I get the ADD/lack of executive function and also there are some people who just may be in life situations that make it hard for them to plan/organize. I sympathize and try to have patience and appreciate what else they may bring to the table so to speak. Maybe that person is a great listener or can always make you laugh or is the one who makes everyone at the party feel welcome…
That said, it can get tiring for even a very organized person to always be the one to has to plan or deal with changes/plans falling through.
My friend is truly wonderful - definitely worth the annoyance of her lack of organization. She is truly a dear and wonderful person. She is just a scatterbrain! She has also left her purse in places literally all over the world! She lost her and her husband’s passports on a train in Italy. It’s the stuff of nightmares for my personality type!
I’m a planner…and I also expect things to happen on time. If someone invites me someplace, I get there on time.
I have relatives who just can’t deal with time. I’ve stopped inviting them for meal times because they just can’t get there. And I’m not talking five or ten minutes…I’m talking an hour or more late. Can’t deal with it…and won’t!
My D has difficulty planning. S is pretty spontaneous but does a bit more planning than D. I’m the long range planner and mostly I’ve learned to be a bit more flexible and they’ve learned to plan a bit more/better.
I cured H of not planning when we were dating by having other plans with others if we didn’t plan anything for us. Now, I’m in charge of our calendar and “e-invite” him to anything he may wish to attend.
There are of course a variety of scenarios. I was thinking I’m a “non-planner” category until I opened the thread and saw your definition here is about inconsiderate non-planners.
In general I prefer not to plan things with friends out too far ahead of time. Historically it was because of a lot of my obligations for the kids and offshift work chores evolved nearer term…. wanted to minimize the risk of cancelling. Now during Covid we often try to do outside gatherings, so it works best to wait to see weather report for the next few days.
In OP’s case, it would seem ok to call the on Thursday and ask for firmer weekend plans. If she really is a friend, she would not want you stressing over the uncertainty.
My ex in-laws were once two hours late to a meal, when there were supposed to bring an important part of the meal. I was still a girl friend at this time, but I told them if there were going to be two hours late to a function I was planning, to not bother coming, because we would have eaten and cleaned up by then. Their son, my ex, decided on the day we were supposed to be having an outdoor party that it would be a great time to start sanding our deck… fortunately I could say a “hell no” to that one. I am an on time or early person. I do have friends who are not, and you learn to live with and predict what others will do after many years.
I think in her mind, it’s silly for me to stress, since she was the one who was offering to have us over. She definitely doesn’t meal plan on a weekly basis - or is more flexible about it than I am.
That would be me. My take away from people who are chronically late is that they feel that their time is more valuable than mine.
My mom had a close friend who was so late, all the time, that the friend group starting tell her a gathering was starting 2 hours prior to the real time. Sometimes that would get her there on time.
@Hoggirl your friend sounds like the poster child for adult ADD. I wish she could acknowledge that because she could greatly improve her life if she would test and find treatment.
My lovely niece has ADD. She’s aware of it and quite apologetic about how it affects the people around her. She has lost her phone more times than humanly possible. She’s bad at managing her time. I know she is more of a trial to her mother, my sister but my sister also struggles with her own ADD that she has refused to address.
My sister in law on the other hand lacks any awareness or empathy for her behavior. It’s much more difficult because she truly thinks that everyone should “understand”. She says it’s sad for you if you get frustrated.
She’s divorcing my brother in law so I no longer have to deal with the chaos that she brings when we have to plan holidays with her. With family there are people traveling and plans that really have to be made. There aren’t as many opt outs.
One Christmas we drove 200 miles to my in laws. My bil and sil live around the corner. My kids were quite young. My mil talked to sil that morning and decided we should wait for all the kids to arrive open their presents and eat and we agreed on a certain time. My family arrived at the time we were told. We waited 3 hours for them to arrive. From less than 1/4 mile away. Sil put her kids down for a nap because the kids woke them up at 4am. Which was fine except why wouldn’t you call? She literally saw my mil and made plans earlier that day.
My kids were besides themselves. They were very young, didn’t understand that there were presents with their names on them that they couldn’t open and they were hungry. Mil kept thinking sil would arrive “any minute”.
It’s just been 30 years of this selfish entitled behavior. At some point you stop making plans with them.
I have friends who are disorganized or are hard to commit to plans. I just do things that involve me not waiting around for them. And usually nothing with just them. They are still friends. But I’m not doing friendship on their terms. That’s my line in the sand.
I think there is a whole range of problems/conditions here (in this thread).
Not being organized for some daily/social activities (filling the car with gas before a trip, not having supplies for an event, misplacing personal belongings) is probably having trouble putting the steps in action to get from “start” to “finish”.
Being hours late for dinner - over and over again….that’s more than poor planning for the most part. That’s rebel behavior and the decision to do things “my way” regardless of others.
I don’t meal plan for the week but does that make me a bad planner? Because while I may arrive home from work without a plan for dinner at 4:30, 98% of the time I have a home cooked meal ready by 6:30. I chose not to prioritize my “spare time” to draw up a weekly menu (ugh) but I recognize that in my home, I’ll be cooking dinner regardless of a pre-designated plan.
