I spend a lot of time helping kids in our town understand that for the most part, the prestige of their undergraduate institution is irrelevant to their future prospects. Many of these kids have great stats but get shut out of the top 10 anyway. Many are being asked by parents to consider lower tier schools with great financial packages. For the most part, I think this is the right advice. For example, for kids looking to go to medical school, it makes sense to graduate with as little debt as possible and the prestige of undergrad is fairly unimportant. I believe that is true for many, if not most other fields as well. But there may be some pathways that are truly difficult if you don’t come from a top school. For example, can you get into investment banking on wall street from Rutgers? I don’t know. So I would be interested in hearing what you all feel are the real, tangible benefits of attending one of the tippy top schools. What can you achieve there that you can’t do from a midling state school?
I’m not really looking to hear that MIT has better lab equipment or smaller classes. What I want to know is…is it true that you can have any career you really want from any half way decent 4 year college, even one that is ranked lower then the top 100?
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you can - anything can happen and getting into investment banking from rutgers is possible - just chances are slim. same goes for any other top job in consulting, finance etc. whats possible is doing ok undergrad and going to a better school for masters either in the US or Europe
For about 99% of careers out there overall prestige of the undergraduate university or college doesn’t matter at all. For some careers, prestige for the specific major can make a difference, and this is worth taking a look at - for example, if you want a teaching job in some school districts, you are best off studying at certain education programs that have strong relationships with that school district, or if you want to start a theater tech/design career in a certain market, you’d best complete your bachelor’s degree there so that you can take advantage of your professors’ connections.
Most of life is up to you. Even when prestige matters, it does not absolutely and permanently open doors, and not attending the prestigious place does not absolutely and permanently close doors to any career you want.
@happymomof1 I think what you are saying is really important. Finding the right program for the desired career is important, but that may not necessarily mean its about prestige. The program my D is in has great connections in her field in the city where she wants to work. However, its overall prestige as a university is lowish. That can be a hard thing for kids and their families to wrap their heads around sometimes. But its a huge point.
“For example, can you get into investment banking on wall street from Rutgers.”
Tougher, but yes.
Prestige is in the eye of the beholder, as I like to say.
You can find out what schools are targets for IB, consulting, etc. Then keep in mind that for something like MBB consulting, they’re taking the very cream of the crop even at target schools.
BTW, I would say that rigor does matter.
But at any decent RU, for many subjects, you can make your education more rigorous if you put in the effort, especially since schools like MIT have pretty much their entire curriculum online these days so you could learn from there and measure yourself against those tests.*
- Though for some subjects, like philosophy, you may not even know what you don't know. BTW, Rutger's is one of the top schools for philosophy.
Kids from very avg universities (not ranked in the top 100) get accepted into top grad programs.
Just to be clear, I wasn’t trying to pick on Rutgers. It was just the first that came to mind as an example of a school a student might choose for its instate tuition over a higher “ranked” private college. In fact, it doesn’t even fit my criteria as its ranked 69 in National Universities and I asked about schools ranked lower than 100. I’m sure Rutgers has lots of great programs!
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@Mom2aphysicsgeek, though it depends on the subject.
In STEM, that’s very true.
In philosophy, unless it’s a school with a powerhouse philosophy department (like Rutgers or Pitt), not so much.
Econ seems closer to philosophy.
Agree with almost everything written above, but don’t underestimate that value & impact of prestige.
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For example, on another thread a couple of lawyers wrote about the credibility established with employers simply because their degrees were from very highly ranked law schools.
Actually, I should amend: for econ, math PhD, etc., big highly-ranked publics like Cal/UMich are more willing to take a chance (they need the TA’s). But you still need to pass quals to get your PhD.
@Publisher That is exactly my question. What IS the impact/value of prestige? Putting aside things like pride of attending, beautiful campus, shiny equipment, – when is it needed to achieve a life goal?
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This is a great topic. My daughter got waitlisted at UW (good prestige, in-state tuition because her dad lives there) but accepted at UofO with full tuition and fees for 4 years. We’re waiting to hear from the small liberal arts colleges and facing the question of UofO for free vs. lots of money for a LAC. She has worked her tail off in high school (3.9, full IB) and is discouraged that all that work is getting her to UofO with kids from her high school who didn’t care about school.
I’m trying to help her view UofO as a stepping stone to grad school and curious about grad school acceptances from less prestigious universities.
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@Publisher I agree. Each family has to decide if a prestige factor is worth the price and then, of course, only bite that bullet if you aren’t putting your family in financial jeopardy. I know I got some interviews later in my career because of the name of my undergrad college. It continued to pay off for many years.
