Why Duke??? (vs. Michigan)

Colleges and Universities A-Z Duke University
1

<p>Hello everybody,</p>

<p>Although some of you may perceive this thread as painfully premature, as I have yet to even receive my acceptance from Duke and very well might never open a packed package (yay for polyptoton) with a Durham address on it, my curiosity and impatience have gotten the best of me again. I have been accepted to the University of Michigan and the Honors Program within that school and am an instate student. I really do love Michigan for so many reasons, but I also love Duke. I visited campus last year and of course have extensively researched Duke online. Based upon all of my research and my visits to both schools I truly love both about equally. This is causing a big conflict and an abundance of indecision which is stressing me out.</p>

<p>(Ramblings aside) I turn to you for help. Basically my question is what reasons would there be to choose Duke over Michigan? </p>

<p>My personal pros/cons of both and personal info:</p>

<p>As of right now, I would like to pursue a double major in Political Science and Biology/Biochemistry so I could prepare for either pre-law or pre-med. As I progress through college I hope to firmly decide upon one career path because I truly love both disciplines and possible careers (not picking them for money/status at all, my two favorite classes BY FAR in high school have been AP Bio and AP Gov, I'm really into politics and know a ton about it, have interned at the MI house of reps, but also have always loved anatomy and bodily sciences). Being instate for Michigan would obviously make it much cheaper than Duke, although I am fortunate enough to not have to pay for my undergrad education. However, I still feel badly choosing Duke over Michigan unless it's truly worth the cost. Also, I'm gay; I know that both Duke and Michigan are liberal and overall accepting, but I'm looking for a place in which the gays aren't one separate group; I don't want to be isolated. Having said that, hooking up is not my thing and I'd prefer there to be enough people to have a viable dating scene. </p>

<p>Duke
Pros-Easier to Double Major in, better sciences/pre-med than Michigan, better weather, more prestige, easier to live on campus, easier to study abroad.
Cons-Cost, size, Durham, political science is not as good as UMich, I'm guessing it's not as good as Michigan for gays either, football team</p>

<p>Michigan
Pros-Amazing political science program, Honors program, instate tuition, Big Ten Sports, Ann Arbor, gay life
Cons-harder to double major/study abroad/register in general, less prestigious, not as good in the sciences/premed. </p>

<p>Currently, I'm leaning towards Michigan, I posted this on the Duke forum to see if there were any pros I'm missing or any "Cons" that I may be confused about. </p>

<p>Sorry for posting such a long rant, I really would appreciate any input!</p>

<p>Thank you!</p>

2

<p>Although I am slightly biased, there are a few other things to consider. First of all, if you are not looking to play sports (which I am assuming you are not) then I’m not sure if that should be a major factor in your pro-cons. I think that both UMich and Duke have about equal school spirit, especially when it comes to basketball and maybe football. Both are huge D1 programs.
Also, you’d be surprised at how liberal Duke is. I’m not sure, but I think a large majority of students are declared democrats, if that means anything. All I mean is don’t limit Duke or UM based on hearsay, because you may regret it.
Another pro for Duke would probably be that, due to it’s relatively smaller size, then you would probably be able to connect better with the professors.</p>

<p>That said, with all my biases, the money factor is of HUGE importance. If Duke’s fin. aid. was not good enough, then I would say go to UM without a second thought. Both are incredible institutions, but having to pay a lot less is really important. A free, wonderful education is something you might not want to pass up.</p>

3

<p>

There you go, forget about finances and decide based on every other thing that matters to you. Moving on…</p>

<p>

  1. Wait till you are accepted at Duke and get your financial aid estimate. I was in-state at Michigan and chose Duke over it; the difference in COA was about $25,000-$30,000 for me and my parents are upper-middle class ($100-150K range). For what Duke offered me in resources and opportunities, I felt like that was an acceptable premium to pay over Michigan.</p>

<ol>
<li>Michigan’s Political Science program at the graduate level is a hair better than Duke’s but there are few places as exciting to study the subject as at Duke where you"ll be exposed to classroom with an incredible amount of racial and geographic diversity (percentages and not absolute number which is what matters in the classroom) as well as a variety of political views (Michigan is radical liberal while Duke is liberal with a decent amount of conservatives thrown in). The class sizes will be a lot smaller and your professors will give you a lot of attention, more so than you would at Michigan where enrollments in Political Science classes will run in the hundreds even when you are a junior.</li>
</ol>

<p>Check this cool graphic out to compare the geographic diversity of the three schools you’re still considering:</p>

<p>Duke
[Where</a> Does Your Freshman Class Come From? - Facts & Figures - The Chronicle of Higher Education](<a href=“http://chronicle.com/article/Where-Does-Your-Freshman-Class/129547/#id=198419]Where”>http://chronicle.com/article/Where-Does-Your-Freshman-Class/129547/#id=198419)</p>

<p>Harvard
[Where</a> Does Your Freshman Class Come From? - Facts & Figures - The Chronicle of Higher Education](<a href=“http://chronicle.com/article/Where-Does-Your-Freshman-Class/129547/#id=166027]Where”>http://chronicle.com/article/Where-Does-Your-Freshman-Class/129547/#id=166027)</p>

<p>University of Michigan
[Where</a> Does Your Freshman Class Come From? - Facts & Figures - The Chronicle of Higher Education](<a href=“http://chronicle.com/article/Where-Does-Your-Freshman-Class/129547/#id=170976]Where”>http://chronicle.com/article/Where-Does-Your-Freshman-Class/129547/#id=170976)</p>

