<p>I feel that going to a “better” school with a more prestigious name will give me a better shot at a top med school</p>
<p>Nope. Not the whole picture.
The undergrad school does not get you into med school. You get yourself into med school. Mastering exceedingly tough pre-med classes in college, showing analytical and reading skills (don’t believe me, look at the studies,) mastering the MCATs, having some relevant medical or scientific research…all these matter.</p>
<p>mjh, how much debt do you want to be in when you graduate from medical school? If your parents are willing to keep paying for your education until you earn your MD, then that may not be an issue. If they have a lifetime cap on your education dollars (4 years of undergrad, $200K total, some other limit) you need to find out what it is - and, of course, try to negotiate it up.</p>
<p>If money is no object, go to your favorite of the schools that accept you. If there is a lifetime cap on the financing from the bank of M&D, go to UNC and let them help you through medical school. Your 30-year-old self will thank your 18-year-old self for the debt relief.</p>
<p>i understand the need to minimize debt, but i feel like this thread has become an argument on whether i should attend unc or a private school. Lets assume that i never applied to unc and only got accepted into the colleges that i listed. Which ones would you say are worth the price, and which ones don’t make the cut?</p>
<p>Only Harvard and Yale, in my opinion, and only under a very relaxed definition of “worth the price.” But I’d probably be willing to hold my nose and pay for a few others, because you only have so many kids.</p>
<p>But I would sure wish that they had applied to UNC, which I think is better than half this list - even before considering value.</p>
<p>You could look at the payscale.com report on college return on investment, but that would just tell you about the ROI for an undergraduate. If you are not sure about med school this might be a good yardstick. If you are sure about med school, do a little research and figure out which of your schools has the highest admit rates to med school.</p>
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<p>*Schools you have applied to</p>
<p>harvard
yale
brown
columbia
upenn
dartmouth
hopkins
duke
emory
georgetown
vanderbilt
washu*</p>
<p>Your question is not one that can really answered by strangers, especially in the absence of information. Some essential information include:</p>
<p>1) Major. If you want to get a degree in accounting as opposed to say art history or English literature, there are different pay offs. (as pointed out by MomofJandL)
2) If you are looking at Med school, then you need a place where you can excell and get a high GPA. Some of less prestigious institutions can be good spring boards to medical school, not all medical school students are from the top 15 institutions. So where do you think you have the best chances of going to med school?
3) How much money can you afford. Some parents can pay $80,000 a year and not miss a heart beat, others are comfortable with $40,000 but can stretch to $55,000. If you are in the stretch category, then I would say stick to the higher ivy’s. If you are not in the stretch category, all are worth it.
4) Do you have money for med school (or law school or big name MBA etc.)? If a parents could afford about say $300 K total, I would suggest you should not go to a costly undergraduate institution but save it for med school or professional school, in other words none of those schools are worth it.</p>
<p>So bottom line is, if you have the right major and the ability to finance without loans and also finance any professional education after undergraduate, all those institutions are worth it. If you have some limitations, then most may not be worth it.</p>
<p>I would recommend you use caution when looking at the admit rates to med school that universities reports. </p>
<p>There is no uniform agreement about what constitutes an “admission”. (Does the number of admissions include only seniors or both seniors AND alumni? Does the school use its letter committee to screen those it allows to apply or not? Does it include only allopathic schools or both allopathic and osteopathic? Does it include admissions to foreign medical programs? Does it count only first time applicants or also multiple year applicants? Plus a half dozen or more other variations on “admit rate”)</p>
<p>And schools have been known to “massage” their admit rates when posting them to their websites. (Even the Ivys.)</p>
<p>I think it depends on the student. Some students can really make the most of an Ivy League education, although I would imagine an undergraduate who could make that happen would be extremely rare.</p>
<p>It’s not that they aren’t fantastic schools. It’s just that if you are talking about $100k or more in debt, you need to parcel that out. Depending on your career, you could be talking about debt into your early forties <em>just for undergraduate school</em> and a bachelor’s is not what it used to be. Not even from the Ivies.</p>
