<p>Looking at the common data set, <a href=“IR Home - Institutional Research - Cal Poly, San Luis Obispo”>IR Home - Institutional Research - Cal Poly, San Luis Obispo</a>, ~30% of the entering freshman in year 2005 and 2006 graduated in 4 years.</p>
<p>The several UCs I checked have 4 year graduation rate > 60% or much higher. Are state colleges being hit harder in budget cuts? What is the reason for most students not graduating in 4 years?</p>
<p>Similar questions have been asked before, but basically what it comes down to mostly is that changing your major or missing a pre req class can set you back. Also, a lot of people will graduate in four years + one quarter or something.</p>
<p>I did search the forum and saw similar threads. But what I am most curious about is why the huge difference?</p>
<p>Based on the common data set for the same time period, UCLA’s 4 year graduation rate is like 88% and UC Irvine is like 65%. Majority of the students graduate in 4 years in those schools. Students there don’t change majors, don’t miss pre reqs?</p>
<p>I’ve heard it’s because a lot of people really struggle in some of the early classes, so they have to retake them and I believe Cal Poly’s pretty structured so if you don’t follow stuff in order it’s easy to get left behind.</p>
<p>It can’t be all blamed on students falling behind (or that says something pretty bad about the student body) it must be in part that they cannot get the classes they need to move on properly…</p>
<p>I can think of couple additional reasons for student late graduation, especially for technical majors. A lot of students in tech majors end up doing co-op (6 months internship) which means they will take at least 1 quarter off from school to work. So if you take 1 quarter off, you can easily be off sequence in your major classes and could lead to further delay. </p>
<p>But these co-ops are usually very well paid, and most of the time could lead to a permanent job offer post graduation is so is well worth it.</p>
<p>Another reason is that if you look at the # of units required for graduation for tech majors, they are all pretty high. Almost every lecture has an accompanied lab class, so unless you are taking a full load every quarter upon getting here, you can easily fall behind (especially if one fail a class). </p>
<p>So these 2 reasons probably account for bulk of the late graduation. </p>
<p>Engineering for many universities can easily take 5 years to complete, and this issue is not just Cal Poly.</p>
<p>Also, architecture at CP is a 5 year degree, that probably help skew the numbers too.</p>
<p>I think blindmonkey hit the nail on the head. UCLA is made up of very smart students who are mostly (83%) pursuing degrees in Social Sciences, Humanities, and Sciences. Only 8% are in Engineering majors and 0.4% in Architecture. Cal Poly, on the other hand, is nearly 30% engineers and more than 8% Architecture students. Engineering and Architecture students often take more than 4 years to graduate at most schools due to the heavy load of difficult classes required to graduate. Engineers must pass several difficult calculus classes, physics, statics, fluid dynamics, computer programming, etc. If humanities majors had to take all these kinds of classes, their graduation rates wouldn’t be so great either! I think if you removed Engineering and Architecture from the equation, Cal Poly’s 4-year graduation rate would be much better!</p>
<p>ralph4 and blindmonkey are correct. Internships, coops, STEM major focus, etc. all that contributes. Not being able to get the needed classes is not a big factor. My son has always gotten what he needed. It may not be easy, but it can be done.</p>
<p>We just came back from visiting at Cal Poly and talking to student tour guides in engineering and advisors and the above reasons mentioned by blindmonkey and ralph4 were mentioned as reasons for taking longer. The advisor also mentioned that they want to make sure their students graduate with good GPAs and try to make sure their students don’t take on overloaded schedules, especially if they are working as well. This makes sense when many employers will look at GPAs first as a cutoff. We also visited UCR and their 4 year grad rate is much better, but maybe because they pack 400-500 students into some of the lectures? The students at Cal also said if you’re willing to be flexible, getting classes you need aren’t really an issue. We left there very impressed.</p>
<p>Is there ever a problem getting major courses? I am hoping all of the talk about getting classes is referring to GE courses, not major courses. Is this true? Thank you!</p>
<p>Neither of my kids was ever held up by not being able to get their classes. They even got all their GE’s. My oldest graduated from Engineering in 4 years + 1 summer, and my second one will graduate in 4 years, even though he changed his major twice.</p>
