Now that so many colleges, esp. privates, have gone test optional for 2021, I’m curious if you are hearing from AOs or college counselors if they will limit the number of students they accept without a test score?
It’s my understanding having too students accepted w/o a score has, in the past at least, hurt a college’s ranking on some lists so I’m wondering if they will limit TO students?
[My S1 is hoping he can retake the ACT – he only got one test in (which of course is better than many!) and didn’t hit his target.]
Would love to crowdsource what folks have heard from colleges on this topic.
Remember that the number collected by USNWR is the number of kids enrolled without a test score, not the number accepted without a test score. Also, schools can ask for a test score after the student enrolls and use that score for USNWR reporting. I’ve asked a few AOs and they say they will ask for a test score if D21 enrolls but, if she really didn’t get to take any test at all, they won’t make her go take one after she’s enrolled. That wouldn’t make any sense since there’d be no motivation to study or do well.
So I know I’m not really answering your question but I don’t think there will be a cap on the percent accepted without a test score. The colleges will all handle this differently but, if one really is concerned about that percentage as enrolled students, they’ll likely add that info somehow to their model that shows whether a student will accept their offer or what percentage of students overall accept their offer.
Also, there’s a possibility that USNWR will change that metric for this year.
I suspect that more consideration will be given to apps submitted without test scores if they are not from the typical demographic. This could be a boost for students from more rural areas. Then again, colleges might rely more heavily on high schools that they are already familiar with, because they still need to be sure that the students they admit can succeed.
And will they cap the numbers? I am guessing that will depend on what percentage of quality apps they receive that don’t have test scores.
The only one I have heard say directly they will is Tulane.
I heard a Trinity TX AO say they won’t limit TO acceptances.
Like homerdog, I hope USNWR changes their ranking methodology, at least for this year. Bob Morse of USNWR is getting asked this question every day…I can see it on twitter.
Here is the current section of the pertinent USNWR methodology.
I also agree with homerdog that some schools still require a test score upon matriculation, even if the applicant applied TO…and I think that allows them to not get the ranking methodology penalty, but I am not 100% sure on that.
I didn’t see this mentioned anywhere else, but I wonder about schools and TO and academic scholarships.
Many schools, especially smaller LAC’s, have automatic scholarships based on GPA and ACT/SAT. For example, one school gives automatic full tuition to a 4.0/36 ACT. But without a test score there’s no way that scholarship could stand. My sister teaches at a local public high school with ridiculous grade inflation to where a 4.0 is common. Yes, students taking the most rigorous courses would stand out, but most of them also have 4.0’s.
So a student might get accepted TO, but if you have to submit a test score for a scholarship how would that work? Because without significant scholarships many schools are out of reach for most kids financially. Seems to me then that most kids would submit their scores anyway which would put those applying TO in the disadvantage.
Colleges won’t be moving in lockstep on this. Some will quietly be protecting their rankings, some will be more lenient in light of the pandemic.
If you are an ORM from a higher SES level, it is still in your best interests to report a strong score (unless the college is test blind, not just TO).
Certain states require their students to take the SAT or ACT as a measure of academic progress. Colleges know that didn’t happen this year, but they do know it happened last year and they will know if it happens next year. So for students in those states, there is no sense pretending they don’t have a score. If one is applying from one of those states and doesn’t submit the score, outside of this past spring, colleges may accurately guess that applicant scored low.
@Groundwork2022 Illinois juniors take the SAT in order to graduate. It was cancelled in March. If they can retake it, it will be in September but no word on that yet. Still, it might be the only SAT that D gets to take. Right now, her high school isn’t even sure if they’ll be back in person and that’s not looking great right now. I get what you’re saying about most kids will have something to report, even if it’s just one test, but I don’t think it should always be reported. There will be many reasons why that one test doesn’t reflect the student’s best attempt. Unfortunately, for merit purposes, I haven’t seen a lot of colleges drop the testing component yet so kids might have to use the one sub-par score they might have. I would think we should know about merit and test scores by August when most apps are open.
It may be that USNWR will change its methodology for the coming year, given the disruption in standardized testing. I imagine that the competitive colleges and universities that have gone TO temporarily might even lobby for such a change.
I also think it’s quite plausible that for states where the SAT or ACT is required to graduate, that requirement might be waived by school boards if it’s impossible to take the test at all. What choice would they have? Hold back thousands of graduates for circumstances beyond their control? I doubt it.
Given that schools are going TO this year because of the pandemic and limited testing opportunities, I would think applying a quota runs counter to the reason why they are going TO. But I agree it will be a school by school thing, and probably a fluid situation because a lot can happen between now and Jan 1. The biggest beneficiaries will be students who have high test scores relative to the historical median for a particular school. They will have less direct comparable competing applicants than in a normal year. The other group of beneficiaries are the kids who normally do not test well but have high GPA’s.
Illinois has waived the SAT graduation requirement for class of 2021. But they are still trying to schedule an in school SAT in the fall…wouldn’t be a grad requirement, but would increase access to testing for students.
@BKSquared – your comment mirrors my thinking on how colleges should be considering this year’s applicants, but I’d like to hear more colleges actually saying there’s no quota.
Right now, even though so many privates have announced they are TO, it still seems to me we’re operating under the ‘old’ TO ‘rules’ where you can apply TO but those who do submit a score have an advantage.