I often plan my meals based on what I see at the store or farmer’s market—whatever looks good and is available.
I consider it very rude to be chronically late. Several of my family members are that way and I hate it. A little late (15 min) is understandable—traffic, etc sometimes. When they’re always 1-2 hrs late, nope no good excuse.
I think that was the point of my post. In a long winded way .
I try not to be regimented and strict. My way is not the only way. I try to be understanding. I truly get when people have trouble getting from A to B.
To get back on track, I would just text her and say, “hey do y’all still want to get together this weekend? We’d love to see you, but we have some stuff to do so want to make sure we can find a time that works.”
I am a more spontaneous person/loosely organized person. I relate to the family that vacations and decides what to do that day. Luckily we have good friends who roll this way too.
BTW, I could never meal plan. Just the idea gives me the heebie jeebies! What if I’m not in the mood for tacos on Taco Tuesday!?? I am, however, a pretty comfortable cook, so I can make something out of all the loose parts I have handy in my kitchen. Sometimes that’s tacos, but if I’m in the mood for veggie soup or Gaeng Tofu then I go with that.
Planning too far in advance can make me anxious. It’s not that I wouldn’t want to see my friends, but having it planned out way in advance puts this dark heavy weight around it and doesn’t keep it light and carefree.
Usually my friends and I plan something a day or two before. I just got together with a really good friend on Tuesday. Monday we had a text exchange like this:
I said: Maybe we can get together tomorrow if you are not still swamped with work.
She said: Yes to coffee together tomorrow. Let’s figure out a time later tonight or early tomorrow?
I said: I should be pretty free before 2pm tomorrow so check in whenever in there
(next day)
I said: Hi how’s your morning going?
She said: Hi How are you? Better today than yesterday. Any time/place sound good for coffee?
I said: I’m pretty flexible
She said: How about Coco? I can leave in about an hour.
I can (and do) live my life in both extremes. I’m pretty sure I have a fair bit of undiagnosed ADD. I relish living spontaneously with (usually) no set schedule in my personal life, though many/most days I enjoy ticking off items from a to-do list just to keep track of priorities. I like to be able to shift course when there’s a reason to. I don’t plan menus for the week…just buy an array of Interesting food that I know will work together. Then improvise.
However. All that goes out the window where my life intersects with other people. I can get OCD about meeting deadlines, arriving for events on time, planning projects that involve others, holding up my end of agreements. If I can do this, anyone can! In fact, I think being a bit scatterbrained (I cannot multitask and I do lose keys and glasses if I’m not really, really intentional) makes me appreciate the power of organization and order when certain things need to happen a certain way,
So, people who are chronically late or who flake out really bother me. I think habitual lateness is a sign that the person just can’t be bothered to think about the steps that it takes to be on time. I don’t mind friends/family being spontaneous as long as they word it that way…such as, I’d love to do XYZ with you at some point next week of t works out…can I get back with you later? But it does bother me if someone implies a specific day/time/event will happen and doesn’t follow through. I think it’s rude to keep people hanging.
So, I forgot to say that friend called me as I was driving to the store this morning. Her FIL is having a medical situation and a procedure on Monday. They are having to shift some things around so they can travel to where he, so it turns out we aren’t getting together this weekend after all. That is a perfectly reasonable reason to cancel! She is not one to typically cancel but is one to be very last-minute. She had said she had been looking forward to having us over FOR dinner - a piece of information that had not really been previously communicated. I mean, sometimes we do dinner, sometimes we just do drinks, sometimes we go down to the beach, sometimes we go out.
I don’t have to have every detail filled in but at least knowing a day and if I am going to be expected to bring something is helpful. I personally never ask my guests to bring things, but not everyone rolls this way.
When children are involved, especially on Christmas, I would screw their rules and put my kids first:
“You have been so patient! We’re not going to wait for Auntie Pam.”
If my MIL complained, I would say, “I’m sorry but my family complied with the designated time and we’ve been patiently waiting. But now, my children are tired and hungry, as are we. We’ve driven 200 miles to get here. Is it too much to ask her to show up, be decent, be considerate and be on time???”
These children are going to open their presents and we’re going out to feed them. Call us at the local hotel when and if she decides to show up."
I have a friend who, about 30% of the time, will cancel at the last minute because she is “tired.” She will do this even when she has already bought a pricey ticket. I have learned not to count on her so when we make plans I make sure it’s something I can do alone or that I don’t mind missing. If it’s a big deal plan, like a concert or theater I invite a third friend so we can carry on without her. It helped that I changed my expectation of her so I don’t get upset when she cancels and I’ve figured out a way around it. She’s good company when she does show up so the machinations are worth it. Sometimes I’ll say to her, “now look, we have tickets to the show tonight so don’t go to the thrift store and the garden center and out to lunch and get too tired.” Sometimes that works but if it doesn’t, oh well.
I’ve learned to be a lot more flexible and plan a lot less activity because my kids both have chronic conditions that limit their stamina. Because they are so careful with their outings, it’s even more important for us that when we do have activities with others that things are reasonable prompt before their stamina dribbles out and we must leave. They really have to conserve their energy and don’t have the energy to wait endlessly for oblivious people.
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