<p>Speaking of a Mercedes–I know two doctors that drive Toyotas. They can’t afford the Mercedes, because they are in family practice and a lot of their incomes go to paying student loans. It’s something to think about. Just going to Harvard does not guarantee you a salary that will allow you to pay it off.</p>
<p>It really depends on how much sacrifice it is going to take for your family. If your parents are overstressed already and on the brink of financial disaster, none of them are worth the debacle that paying more than they can afford, taking out more loans than they should, can occur. </p>
<p>I’ve been told stories that are supposed to be heart warming of parents working 3 jobs, scrubbing floors, digging privys, sacrificing this and that, and they do not warm my heart at all, but give me a chill. No way in the world would I have wanted to put my parents through that. My father did not live long after my college graduation and for him to have had to work and sacrifice so much in those last few years for me would have broken something in me. That my mother was left as financially hurting as she was, was bad enough. Had there been less due to my college, it certainly would not have been worth it to me. Even if they were so into college prestige that they insisted that it was worth it. I’d rather have them around and be able to be comfortably living.</p>
<p>Depends on how you pay it. If you have the money in your pocket or you can limit your borrowing to about…hmm, I’d say maybe $30-40K total - then I’d say it’s totally worth it. But if you have to borrow more than $50K total to go to the school or your parents are going to go deeply into debt to pay, then I’d say that’s not worth it.</p>
<p>I also would be careful going by major and whether you plan to go to grad school. I knew a lot of people (including myself) who tripped off to college thinking they were going to go to medical school and become doctors, only for them to change their mind 1 or even 2 years in and do something else. But if you really DO want to go to medical school, that’s even more reason to limit your undergrad debt.</p>
<p>Seriously, UNC-Chapel Hill is a great school and I would go there for in-state fees over any one of those other schools unless I had money coming out of my ears. If I hadn’t gotten a scholarship to go to my LAC, I would’ve gone to the University of Georgia. Med schools don’t really care where you went; they care about your MCAT scores and your GPA and whether you have any volunteering or internship experience in medicine. And it’s kind of laughable to think that they would reject a UNC-CH student just for their school…it’s one of the best public universities in the nation.</p>
<p>I agree with the need to keep debt as low as possible. However, even if i were to manage to graduate debt free would it be worth the 220k that i spent?</p>
<p>If you feel that you can’t answer that question for yourself, then I’d say probably not.</p>
<p>IMO i would say that almost every school on my list is worth the price. I am just curious as to what other people think/have to say on the topic.</p>
<p>So you have heard what other people say. Was it helpful?</p>
<p>It’s such a personal question, and one that changes over time,</p>
<p>In 2007, more ignorant than now, we allowed D to apply to one on your list, knowing there would be no aid, not really thinking she would get in, but there was enough money mind to make it happen. The market crashes, she gets in, and over 30 days, we decide to pay.</p>
<p>She’s a junior. Was it worth it? She has a better sense now than she did at 17, but not the same as it will be in a year, or five.</p>
<p>Three years later, second child has reaches at the same price. Are his reaches less value than hers because they are not on your list? Again, we can make it happen without loans, but also without a viable retirement plan.</p>
<p>Basically i have concluded that as long as i can minimize debt and afford grad school all of the schools will be worth the price (if i take advantage of what they have to offer.)</p>
<p>The price to whom? You might feel it is worth the worry and stress to your parents, but they might not feel the same way, and they are the ones who will be directly feeling the cost for years to come.</p>
<p>It’s really hard, because nobody will spend $220k and then say, “No, it wasn’t worth it.”</p>
<p>Psychologically, very few people can do that.</p>
<p>At the same time, most of us who have jobs and kids and apartments and houses, or who don’t (and who know Ivy Leaguers who also don’t) will say, “Hey, at least I have my savings / am not in debt.”</p>
<p>I think you need to do a real cost-benefit analysis. Look at what you want to do, and then look at how much more Ivy League grads make in that field after a bachelor’s. If they can pay off their debt within 20 years, so, by 42, then they’ve got at least 20 more years of saving more and making more, than their counterparts for retirement. So see if that is true for your major, for your field.</p>
