 2 extremely difficult subjects (chemical engineering and physics) at MIT, and he was taking a lot of difficult graduate coursework. His academic record was good enough to get him into the top PhD programs in the country, including MIT, Caltech, and Stanford, but he couldn't even get into the second round of even the no-name med-schools. </p>

<p>And no, it wasn't because his interview skills were bad or his volunteer EC work was poor. Like I said, he didn't even make it to the second round, so he didn't even get the chance to demonstrate his interview skills or his EC's. His relatively low grades got him rejected before he even got to that stage. Basically, the med-schools didn't know why he had mediocre grades, and they didn't care. </p>

<p>I'm fairly certain that if he had gone to an easy school, his grades would have been strong, and coupled with his decent MCAT score, he would have at least been able to snag an interview. Because he went to MIT, he couldn't even get that far. Again, this is not a stupid guy. He's doing very well in his doctoral program right now. But the fact remains that he couldn't even get to the second round of even the no-name med-schools. </p>

<p>Moral of the story - certain schools can make you look better to the med-school adcoms than others can.</p>

24

<p>yea but you cant make the generalization that you should go to a private school over a state school.</p>

<p>And besides, idc where you go, you can beat grade deflation if you do well. </p>

<p>Yea i did say avoid schools with grade deflation, but im not gonna pass up an opportunity to go to MIT because of it. If you do well in MIT you just wrote your ticket anywhere. </p>

<p>Sakky, you can continue to write what you want about this or pre-med committes but DONT USE THE INTERNET FOR YOUR PRIMARY SOURCES! CALL THE SCHOOLS FOR THE INFO YOUR LOOKING FOR!</p>

<p>You dont seem like you have any real-life experiences with the subjects you talk about, you read things off the internet and decide that no matter what its factual. I on the other hand, do that in addition to speaking to people who have experienced the things i speak about first hand. </p>

<p>You know im involved in EMS, many of the paramedics i work with have either been pre-med students or are going to medical school. I have spoken to one harvard grad in particular who has told me about his experience with pre-med committes and how they discourage applicants, AND i have also heard the view points of doctors and pre-meds about this particular matter of grade deflation at public schools. </p>

<p>Many of the doctors, (especially my cousin-Vascular Surgeon who graduated top of his class from a public school) would laugh at the stuff you are saying (because he laughed at me when i conveyed it to him). JUST GO WHEREVER YOU WANT TO GO TO COLLEGE AND DO WELL. If you get acceppted to MIT or Harvard, yea granted it may be tough to excel as a pre-med but if you do then YOURE GOLDEN! If not, just work harder or transfer. </p>

<p>Your advice on this particular matter is making people sell themselves short. Im glad i am knowledgeable about this before i read some of your posts or else i would have made some bad decisions in choosing my undergrad schools.</p>

25

<p>
[quote]
If you do well in MIT you just wrote your ticket anywhere.

[/quote]
</p>

<p>Yeah, well, that's a very big 'IF'. It's not like you can just simply decide one fine day that you're going to do well at MIT. Do you understand the kind of competition that you face there? Nearly everybody at MIT is a workaholic genius, and yet the grade curves dictate that only a limited number of good grades are handed out. If you want one of those good grades, you have to beat out all the other workaholic geniuses who want them too. </p>

<p>Nor is it a simple matter of working hard. Practically everybody is working hard at MIT (and those who aren't are generally such geniuses that they don't need to work hard). So it comes down to your natural talent. If you don't have that natural talent, you are going to end up with bad grades at MIT - bad enough to put you out of the running for med-school.</p>

<p>And even if you do end up with 'decent' grades at MIT, it depends on how MIT defines 'decent'. Again, I harken back to that guy I know. His grades were decent, by MIT standards. Heck, they were certainly decent enough to get him into a number of elite doctoral programs. But they weren't good enough to get an interview at even a no-name med-school. </p>

<p>
[quote]
You dont seem like you have any real-life experiences with the subjects you talk about, you read things off the internet and decide that no matter what its factual. I on the other hand, do that in addition to speaking to people who have experienced the things i speak about first hand.

[/quote]
</p>

<p>Are you insulting me? Be careful, I'll get you banned. </p>

<p>I use Internet resources primarily because they're easily checked. Those who don't believe what I am saying can easily check my sources. Phone conversations with people, on the other hand, are not. So you could just make something up, and nobody would ever know, because nobody can check. I'm not saying that you are making stuff up, but the point is that that Internet information is FAR more verifiable than phone calls.</p>

<p>Besides, I don't see why Internet information is any less reliable than phone conversations. If somebody is willing to lie on an Internet site then it stands to reason that they would also be willing to lie on a phonecall. So I don't see why you trust phonecalls so much, but you don't trust Internet sites. </p>

<p>However, fair enough, if you think your phone conversations are so reliable, then perhaps you'd like to list the contact information of these people you've been calling, as well as what these people told you? Then the people here on CC can contact these peope themselves and verify your story.</p>

<p>
[quote]
I have spoken to one harvard grad in particular who has told me about his experience with pre-med committes and how they discourage applicants,

[/quote]
</p>

<p>Fine, then, like I said, let's move this conversation to the Harvard branch of CC and get the story verified one way or the other. If what you are saying is really true, surely there's gotta be a Harvard student or Harvard alumni who will be willing to spill the beans. They're over there spilling all kinds of other dirt about Harvard, so it stands to reason that, if this is true, they would be willing to talk about this too, right? So why not go over there with me? Again I ask, what are you afraid of?</p>

<p>
[quote]
Many of the doctors, (especially my cousin-Vascular Surgeon who graduated top of his class from a public school) would laugh at the stuff you are saying (because he laughed at me when i conveyed it to him). JUST GO WHEREVER YOU WANT TO GO TO COLLEGE AND DO WELL.

