<p>Hello, I am a rising senior who is trying to narrow down my list of 'reach' schools. I come from a middle class family and therefore in order to afford any of the expensive top schools I will need decent financial aid. The reach schools I am looking at are:</p>
<p>Emory
Vanderbilt
Gorgetown
Northwestern
Uchicago
Brown
Rice</p>
<p>Out of this list of schools, which one would most likely offer the most financial aid / cheapest overall cost to a middle class student? I do not think I would qualify for any significant merit scholarships from these schools. If it matters, my predicted institutional EFC is 29k according to finaid.org.</p>
<p>In that case, you can more than likely expect that all of these colleges will likely expect your family to pay around $29K per year. [Brown might be an exception.]</p>
<p>Do all of the schools guarantee to meet full need? IF so, theory is that you will get about the same amount of money. The reality is that it depends on your family situation on individual PROFILE questions on how some things that may be counted at one school is more than at another. For instance, if your parents have some home equity, that may be assessed differently from each school. Some have caps, some don’t some don’t count it at all like FAFSA. Some look at automobiles owned, some look at 401K funds, some have some rule or other that may put any given family at advantage or disadvantage. OTher CC posts pretty much confirm that your institutional EFC can vary widely from one school to another even with similar schools. </p>
<p>The other thing is that some schools more strongly practice preferential packaging than others. Where that may come into play is with the loans you may be offered. A school that guarantees to meet 100% of need may meet it with more loans than you want to take. Some schools now have a no loan policy. Some are on your list.</p>
<p>Thanks for the replies. I guess a better question would be, what school would be most likely to meet my need without loans? I will need to take out loans to meet my EFC so it’s not even worth my time to apply to a school that will require me to take even more. Also, most of our EFC comes from our house so are there any schools on my list who wouldn’t weight this factor heavily?</p>
<p>This Wikipedia article will give you a general frame of reference. It is not completely up-to-date, as a few schools on the list of “no loan” schools have in fact re-introduced them for next year’s applicants, although they may still be available for students under a certain family income level (yours will likely be too high with a 29K EFC), or they may cap loans at a reasonable level. In any case, you need to go to each school’s own financial aid webpages, that’s where you’ll get the most current information.</p>
<p>You’ll have to discuss the situation with each financial aid office individually, and go through more tailored PROFILE estimates to get a better idea of where you would do the best. You see, things have been changing so rapidly lately that even the lists you see on the internet are outdated. As we enter another admissions season, there are some policies that may yet be unannounced as well. It’s a moving target.</p>
<p>All of those schools will expect loans, at least the maximum stafford per year which now adds up to over $25K total. If you will need loans to meet your EFC you should consider schools where you can get merit aid or your state school where your house will not be counted.</p>
<p>^^Actually, Vandy is no-loan. Thus, it should be less out of pocket. Of course, it can depend a lot on how a college treats certain assets like home equity in its EFC calculation. Some colleges cap the equity at a % of income, while others use the full net equity.</p>
<p>Chicago and Georgetown do not have a reputation of being generous with need-based aid. </p>
<p>Emory includes loans, but has a favorable EFC calc.</p>
<p>On merit aid: I am already applying to UGA and Gatech which will both be relatively cheap due to the HOPE scholarship.</p>
<p>Thanks for pointing out that Vandy and Brown are no-loan. After looking at the finaid websites of each of these universities, it appears that many of them expect me to take out at least 10k more in loans on top of my already high EFC. I feel like this thread has really opened my eyes to the reality of paying for college and the unreality of ‘meeting full need’.</p>
<p>That is really an issue that come up a lot. Meeting need means very different things depending on who is defining “need.” The way a student or a family define their need is often very different from how a college may define their need. Even between two families with similar financial circumstances, they may define their need very differently from each other.</p>
<p>In general, though, it’s safe to say families usually feel they have greater “need” than is reflected in the aid available to them.</p>
<p>“Financial aid packages awarded to incoming and returning undergraduate students beginning in the fall of 2009 will not include need-based loans. The amount of need-based loans students would have been offered in the past to meet demonstrated financial need will now be replaced with increased amounts of Vanderbilt scholarship and/or grant (gift) assistance.”</p>
<p>I don’t know… it sounds pretty straight forward to me but I am still going to be catious due to the nature of this economy. I wouldn’t be surprised if a policy like this is revoked either the year I apply or in the years afterwards if the economy continues to effect colleges.</p>
<p>'rentof2 I completely agree. I find it ridiculous that my family is expected to pay 1/3 of our AGI simply because we own our house due to good financial behavior while people who have lived similar or more extravagant lifestyles are rewarded by a lower EFC… even at the same income.</p>
<p>It’s not that simple, apyyy, although we often get threads here on CC about how one group is unfairly benefiting, while another is unfairly penalized.</p>