Something that never seems to be discussed is the experience that some “prestige” schools offer. All of the brilliant people you meet, the connections made, the opportunities offered, etc., can be “worth” it if the family has the means. I know that kids can make their own experience a good one at many schools. No doubt. But these discussions always seem to be about the job outcome right out of school. There’s more to college than that. Undergrad is four years you don’t get back. They aren’t just a means to an end (although of course that is part of it). They are also a time to experience new amazing things and to grow as a person. My experience night and day from my high school friends who went to our state school. Did they end up with amazing careers and fulfilling lives? Yes. But my four years were such a gift since I was able to meet people from all over the globe and challenge myself beyond what would have happened otherwise. It shaped me and, even though my parents left me with $35,000 in loans (a lot in 1989!), it was definitely worth it.
@PurpleTitan I readily admit to knowing absolutely NOTHING about philosophy majors. 
Though, I do know that when our ds made the decision to attend Bama that we were warned his chances at a top grad program were probably nil. That has not been his experience as a physics major.
In terms of engineering, our oldest ds has had a fabulous career with his not highly ranked university degree.
Our current college student is only a freshman…her outcome has yet to be determined, but based on our experiences with our older kids, we are not concerned about the lack of prestige associated with the U’s name. For our kids, it has all seemed to come back to reflect on their personal achievements (which have not been avg. They have been significant.)
But, none of our kids are interested in Wall Street or high profile NYC type jobs.
@meredithfp, it depends on what you mean by “grad school”.
@Publisher, agree that prestige matters a lot for JD and MBA. For undergrad, it depends on career.
@homerdog: I think you can separate out the spending on college in to two parts: ROI and luxury good. ROI (and I’m talking long-term ROI) is generally best at a cheap but good undergrad in a well-paying major. A lot of what you describe I’d put under the “luxury good” category. It’s great if you’re willing to pay for it, just like some people think that splurging on a Ferrari is great.
BTW, honors college kids and kids in top departments in their field will also be high-achieving.
Right. She’s pretty undecided right now but loves school. Not sure what she’ll end up majoring in. Just trying to help her see the value of that scholarship.
@homerdog 35,000 in 1989 is over $70,000 today. That may be fine for a few very high paying careers, but thats a tough nut for kids starting out in many fields. I’m not suggesting that elite schools have nothing to offer. But in making the decision to incur that kind of debt, it would be nice to know whether you can get where you want to go without it. My D2 wants medical school, for that it makes sense to spend less on undergrad. If she wanted law school or an MBA, I would want to investigate whether she could get into top grad schools from No-name University. D1 luckily wants a field where your work experience and achievements count far more than the name of the school. She needs to spend her time learning what she needs to know and busting her butt to get good internships and make connections in her field. So far, so good on that front.
So the real question is, in which careers are you truly hampered by going to No-Name U?
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Tougher to enter prestige industries like consulting/IB and some top high tech companies if at a non-target.
Also, prestige actually may matter most in touchy-feely fields like non-profits, museums.
For law school, a high LSAT and GPA matters most.
For a top MBA program, work experience matters most, and undergrad may matter for that (but it really comes down to the individual).
@gallentjill Here’s an example of how prestige can work–even much later into a career. My husband went to Carnegie Mellon for Musical Theatre back in the 80’s. After a year and a half in the program, he realized that an actor’s life was not for him. He transferred into the economics department and ended up graduating with a degree in economics and public policy.
Upon graduation, he went into real estate, becoming a broker and working for companies doing site location and development. I think at that point in his career, his growing real estate experience and reputation made him successful and marketable. On interviews, people might comment that CMU was a good school, but I won’t say it was the most important factor in obtaining employment.
About 7 years ago, when he was 50, my husband was approached by head hunters to interview for a position at a private equity fund as a managing director of real estate investments. Everyone in the company had been in investment banking. Many had degrees (both undergrad and MBA) from top schools. There is no doubt that his degree from Carnegie Mellon had a major impact on him being interviewed for the position and ultimately getting it. The prestige of coming from a top private school made the investment bankers see him as an equal. Without that degree, it would not have happened. The head hunters would not have even submitted him as a candidate.
More recently, my D who has a BM degree in Vocal Performance applied to top MBA programs. I doubt she would have gotten the acceptances/ scholarships she did if she had studied at a much lower ranked school–even if they had a good music or theatre department. NYU’s reputation for talent and academics definitely helped her application and lead to her getting jobs at high profile entertainment companies (important for her MBA applications.)
Re: law
Law school admission is mostly based on GPA and LSAT. Law employment is mostly based on law school ranking.
So law employment is mostly based on how well you did in undergraduate to get into the high ranking law school.
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