<p>Based on the enrollments of the two student bodies in 2010, there is a whopping 94% and 92% probability respectively that any two randomly selected freshman at Duke and Harvard come from two different states while the corresponding figure is a measly 58% at Michigan.</p>

<p>Now on to Racial Diversity:</p>

<p>[Duke</a> University Admissions: Class of 2015 Profile](<a href=“http://admissions.duke.edu/jump/applying/who_2015profile.html]Duke”>http://admissions.duke.edu/jump/applying/who_2015profile.html)
[Harvard</a> College Admissions § Applying: Statistics](<a href=“http://www.admissions.college.harvard.edu/apply/statistics.html]Harvard”>http://www.admissions.college.harvard.edu/apply/statistics.html)
[At</a> A Glance | University of Michigan Office of Admissions](<a href=“http://www.admissions.umich.edu/drupal/glance]At”>http://www.admissions.umich.edu/drupal/glance)</p>

<p>Percentage of Students who are Minorities</p>

<p>Using the above links:</p>

<p>Duke: 45-48% (3% didn’t report)
Harvard: 44%
Michigan: 25%</p>

<p>Student to Faculty Ratios</p>

<p>I used the 2009-10 Common Data Sets for all 3 schools…</p>

<p>Duke-8/1
Harvard-7.2/1
Michigan-16/1</p>

<p>Student Body Strength</p>

<p>I used the 2009-10 Common Data Sets for all 3 schools…</p>

<p>SAT MATH
Duke: 680-780
Harvard: 690-790
Michigan: 640-740</p>

<p>SAT CRITICAL READING
Duke: 660-750
Harvard: 690-780
Michigan: 590-690</p>

<p>SAT WRITING
Duke: 660-760
Harvard: 690-780
Michigan: 600-700</p>

<p>ACT COMPOSITE
Duke: 30-34
Harvard: 31-34
Michigan: 27-31</p>

<p>You be the judge stewta4, would it be as enriching to study Political Science at U of M as Duke or Harvard? Remember all 3 schools have top 10 departments in the field at the graduate level.</p>

<p>I will get to the rest of your points tomorrow.</p>

4

<p>I also chose Duke over Michigan (for BME), but I was out-of-state and Michigan would have cost more when taking financial aid into consideration, so it was more a no-brainer in my situation. A lot of my family went to Michigan and I grew up a Wolverine fan, though. I also visited a sibling many times. Both are great schools, but certainly have different feels. I’d wait until you actually hear back from Duke and then visit. I think you should have more of a gut feeling in that case, and it’s usually best to follow your gut. I found that Duke seemed to have more of a community feel and better advising, but the honors college at Michigan probably helps in that regard (I was admitted to Engineering at Michigan, so could not enroll in the honors college). </p>

<p>I don’t think you can go wrong with your choice although I’d certainly encourage anybody to attend Duke. Among certain industries/contingents of people, Duke has more prestige than Michigan if you care about that, but for law/med admissions it probably doesn’t matter much. Michigan is held in high esteem. Duke poly sci is really great and a lot of people get amazing internships in DC. The “average” Duke student is more high achieving at the high school level as it’s a more selective university and there is certainly much more geographic diversity as a private school. Not that there’s anything wrong with Michigan residents, but there’s just a lot of them at UMich, although UMich is large enough in size that there are certainly still plenty of out of state students (more than Duke on a sheer number basis). But some people avoid their in-state public because they think it’s going to be an extension of high school when they already know 30+ people going there from their high school and are afraid they won’t branch out (don’t know if that’s the case in your situation, and it seems a bit silly reasoning to me since one can easily meet others in the 40,000 student population.) But some people perhaps want a more stark change in college. Duke’s weather is a lot better, which makes things more enjoyable in my mind. If it’s not a financial burden and you are eventually admitted to Duke, go with your gut. </p>

<p>Analyzing pros/cons sounds like a good idea in practice, but eventually you just have to make a decision that you won’t look back on. If you think you’ll say, “What if I had chosen Duke instead?” then that’s probably a good indication that you should choose Duke (assuming no financial constraints). And vice versa with Michigan. Good luck.</p>

5

<p>Thank you for the very in-depth replies. Just two more clarifications on my part. I won’t qualify for financial aid at either Duke or Michigan ($250,000+), so unless I get a merit scholarship, which is unlikely, Michigan will be much cheaper than Duke. Racial and geographic diversity really aren’t factors I’m considering. I mean to a certain point. I obviously want racial diversity but just because Duke is more diverse doesn’t mean Michigan isn’t diverse. With respect to the instate thing, I have only lived in Michigan for a year and a half so I don’t really feel the need to get away as much as most students do. Also, I live in East Lansing so the vast majority of my class goes to MSU over Michigan (Don’t ask me why…) and usually only about 10 kids per class go to Umich so I’m not worried about high school continuing. Moreover, even though Michigan is obviously majority instate, in comparison to public schools of a similar size, Wisconsin, UVA, UNC, Michigan has WAY more out of state students. </p>

<p>However, I would prefer Duke’s overall more intimate academic atmosphere. This is gonna be a tough choice, perhaps I should hope for a rejection so as to make the decision easier…haha just kidding.</p>

6

<p>I don’t really have an in-depth response for you, but just a comment.</p>

<p>I have always heard that Duke has had a very good Political Science major/program as does Michigan. </p>

<p>What makes you say that Michigan’s political science program is “better” than Dukes for undergrad?</p>