[/quote]
</p>

<p>And would those same doctors like to laugh at all those MIT premeds who don't get in anywhere? Or all those Caltech premeds who don't get in anywhere? So basically what you're saying is that if you don't get into med-school, it must be your own darn fault, and that the system is perfect, right? So nobody ever gets screwed over by things like grade deflation? That never happens?</p>

26

<p>wow, after i read that info on the internet is easily verified, i just decided not to waste my time with this post anymore, say what you want. I have the cold hard facts and thats all i need for myself.</p>

27

<p>Look, you are the one asserting that these schools have these committees that serve to discourage subpar applicants. Hence, since you are the one making the assertion, I think it is fair that you supply data to support that assertion. If you don't like Internet sites, fine. Surely you wouldn't mind giving up the names and contact info of these Harvard administrators who have been feeding you this information about these committees? I'm sure people here on CC who are interested in this subject would appreciate having the means to speak to these people personally.</p>

28

<p>go on the sight and find any advisor you want, or call the admissions office and tell them to transfer u over</p>

29

<p>No, no, no, I want the specific name of the Harvard administrator that you talked to. I'm sure a lot of people here on CC who are thinking of going to Harvard would like to talk to this person. Apparently this person has really been spilling the beans to you about Harvard, so it would be nice if I could ask some questions to this person myself and find out what is really going on.</p>

30

<p>this was a good 3 months ago when i was choosing colleges to apply to, go on the website and ask any of them, they all know the same thing.</p>

31

<p>Ok, so you are saying that if they all know the same thing, then any of us here on CC can ask any of them, and no matter who we end up reaching, you are assuring us that they will all report back to verify that there are indeed premed committees at Harvard that serve to discourage subpar applicants. Is that what you are saying?</p>

32

<p>no, again i said nothing about the committes themselves discouraging anyone, but if the possibility of them not providing a letter is not only possible but likely</p>

33

<p>That's not what I said either. </p>

<p>The official word at Harvard is that they will provide the letter to anybody who requests it. You are saying that it is actually up to the committee whether it is provided. So if that's true, then when we ask, they will verify that this is so, is this correct? Hence, we will ask "Is it up to the committee whether they provide you with the letter or not". How about that? </p>

<p>I have also noticed that you haven't exactly dealt with the issue of Stanford, which officially has no premed committee at all. That's what it says on the website. Are you implying that they actually have a 'secret' premed committee?</p>

34

<p>go right ahead, as long as you are happy.</p>

<p>And from what ive been told stanford has one, i havent called that school but ive spoken to stanford pre-meds who claim there is a version of it.</p>

35

<p>And, pray tell, if there is no unified rec letter coming out of Stanford anyway (as per official Stanford policy), then what exactly is this secret committee going to do? How can they possibly hurt you if they have no official involvement in your app process anyway?</p>

<p>And yes, I am actually going to email (not call, but email) a bunch of Harvard premed advisors, and then I am going to cut and paste their responses, along with their names and contact info, back here. Of course, that should make you happy because they are obviously going to support your side of the story. Don't worry, I'll post the full email (my question, their response), so you can see what I asked and assess whether I asked a fair question.</p>

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<p>ok, ill be looking forward to it</p>

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<p>Good deal. I'll get back to you when I get the responses.</p>

38

<p>Got the response back today. The only thing I have deleted is my name, for privacy purposes. However, everything else is EXACTLY the way it was in the email. It seems to me that a committee letter will be denied to you only if you are so foolish as to not provide the committee with the paperwork according to the deadlines. But that seems to be no different from you refusing to submit the materials for your med-school application on time. Obviously if you don't submit things on time, bad things are going to happen.</p>

<p>I also identify the specific Harvard premed email address that I contacted, and as you can see, that really is the email address of the Harvard premed tutor. So you have full verifiability and traceability. If you don't believe me, you can contact Marlys Fassett (the Harvard premed tutor) yourself. </p>

<p>From:l DELETED
Date: Sunday, October 02, 2005 10:47 PM
To: XXXX
Subject: Re: Hello, may I ask you something about the premed process?</p>

<p>Hi XXXX</p>

<p>We write a Premed Committee Letter for every Lowell House student/alumni
who applies to medical school. When it comes time to apply, we announce
several deadlines for applicants in terms of meeting with us, submitting
letters of recommendation, and a biographical statement -- all of which
aid us in writing the committee letter. If a student is extremely
irresponsible and fails to meet all these deadline, we can reserve the
right to refuse to write a letter, but that has not happened in my three
years as a tutor. Don't worry.</p>

<p>On Sat, 1 Oct 2005, XXXX wrote:</p>

<br>


<br>

39

<p>read the other post</p>

40

<p>ok then.. so what was the original question..?</p>