I’ll weigh in as well. I do have 1st hand experience with this at Purdue. I was a classic underachiever in High School. I went to a rural NE Indiana rural high school that was more known for its FFA program and its football and basketball success than academic exploits. I graduated right in the middle of my class of 97, but did manage a respectable at the time 1190 SAT score and was accepted to Purdue’s Freshman engineering program.
When I got there I was overwhelmed. I was not prepared for college level math, the highest I had in high school was Trig. I was also very immature and finally I didn’t really even know what an engineer did. I struggled for a semester before I transferred out to History. Another big mistake. I really flunked out, though at the time that was hard to do.
When I got back to my parents “basement” I moved into the Technology tract which is now Purdue Polytechnic and finished with a Organizational Leadership degree, and went back to Polytech to get a MS degree in Industrial Technology. My entire career has been Industrial Engineering, as an IE, a IE Manager, Director, and eventually a VP.
I also know that many of my fellow freshman engineering classmates went into other schools as well when they find out engineering wasn’t for them. Management was another popular choice at the time, but they went just about everywhere from mathematics to elementary education. Big schools have something for everyone.
The other thing to realize is ones job title after undergrad isn’t necessarily tied to your degree in most cases. I know marketing VPs who have economics degrees. Regulatory managers with Theology degrees.
Undergrad was at Santa Clara University. It has about 5000 undergrads. It’s a Jesuit school which encouraged exploration, and fully supported a double major.
I should add, my kid absolutely could have dropped the engineering major…but that’s not her style. She started it and wanted to see it through to completion.
@flyawayx2 Completely agree… that FYE course is important. Not just to allow time for weed outs or whatever, but to help kids understand if engineering is right for them! Has your son done any PLTW classes in high school or engineering summer programs? I’m hoping we will have some more information in the coming months as we embark on this road to discovery
@ucbalumnus Excellent point about job prospects. We recently listened to a webinar where the student tour guide, a Bio major, told us she was applying to law school. She was happy to answer all our questions related to the science department at her school though! We don’t know how our son’s path will evolve, but it would be helpful to know if he’s likely to end up in grad school.
@thumper1 Very interested in Santa Clara. If I had to design the perfect school for my son, it would be around 3-5,000 kids with programs in engineering, computer science, and liberal arts. To the junior in high school, having options seems like a pretty good deal. Good to know your daughter was able to switch around and still find her path.
Based on a recommendation, I purchased a book for my son called “Is There an Engineer Inside You?” He thought he wanted to do engineering but wasn’t sure which kind, and this did help him see what the life of each type of engineer would look like. Anyway, it’s a comprehensive guide to career decisions in engineering, and at something like $10 definitely worth purchasing. I’m including a pic of the back of the book to give you an idea of what’s inside.
He took Introduction to Engineering Design freshman year, but that was it for PLTW classes. And no engineering summer programs. He thrives in his math and physics classes though and has maxed out those classes at his high school, so it seems like engineering could be a good path for him. He’s a senior now and has been accepted to a few good engineering programs, so by this time next year he might be loving the major or looking to transfer. I can let you know, lol!
@BrianBoiler Thank you for sharing your story! Hindsight is 20/20 and you have a lot to offer kids just embarking on their journeys. Sounds like your path worked out well for you! Not linear, but would you have done it any differently? The learning is in the process!
Going from FYE to Polytechnic could be a solid parallel path at Purdue, among many other plan Bs. Good to know… Purdue for the win, again
Also, see if there’s an ACE program around (Architecture, Construction, or Engineering. It’s a fabulous free national program where teams of high school students emulate an actual design team to work on a mock construction project while being mentored by professionals in those industries. They also do real building projects and go on site field trips. Each project culminates with a public presentation by the students on their project.
@taverngirl Fantastic! Boy, I’ve gotten a lot of great suggestions here on CC. I think I need to read this too… many parents of future engineers are in the field themselves, not in our case! It feels like the blind leading the blind sometimes
Engineering curricula tend to be more structured, and may have more required courses depending specific types of engineering, but they’re actually “easier” than many hard science and math courses. So, an enginering student would likely only change major to math or hard science due to change in interest.