<p>If it’s not, I would argue that the added stress of that additional debt is probably not worth it. You’re talking about just ten or fifteen more years to save for retirement, or less. Your job will be just as stressful, you are just as likely to be divorced (in fact, maybe not–look it up), your kids will be more likely to get into those schools but then you’re going to have to pay for THAT, too (and that will be just after you finish paying off your own loans!!!).</p>
<p>Is it worth it? Possibly, if you can make bank and you wouldn’t be able to do that otherwise. Oh, and don’t forget interest in your calculations!</p>
<p>You say you might be able to pay cash.</p>
<p>Do the same calculation, and find out how much you save. $50k? $100k? You could invest that in the beginning and end up with a cool $150k, enough to buy an apartment for an attractive partner and a cute baby, when you get out. You could donate to charity and fix your karma up real good. Or you could get a nice name-brand diploma and a few more connections, and possibly a career for life.</p>
<p>It all depends on <em>your</em> values and <em>your</em> expectations.</p>
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<p>Could be a child with a trust fund.</p>
<p>“i understand the need to minimize debt, but i feel like this thread has become an argument on whether i should attend unc or a private school. Lets assume that i never applied to unc and only got accepted into the colleges that i listed. Which ones would you say are worth the price, and which ones don’t make the cut?”</p>
<p>MJ, the reason you’re getting the answers you are is that decisions aren’t made in a vacuum. To many adults, the question you should be asking is “are these schools worth the difference in cost versus UNC-CH”, which would be about $35K per year. </p>
<p>FWIW, your situation is similar to that of my older D. We live in the same area as you, and like you she was a very good student. UNC-CH was an option for her, but did not offer her intended major, and she wanted to go out of state. So she applied to out of state privates. She knew going into the application process that we would not pay the $35K difference (or even close to it), but she wanted to take a shot anyway. </p>
<p>We were very fortunate in that the aid offered made it possible for her to attend a very good out of state private at about the same cost as UNC-CH would have been. You may have similar results with some of the schools on your list that have very good overall aid, or merit aid, or preferential packaging. My theory is that living in NC works in your favor, since these schools like to have geographic diversity and it’s not so easy to pry the top kids away from UNC-CH. </p>
<p>Younger daughter will be attending UNC-CH in the Fall, so I have no bias either way. I do believe UNC-CH it is a relative “steal” at $20K. </p>
<p>My advice to you is to wait and see where you get in, then compare the aid packages to see the difference with UNC-CH. It would be easier to understand if UNC-CH didn’t have your major, or if you really wanted to get out of NC, but given your intended major you’ve got a great option at UNC-CH. IMO unless the costs come in pretty close it really isn’t worth the difference. As others have already pointed out, just because your parents CAN pay the difference doesn’t mean you should ask them to.</p>
<p>“Which ones would you say are worth the price, and which ones don’t make the cut”</p>
<p>Wouldn’t college rankings basically do that for you? Are you asking, what is the lowest ranking we would accept for a private school?</p>
<p>This thread might be of interest to you as it deals with biology rankings for undergrads:</p>
<p><a href=“http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/college-search-selection/883542-undergraduate-biology-rankings.html[/url]”>http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/college-search-selection/883542-undergraduate-biology-rankings.html</a></p>
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<p>As a Duke graduate, I stand by my earlier comment that no school is worth paying $220k for a bachelor’s degree. My comment assumes that the student’s family is paying the full freight without any financial aid. I feel that I received an excellent education at Duke, but my cost of attendance was substantially lower than the sticker price because of a very generous financial aid package (I came from a single parent, lower income, rural household). I don’t believe for a second that the education that I received at Duke was so vastly superior to the education that I would have received at the University of [your state here] that it would have been worth paying full price. My daughter has happily attended a state university for the past four years and is going on to vet school. Considering that vet school is a tougher admit than medical school, I would say that she did just fine at a state university – and she’s graduating with less than 10k in student loans.</p>