<p>A person coming out of a Tier 1 Business school or a person coming out of a Tier 1 Law school? On average...?</p>
<p>Business school. The top partners at the BEST law firms will make say a million or two. You will probably be nearing your 40s. If you want to sacrifice your 20s for money with the lowest risk go be a ibanker. You will be earning a million by 30. Both jobs more or less require you to give up part of your life. So if you really want the job to make the most money go to ibanking.</p>
<p>It depends on how you look at it. Keep in mind that bschool average will be skewed because of people at the top making monsterous amounts of money. However, on the other hand, there are MBAs struggling just to find jobs and others who make peanuts in ordinary corporate positions--this includes MBAs from good schools. I would say the MEDIAN is better for JDs than MBAs. If you want a standard upper middle class life (e.g. six figures, but nothing spectacular), practicing law or medicine is probably your best bet, but at the top of the business world, the money is by far the best--after all, capitalism rules!</p>
<p>From a tier one business school (aka top 10-15) I am pretty sure they dont have trouble getting jobs ;). And in investment banking its average to make a million by early 30s or so.</p>
<p>I disagree Mahras2. Okay, if you're defining "tier 1" as only top 10-15 (as oppossed to top 50 like US News), alumni of a school ranked 5 are clearly making more than alumni of a school ranked 50. Even if we use your narrow definition of tier 1, I think for MEDIAN JD stilll beats MBA. The average graduate of even the very best business schools is not some 30 year old making a $1M+, not everyone gets these jobs, and even fewer make it to these high levels. </p>
<p>Look at the Wharton numbers:
<a href="http://www.vpul.upenn.edu/careerservices/wharton/surveys/WhartonAlumniSurveyReport.pdf%5B/url%5D">http://www.vpul.upenn.edu/careerservices/wharton/surveys/WhartonAlumniSurveyReport.pdf</a></p>
<p>Although these are for undergrads, they show the stats for Whartonites who got MBAs (presumably most from top schools, these are smart people who I'm confidant got good jobs). </p>
<p>The average Wharton alum with a MBA is making about $304K (w/bonus) about 20 years out. The average Wharton alum with a JD is making slightly more ($365K w/bonus). Interestingly, Wharton alums with only a bachelors are making the most ($447K), and this actually makes sense because these were the people who were superstars and didn't even need to get a MBA.</p>
<p>btw those figures are for 15 years out...</p>
<p>Notice that I speak of investment banking only. Many of the grads there go to consultancy, management etc. And anyone with a little bit of determination from a top biz school can get themselves a decent Ibanking job from those school.</p>
<p>And yes when I speak of tier 1 I mean top 10-15. To tell you the truth I am in the camp that believes business school is more or less useless. The only goal is serves is to offer a period for career change, and for networking. It has been shown that an MBA offers the least value in terms of salary/bonus other than if you graduate from the best schools.</p>
<p>If you want money be an ibanker. A corp lawyer makes more than the average american but his growth is limited. Both start out at the same levels but eventually the ibanker makes much more than the lawyer. Keep in mind corp lawyers typically work FOR ibankers and not the other way around. I have spoken/worked with corp lawyers and, maybe its just with me, but all of them wish they became ibankers instead because they do nearly the same amount of grunt work with lower pay.</p>
<p>how hard is it to get a consulting job with a BS?....do you need a degree from a top school?......how much $$$ do they make?</p>
<p>Its very hard...same level as getting a job with an Ibank. Yes the best places Mck, Bain, BCG all recruit mostly at the top places. They make a lot however not to the same extent as ibankers.</p>
<p>I am not that knowledgable about consulting. I believe Bern should be able to provide more info.</p>
<p>What kind of lawyer makes the most $$? Corparate?</p>
<p>Yes. The best comp goes to folks at Wachtell. They have a policy where their bonus is 100% their salary.</p>
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If you want money be an ibanker. A corp lawyer makes more than the average american but his growth is limited. Both start out at the same levels but eventually the ibanker makes much more than the lawyer. Keep in mind corp lawyers typically work FOR ibankers and not the other way around. I have spoken/worked with corp lawyers and, maybe its just with me, but all of them wish they became ibankers instead because they do nearly the same amount of grunt work with lower pay.