Engineering majors are more hands-on and many engineering programs have required courses for machine shop work (and 3D printing workshop). This is where your son will likely find whether he enjoys it or not. Not everyone does.
@search2022 If I were a 18 year old, I probably would have went a different path.
When working on my first Masters degree I was upset after getting a 4.0 my first semester. Because I worked my tail off to do the best I could and when I found out that many of my classmates also got a 4.0 that first semester I was like “why? how?” Their work was no where close to my level. I sat down with my advisor and she told me “take classes to learn everything you can, not to get a grade.” That stuck with me forever and I passed it on to my kids who have all been successful in their college search. I have no doubt that if I would have applied that thinking in high school on, I could have done anything I wanted. If that was the case, I would have went to a top LAC or private research university with a strong “whole mind” philosophy. I think I could have done any vocation, but to be taught “how to think” not “what to think” is a skill that we all can learn from.
@taverngirl Yes! @Knowsstuff recently recommended this program as well. Sounds like a great, in-depth, real world experience. It would be a commute for us, but might be worth it.
There are huge number of possible alternative paths, with a large degree of variation between different colleges and different students. This makes it difficult to generalize. For example, I’d expect many EEs are also interested in CS, so there may be a good amount of switching back and forth. However, it’s probably not as among environmental engineers. An alternative major that allows them to still focus on environmental goals might be more common. In addition to availability of different majors, it’s also a good idea to consider how easy it is to switch between majors, and support networks at different colleges. It would be helpful to have more specific information about the student and colleges of interest.
For example, the study at https://www.jstem.org/jstem/index.php/JSTEM/article/download/1750/1523 tracks engineering students at an “ABET accredited engineering college in a large, public, research
institution” and reviews differences between those who continued with engineering and those who “dropped out” of engineering, as well as majors among engineering students who dropped out of engineering, but continued at the college. Some of the differences are highlighted below:
Reasons for Choosing to Study Engineering
Good at math/science – 96% of finishers, 64% of switched out
Get good jobs – 87% of finishers, 66% of switched out
Researched/like what engineers do-- 73% of finishers, 57% of switched out
Know an engineer – 50% of finishers, 27% of switched out
Challenges in First Year
Bad math/science preparation – 30% of finishers, 48% of switched out
Financial – 17% of finishers, 23% of switched out
Lack of interest – 9% of finishers, 16% of switched out
New Fields of Study Among Those Who Switch (small sample size)
It’s so hard not to steer a kid with a strong aptitude/interest into a particular field. On another thread, I’m exploring CS options in LACs (as an alternative to the engineering path). Some colleges have first year seminars focused on “how to think,” and every student must take these classes, regardless of major. Of course I wonder, why is this just a freshman year seminar?!
Great questions, @Search2022. Setting aside any issues of whether a student can handle the quantitative rigor of engineering, I think it’s difficult for most high school students to know whether their early interest in engineering will be sustained when they get to college and see different opportunities. My son will be starting college next fall with the expectation of studying engineering. However, I have strongly advised him to not go to a specialized engineering college, simply because he may decide that other fields are more interesting. For example, he is considering Purdue and Rose-Hulman (among others), and I think he should favor Purdue. Rose-Hulman is a good school, but there are just fewer options outside of engineering. My son has shown interest in fields like economics as well, so it would serve him well to keep his options open. Also, it seems to me that it’s not necessarily the case that a student should think about a non-engineering alternative as Plan B…the alternative might be the better plan, not the consolation prize!
I’m exploring Plan Bs in order to guide Plan A. My son is interested in engineering (because of math/science ability and because he LOVES legos… there, I said it but he’s also become interested in computer science. He will take Calc BC or Physic C next year. He will apply early to a bunch of schools, starting in August, well before he has much information about whether he likes Calc & Physics C.
His current list has a few LACs, techy schools (like RPI), and a couple flagships (Purdue). We’re trying to wrap our heads around which type of school will be best… do we look for a school where if Plan A doesn’t work out, Plan B will be reality accessible?
You’re right in that the ease of switching majors needs to be looked at school by school. My questions are more general at this point, and it feels fine to keep LACs, techies, and flagships all on the list. Eventually he will need to pick his pleasure!