<p>I’ve never had problems getting classes either. The trick is to be smart about using your priorities and being persistent if you’re crashing classes. As far as problems getting major classes go, it really depends on the major. It seems like a lot of major classes that were severely impacted in the past are either offering more sections, revising the methods of instruction (such as incorporating online classes), or reserving spots for majors.</p>
<p>Thanks for all the input. The large number of engineering majors in Cal Poly is a big difference from the UCs. Together with some of the other factors probably all contributed to the low rate.</p>
<p>H and I both think highly of Cal Poly as we both worked/work for companies that recruit there. I was shock when I found out about the low rate. I wonder if anything can be done. People who don’t bother looking into the reasons might be turned off by that. It is one of the published stats in many of the college web sites.</p>
<p>I just got a response back from Cal Poly with some updated numbers that I asked about. I’ve already accepted because I think even if it takes 5 years, it’ll be worth it 
anyways…</p>
<p>engineering 15% in 4 years
computer science specifically (that’s what I’m doing) 10% take 4 years, 30% take 5</p>
<p>^Wow that’s low. I’ll be doing computer science as well. Hopefully because I have a lot of AP credit (including credit probably for APCS) it’s easier for me to graduate in 4 years.</p>
<p>The short answer is “because it’s Cal State”. Despite it’s fine reputation for engineering, Cal Poly still functions as part of the CSU system. Students follow a precise chart for progressing thru the ciruculum. (in all majors) Miss one class and that puts you back sometimes as much as two semesters. Students are assigned advisors and some are better than others (true at any school). But when so much is riding on permission numbers for limited classes, you better draw a knowledgeable advisor. Given the competitive nature of admissions, most kids (if not all) come in with some AP credit. Even then the large majority don’t make it out in four years. The trade off is that CAL Poly’s charges the cheep CSU tuition. So five - ix years at a CSU is still cheeper than UC or private.</p>
<p>momneeds2no
I have read several of your posts on this sight and they all seem to have a negative tone. I also did read that your daughter was not accepted and I feel bad for you, but you are an adult and that should not color your opinion of a great school. I have a daughter at Cal Poly and she loves it there and will be graduating in less than four years. Many of her friends have done internships and many are doing the 4+1 and graduating with a masters as well. They all have been able to get the classes they need.</p>
<p>jakd59, You’re right. D1 was “not offered admission”. Just so you know, DI accepted at top tier east coast private with $37K merit (out of pocket is equal to CSU). So, no need to “feel bad for me”. </p>
<p>D1’s rejection doesn’t color my “perception” of Cal Poly. In fact, D2 (current high school junior) has Cal Poly on her list (at my suggestion). Cal poly is a fine school–lovely campus, strong programs in many majors (not just eng or arch), fabulous facilities, the ability to start your major course in the first weeks of school and best of all…drum roll…CSU TUITION! Like it or not, Cal poly is a CSU and the four year grad rate reflects that fact. </p>
<p>Furthermore, I suspect that folks post questions on this board because they want answers, not just sales pitches. Are the 4 + 1 programs included with the stats for 4 year degrees? Maybe that explains a part of the discrepancy. However, the majority of undergrads are enrolled in 4 year programs (which take large majority of students 5 years to complete). </p>
<p>I proudly a hold a MS from a CSU, so I’ve been there and done that when it comes to advising and permission numbers. My CSu experience was so positive that I encouraged both Ds to apply to at least 2 CSUs. It’s a trade off–affordable tuition/solid education v. dealing with CSU politics. You have your opinion. Allow me to have mine.</p>
<p>It seems as though all those posting on this thread with actual experience with Cal Poly are saying that they HAVE been able to get their needed classes as long as they use their priorities wisely and take advantage of waitlists, crashing (getting permissions numbers) and settling for less their 1st choice prof/time slot. The only people claiming that inability to get classes is a big problem are those who have not yet attended CP.</p>
<p>Ralph, Obviously, all those posting on this thread with actual “antidotal” experience are outside the norm. As the actual “statistical” experience of the majority of students is not to graduate in four years. (as reported by the university itself)</p>
<p>The only evidence produced by this thread points to the theory that posters on CC are “above the norm”. (as evidenced by shorter than normal self-reported grad rate)</p>