I don’t see it discussed much on CC, but there are some fields where it makes sense to attend school in the geographic area where you would eventually like to live. This is certainly true in teaching and possibly in computer science and certain engineering fields. My D1 chose a school close to where the jobs in her field are and it has made a huge difference in her ability to get internships and make contacts.
For what fields do you think geography makes the most difference and which does it not matter much? Do you think more kids should be counseled to consider that when they are making college lists?
I’ve been hiring for over 30 for a wide range of companies (so speaking specifically about the corporate sector, not teaching, medicine, etc.) and my answer is “it depends”.
For a big company- Boeing, GE, Pfizer, P&G-- they hire who they want. That means if you’re in the paper science program at University of Maine, and P&G needs a pulp production specialist for a management rotation program for the facilities which make Charmin or Pampers somewhere in the world- it doesn’t matter. They know where the students are, and spending time and money recruiting them, flying them around to interviews and relocating them is a trivial cost in the grand scheme of things. You studied Aero/Astro at Cal Tech and Boeing needs someone with your skills in Illinois or Minnesota? Doesn’t matter.
For small companies? Sure. Sometimes it matters, especially if the skills aren’t that unique. But again- there are hiring entities everywhere- so it evens out. You think PR is centered in NY, Chicago, LA, SF and DC. But there are fantastic agencies and companies in Dayton and Atlanta and Dallas etc. Kids who are interested in government think they need to be in DC. But there are 50 states- each with a capital, and lobbyists and public interest think tanks and treasurers who need to fund bonds for bridge construction and sewage treatment plants.
So it depends.
For allied health- again, if you have specialized skills (nursing with advanced training in oncology or neonatology) you can pretty much get hired anywhere. Just graduating from nursing school and need that first plain vanilla job? Being local helps.
For undergrads, I’d think that geography makes more of an impact for those needing summer or year-round internships. Silicon Valley, of course, for those seeking internships in tech industry; close proximity to the Wall Street for business internships, etc.
I know plenty of students who have had internships and full-time jobs post graduation in Silicon Valley and DC who attended schools nowhere near those places. I honestly don’t think it is a big factor if you are going to a decent college known for its academics.
For K-12 teaching, wouldn’t location matter, since credentialing requirements vary, and colleges may align their teacher-prep curricula to the credentialing requirements of the state they are in?
@ucbalumnus From what I know, for K-12 it matters tremendously. Its much easier to get that first job in an area near where you have done your student teaching.
…Unless a teacher majors in a liberal arts subject and get a bachelor’s degree from a top college, and then gets their master’s degree from a college in the state where they want to teach.
I went to college in Massachusetts but have only ever worked in New York as a public school teacher and administrator. I recently hired a teacher who went to U Penn for undergrad, and we have several teachers who went to Boston College, and many other strong colleges outside NY are represented as well.
I don’t see this as needing to live somewhere to get a job in any particular field unless that field is unusual (oceanography, large animal vet, petroleum engineering). Even tech jobs can be found outside of Silicon Valley. I do, however, see location as relevant in the fact that a student has the potential to network and make contacts that will be helpful when the student graduates and wants to live in a certain area.
In this case, the master’s degree or credential program school is where location matters, as long as the bachelor’s degree from some other college (top or not) is in a suitable subject (e.g. math for a prospective high school math teacher), right?
@“Erin’s Dad” – I recall that the University of Wisconsin School of Oceanography sometimes touted itself as “ideally located, halfway between two oceans.”
Actually, they and other universities in the upper midwest do a lot of research on the Great Lakes. There is plenty to study and do research on big bodies of water – economics, marine life, climate, pollution, iow the ecology of the lakes.
DH and I got out engineering degrees in Texas and ended up in Maine! We sent out resumes all over the country (including Alaska and Hawaii) and ended up here.
@ucbalumnus - Yes. A teacher can attend a teaching program in another state (we have had teachers transferring from other other states), but then (s)he needs to take some extra steps to obtain New York State certification. It is more of a pain in the neck to get individually certified than to be part of a program that is already certified. So it is MUCH easier to go to a reputable program in the state where you are most likely to want to teach. But teachers do change states sometimes: their spouses are transferred to a new state, etc.