My guess is most colleges WON’T be test blind this year, and as such I’d like to hear more explicit info from them on:
will they cap number of TO admits?
how will a submitted test score be factored into a decision (e.g., is it still on the rubric but gets fewer points than previous years? Or, carries the same same weight as previous years?), and
offer some guidance or insights for students to help them think through and decide whether to submit (esp. if they have a test score but it doesn’t reflect the rest of their application)
@AlmostThere2018 I’ve heard a few AOs at mid-sized elite schools like Emory say that the other things on the app just take more weight if you don’t submit a score. In that case, they need to decide if the student can do the work and “fit” on campus by piecing together what they have - rigor, GPA, essays, teacher recommendations. All of those would likely need to be outstanding to be accepted to a top school. That’s no different than if a student submitted a score. I do agree that coming from a high school that the AO is familiar with should help.
For instance, if I look at Naviance for schools on D21’s list, she’s got the weighted and unweighted GPA to have a good shot at some reaches. I can see where the break is on test scores too. So, someone with her GPA and rigor will likely get into Vanderbilt if she had a 1500 SAT. Now, say she applies ED and without a test score. Will Vandy seriously consider her? I hope so since she has what most schools say is the most important part of the app- rigor and GPA. Of course, every other part would have to fall in line. They’d have to be impressed with her ECs, her essays should show she did her homework on Vandy, and her recs had better be very specific and very good.
And now that I’ve used Vandy as an example, we need them to go TO. Ha.
As for whether to submit a test score, that’s hard too. I get it. It’s not going to be factored less than other years. There’s some talk on other threads about submitting if the score is at the 50th percentile of the school. I still think it depends on the rest of the app and it’s hard to make that decision.
“Certain states require their students to take the SAT or ACT as a measure of academic progress. Colleges know that didn’t happen this year.”
What about for states where it did happen this year? Usually the state administered exams are end of February/early March. I know OH and TX got in their tests.
It was common practice at my D’s HS for students to take ACT/SAT summer before junior year or in the Fall of junior year, and then to use the state administered test to try to bump up the superscore. I know that isn’t common place but I bet there are still a good percentage of students who have scores to report.
@momofsenior1 – Yes, my student’s one test is from a state-administered ACT in Feb. Of course, in hindsight, he wishes he’d taken one in the Fall but didn’t prep until winter break and figured he was better off taking again in April and then, if need be this summer (which still may happen – we’ll see. . . )
Do you think if colleges know a student took a state test but doesn’t submit they will be at a disadvantage? That doesn’t quite seem right – what about students who took one (or two!) tests in the Fall of junior year on their own but they didn’t have a state test. Let’s say those students don’t submit b/c they didn’t hit their desired score. Colleges don’t know they took those tests, right? So are they are at an advantage over students like mine who took his only test on a state testing day b/c colleges know he took a test?
Plus seems like that’s a lot of parsing and categorizing for AOs. . .
Correct me if I’m wrong, but you seem to imply that if a student has any score to report they should report it. Is that what colleges are expecting and saying?
I would say if the score is around or above the 50th percentile, submit. Below the 25th percentile, do not submit if you are unhooked. The tougher call is between the 25th and 50th. If everything else is stellar, gpa, rigor, EC’s and you are closer to the 25th, I might come out not submitting. Just glad we are not dealing with this.
I don’t think many schools will admit or set a particular quota who are just doing TO this year. What will likely drive their final decisions will be the number of otherwise high quality students who do not submit scores.
There is a lot of social pressure for schools to be test optional for this cycle, and I don’t think every school’s heart is truly in it. Some will embrace it and put in the effort to understand the applicant’s academics, but a lot are still going to lean on the test scores that are submitted.
@homerdog – very helpful, thank you. The 50th percentile suggestion feels a bit like the old TO ‘rules,’ but yet also still feels right. And agree that essays, recs and ECs will be more important than ever.
@AlmostThere2018 - I’m not implying anything about score reporting. (No skin in the game as my D’s a rising college junior). My point was only that there are a lot of students that will have scores available.
You bring up an interesting point about adcom expectations though if they know a student is from a state who did administer the test. No idea though how that will play out. We are in unchartered territory!
Personally I think if my D was applying now and had a score within a college’s range, even if it was closer to the 25th percentile of their scores, I would probably have her submit.
I know that some people think the essays and recs don’t move an app in to the yes pile but I think that could be different this year. The student would still have to have the rigor and the GPA. Recs are hard to control at this point. If the student has built strong relationships with two teachers, then they are good to go. It’s likely too late to do much about that now. But they can control the essays. They are really the one thing left that still needs to be done. GPA and rigor is set. If there are any questions on apps that ask any version of “why this college”, I would make sure to do a deep dive into the website or visit if you can and write very specific answers.
I’ve been listening to the Yale Admissions podcast and those AOs read those essays and say they are the glue that holds the app together. A good essay doesn’t excuse poor grades but I think it will add a lot of value, especially this year if you don’t submit a score.
I would be curious if people think engineering hopefuls should really submit if they can. Seems like they should definitely self report AP scores if they are good.
@BKSquared – yeah, I think that’s right. A score closer to 25th percentile is risky if it doesn’t match the rest of a student’s qualifications.
I still wish TO colleges would be more transparent and give more concrete advice. If they are capping TO students, it makes it it worth submitting a score closer to the 50th percentile so you’re not competing with thousands of kids for a smallish number of “TO spots”