<p>My family owns a house, we have engaged in “good financial behavior”, and our EFC is quite reasonable. In fact “EFC” is a FAFSA term, and FAFSA does not take the value of your primary home into consideration at all. In fact, it doesn’t even ask about it.</p>
<p>CSS Profile schools may (or may not) use it as a meaningful part of their financial aid calculations, but those schools create their own policies for their own purposes and to give away their own money. If you don’t like how a school’s particular policies affect you, then your indignation would be toward the school, not a family who might find the school’s policies actually work for them. They are just subject to the school’s FA policies, just like you.</p>
<p>But your FAFSA EFC has nothing to do with your family’s home ownership. In fact, in FAFSA calculations home owners get greater benefit because they have a very valuable asset that is not factored into their aid. If another family rented, but had a similar value as money in the bank, they’d be hit harder.</p>
<p>I just explained to my confused cousin how financial aid works. Her son and mine are both rising seniors. The bottom line is that their need will probably be about what it costs to go board at a state school. Student’s stats are just about where they need to be for Penn State and Pitt to be matches which means the chances of merit money from them is zilch and financial aid not much better. Most schools that are a match for him do not guarantee to meet need, but if they did, meeting full need would bring the cost comparable to the state schools. </p>
<p>Explaining how the EFC really isn’t going to mean much to them as they are above the PELL threshhold and that the Staffords are likely to be part of his “aid” package (quotes because even those with no need can get those) was understandable. Then explaining how PROFILE works and how some schools that guarantee meeting full need define need in a restrictive way and that loans may be a big part of the package, was really confusing. Does it have to be so complicated?</p>
<p>The fact of the matter is that there is not enough money allocated to college education by the government to give more aid to families. The colleges,as an integral part of our capitalist system operate to make money. Yes, they are none profit which means they spend what they make, but they all strive to make more. So the lines are drawn pretty danged low in terms of getting actual money for college, unless you are a desired student by college. In that case, you will get bids for your body to join their student body. </p>
<p>Actually, the PELL and Staffords do a reasonable job in covering local State school tuitions for commuters. Going away to college, private colleges are luxuries and if you look at the situation carefully, it really makes no sense that they are even subsidized by government to the degree that they are. You don’t expect to go to private high school, do you? Why suddenly are you supposed to be entitled to a private, boarding college?</p>
<p>The application fees to these schools are low enough to just apply and find out. Yet another reason for people to apply to a dozen or more colleges.
Rice tends to have a fairly low cost compared to other elites, and Brown the weakest aid among the Ivy schools. But with the Common Application, and application fees of less than $100 a pop, it makes sense to apply to them all.</p>
<p>*On merit aid: I am already applying to UGA and Gatech which will both be relatively cheap due to the HOPE scholarship.</p>
<p>Thanks for pointing out that Vandy and Brown are no-loan. After looking at the finaid websites of each of these universities, it appears that many of them expect me to take out at least 10k more in loans on top of my already high EFC. I feel like this thread has really opened my eyes to the reality of paying for college and the unreality of ‘meeting full need’. *</p>
<p>If you’ll be totally happy going to UGA or GT, then those can be your financial safety schools. If you won’t be happy there, then you need to apply to some other schools that will give you big merit for your stats.</p>
<p>To be frank with you…few schools will give you any “free money” with that high of an EFC. A Cornell mom recently PM’d me that with a similar EFC, they got not one penny from Cornell…just work-study, loans. Cornell “determined” that their CSS Profile family contribution should be about $10k higher than their FAFSA EFC. </p>
<p>So, each school gets to determine what your family should contribute.</p>
<p>*Actually, the PELL and Staffords do a reasonable job in covering local State school tuitions for commuters.</p>
<p>Going away to college, private colleges are luxuries and if you look at the situation carefully,** it really makes no sense that they are even subsidized by government to the degree that they are. You don’t expect to go to private high school, do you? Why suddenly are you supposed to be entitled to a private, boarding college?** *</p>
<p>Exactly! That’s why I giggle a bit when parents go on and on about "fit"when selecting colleges when they often don’t care two figs about the “fit” at their local free public high school. </p>
<p>And when you look at how the UCs are using state funds to send pay low-income kids’ cost to go to “sleep away” colleges it doesn’t surprise me that the state is in the situation that it’s in. When I went to a UC, it was expected that you’d go to the one in your county…and drive there. Only the affluent got to “pick” their UC.</p>
<p>Incorrect. I supplied the link which clearly says that Vandy is 100% no-loan. (It’s a way of buying higher stats – they rocketed up a couple of ACT points in the first year alone due to increased applications.)</p>
<p>Just a warning about “no loan” schools. In my experience, they determine EFC higher than meet-full-need schools that do package loans. We had a low EFC and a low Profile number-- and no loan schools still determined a contribution, on average, of probably $3K more than schools that met need with loans.</p>