In secondary ed (7-12), undergrad major and certification area usually align, but there are a few exceptions. Someone in our district attended Cornell University’s Human Ecology school and worked in a different non-math-related field at first, related to her major at Cornell, but then went back for certification in math when she realized she wanted to teach. It did not matter that she had not majored in math as an undergrad. Of course, she had a deep understanding of math and superior mathematical skills.
I hire for elementary (K-6) education. The teachers need a master’s to keep their certification anyway, so a number of people major in something unrelated as an undergrad and then get their master’s degree in some type of education. Their undergrad major could be anything. My teachers have majored in everything from business to philosophy!
But still, a majority of teachers attended local colleges on Long Island and majored in education.
Resumes from Penn and Colgate and Holy Cross and their ilk sure do catch my eye! They make it more likely I will call you for an initial interview. It is nice to increase the odds that the applicant will be highly capable and a good model for their students, and that they will not be dropped out of the process at the stage where we make them do a writing sample and a math sample. It is depressing how many prospective elementary teachers cannot solve a fifth grade math problem!
But, as I have written elsewhere on this site, the demo lesson matters more than anything on the resume. You can be as bright as can be, but how well do you teach kids? A better demo lesson by a candidate from CW Post will result in that teacher’s being recommended to be hired (above the grad of a more selective college whose demo lesson was only so-so).
Geography and location matters if you prefer relatively good weather. It’s a luxury to be able to pick and choose a college because of the college you chose has a better weather. Sometimes it’s better not knowing too much about the college you go to except it’s a good school. For example, I didn’t know when I went to college, Cornell was so cold and that it was an Ivy school. This guy who told me to apply there just said “it’s a great school”. I figured I had a chance to get in even though this kid’s GPA was 1.0 higher than mine just because I thought I was smarter than him. lol
Considering that these colleges’ student SES backgrounds are skewed very high (about half with no FA), do SES differences between teachers and K-12 students become a factor in either teacher retention or teacher effectiveness? (Of course, if your school serves mainly very high income areas, there may not be such an SES mismatch.)
Seems like the minimum standard should be high school level math, since elementary school teachers need to be able to teach K-6 math and also be able to deal with very-advanced-in-math students who could be at high school level in math before leaving elementary school.
Some colleges, even without an Ed major, can nonetheless prepare students for teaching in a variety of states. You pick up any last class(es) you need for certification in a variety of ways. Not always a full blown masters.
Some on CC advise pre-med kids to strongly consider college in their home state, if the state med school has any preference for in-state graduates. I think I’d add business or finance majors as ones where it’s helpful to be near the best internships or early jobs, easy to interview for. Of course you can fly in. Or get a great experience in a secondary city. But it also helps to know the turf and the players, plus the nature of the competiton.
My older kiddo had one of those majors predicted to lead nowhere, as blossom shares, but still landed well. Now, if I could get her to take her working skills and go look in another area, one more competitive, in all ways.
It is true for architecture.Personal connections are a big deal. Local architects come to end of the semester presentations of projects and can pick out students they like.
I think the DC colleges are useful for term time internships, but it is not by any means a necessity. It’s more that slightly less prestigious colleges get a bump in poly sci and IR, but less so for their other offerings.
I do not think it is really true for computer science. My son had internships two summers and his final job in California although he studied at Carnegie Mellon in Pittsburgh. The CMU network has a presence all over the US. Some CS schools will have more connections locally - so for example a lot of WPI grads will end up in Boston.
Not-so-big employers may travel to recruit to a few non-local schools. Well known for the major schools (like CMU for CS) may be targeted more, but some schools may be targeted for other reasons specific to the employer.
Small employers may only recruit locally or regionally because they have fewer needs and recruiting resources.
It would not be surprising if such a recruiting pattern occurred in other fields’ major-related employment out of college.
I’m not sure I 100% agree with the Big Employeers recruit widely. Or at least the same widely. JNJ really concentrates in the NY-NJ area for the bulk of their new college hires. Sure they have a little bubbles elsewhere, but a Rutgers grad has an advantage over an Arizona grad. I suspect JNJ isn’t the only big company that works this way.