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<p>I agree with the general point that Ibankers make more than corporate lawyers.</p>
<p>However, I would point out that it's not that easy to just 'choose' to have a career in IB. IB is very much a brutal up-or-out system, meaning that you're either a top player who's on his way to promotion, or you're going to lose your job. There's no room to keep average performers around. In that sense, IB is something like an associate's job at a law firm, where you're either on the road to making partner, or you're going to be expected to leave the firm. </p>
<p>Hence, nobody should just "assume" that they can have a long career in IB. That choice is not always up to you. The competition is brutal, and if you're not one of the top performers, you are going to be asked to leave. So you can always look at the very top bankers and feel jealous of the money they make, but what you don't see are all those people who tried to be top bankers and didn't make it. It's like wanting to be Michael Jordan, without taking into account all the people who tried to be Michael Jordan and failed.</p>
<p>are there other jobs in ibanks that are not quite as demanding(both intellectually and time-wise)-which still pay $$BIG BUCKS$$.......and when i say big bucks i mean anything over 90k.........</p>
<p>"how hard is it to get a consulting job with a BS?....do you need a degree from a top school?......how much $$$ do they make?"</p>
<p>Well all the top consulting firms (McKinsey, Bain&Co, BCG, Booz Allen Hamilton, Monitor, Mercer MC, Mercer Oliver Wyman, etc.) hire undergrads with just a BS or a BA. They hire for their analyst level or equivalent position. Like investment banks they recruit solely at the top universities (ivy, duke, gtown, mit, stanford, berkeley, mich, etc.). Again like i-banking jobs, consulting jobs are pretty hard to get. You have to go through a very rigorous interview process, less quantitative than ibank interviews but more problem-solving, analytical. You have to do very hard case interviews. </p>
<p>Consulting is a very up or out industry. You either get promoted or leave. Usually after the entry level position, coming from UG, you are either sent to a top b-school (on the firms bill of course) or you are thanked and you leave. Then after you come back from b-school you have about 3-4 positions before you make partner (depending on the firm). This would usually require about 10 or more years and at each level you are either promoted or you leave. </p>
<p>COMPENSATION:
1. Entry level: ~ 80k with bonuses (2-3 years)
----MBA------
2. Consultant: ~ 120k-170k with bonuses (2-3 years)
3. Sr Consultant: ~ 200k - 250k with bonuses (2-3 years)
4. Manager: ~ 300k - 450k with bonuses (2-5 years)
5. Partner: 500-600k salary, bonuses 2 million + </p>
<p>some firms don't have some of these, some have more. Bain&Co, for example just has Associate Consultant (entry), Consultant (you sometimes do your last year in this position as Engagement Manager), Manager, Partner.</p>
<p>btw, consultant don't work as much as ibankers (although they still work a lot) and they have a better work-life balance. Most bankers work 90-100+ hour work weeks, consultant work 60-70 but they have to travel a lot. Like you might be out of the office on a company visit from Monday to Thrusday. The home Friday to Sunday...then back to where ever on monday. A friend of mine at Bain said he racked up 500,000 frequent flyer miles in his first year. Well I guess that means free flights for a while :)</p>
<p>Trial lawyers who work with a large group of plaintiffs who sue corporations--i forget the exact term--they can make millions of dollars at a time</p>
<p>Absestos lawyers have made a killing, but not by entirely honest means</p>
<p>"large group of plaintiffs who sue corporations--i forget the exact term--"</p>
<p>Class action</p>
<p>GOT DAMN! 60-70 hours per week for consulting? 90-100 hours per week for ibanking? I knew about ibanking from reading off this forum for a while so no suprise there, but I never knew consulting was a ***** too. Seriously that is a lot of hours. Coming from the most money hungry mofo there is, I ask "is the money really worth it?!" I mean there's more to life than buying a 10 bedroom 9 bath mansion and driving a Maybach. This is not a rhetorical question but don't you guys want to have a wife/kids? I see it this way, if I'm making a decent salary 60-70k and the wife is bringing in 30-40k, together we have a six figure income and that's good enough. Seriously GOT DAMN that's a lot of hours.</p>
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You either get promoted or leave. Usually after the entry level position, coming from UG, you are either sent to a top b-school (on the firms bill of course)
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<p>Yeah, but the caveat is that you have to agree to return to that consulting firm, or else they will demand their money back. And for a lot of people, that destroys a lot of the value of the MBA. The fact is, an MBA is an 'exploding' degree in the sense that it really is only valuable for a few years after you graduate, because after that, nobody cares that about your MBA, all they care about is what you've been working on. Hence, it's imperative to get a post-graduation job that will really get you where you want to go, which you might not get if you're obligated to go back to your old employer. </p>
<p>The point is, I would treat any offers to pay for your MBA very cautiously. You need to know exactly what sort of obligations you are assuming.</p>
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I see it this way, if I'm making a decent salary 60-70k and the wife is bringing in 30-40k, together we have a six figure income and that's good enough. Seriously GOT DAMN that's a lot of hours.
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<p>Well, I'll put it to you this way. Lawyers trying to make partner at a big firm will put in brutal hours. People working at Silicon Valley tech startup companies are notorious for putting in massive hours - to the point that some of them have a bed in their office and may literally not leave the office for days (I'm not kidding about that - I've actually seen it). And of course, the kinds of ridiculous hours that medical students and medical interns work are well known. So consultants and bankers who work themselves to a nub aren't that unusual.</p>
<p>wow @ 60-70 hours......</p>