why go to harvard for undergrad..?

Colleges and Universities A-Z Harvard University
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<p>After a quick excursion to the local Barnes & Noble (mainly for some of that new iced tea at Starbucks) I've come back with the most definite knowledge that Harvard is the worst university IN THE WORLD! I mean, seriously...there must've been 30 books on the shelves about Harvard's horrible education, elitist ways, and corporate corruption. Considering the fact that the University of Texas at Austin had no negative publicity in any of these books, would you guys agree that maybe the great horns of Texas have finally beat out the ivy coated gates of Harvard? Or, instead, does the Harvard name simply inspire criticism because of its name-brand status. (Why does Abercrombie & Fitch inspire so much more hate than Old Navy?) </p>

<p>What is it that Harvard does that makes it so hate-worthy? I would really like to know what I'm getting myself into...</p>

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<p>Having attended a college where about 10% of my fellow freshmen transferred out, I can tell you that there's nothing magical that makes people happy just because they're in college. People are quite capable of discerning whether their college is serving them well or whether their friends at other schools are getting much better deals.</p>

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<p>i would agree that about 95% of that is pure envy. Another 2% is people writing because they realize the widely available market for this kind of stuff... consider that every year harvard turns down about 20k apps... in 20yrs (lets assume an average of 15k every year) that's 300,000apps. That's a lot of bitter people ---> a lot of people who are very willing to read this kinda stuff.</p>

<p>But, having said that, I would also venture a guess that a lot of it is also very founded... though the motivation for its initial writing is somewhat questionable, i agree.</p>

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<p>i thought chicago's freshman retention rate was somewhat higher... around 94%...</p>

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<p>Hanna is not an undergrad student at Chicago. I believe she is there for law school (?) and that she received her undergraduate degree from Harvard.</p>

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<p>I transferred from Bryn Mawr (freshman retention below 90% at the time) to Harvard and stayed there for law school.</p>

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<p>but then I don't understand... isn't harvard's freshman retention rate supposed to be the highest in the country?</p>

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<p>I also believe she was a trasfer student. So she attended some other school (at least) for her freshman year.</p>

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<p>I think coureur made an important point: you can't expect to get into Harvard grad, and it's important to keep lessons learned from the undergrad admissions cycle close to heart, that is if you were rejected/wait-listed. I really did want to go to Harvard undergrad, but I didn't get it (waitlisted). I'd very much like to go to Harvard grad school, but I'm sure that I'll have a great time undergrad at Dartmouth.
In any case, this list from the Wall Street Journal shows the worth of a Harvard B.A. in that ~22% of the last graduating class (could be from 2005) is going to top programs around the country: <a href="http://wsjclassroom.com/pdfs/wsj_college_092503.pdf%5B/url%5D"&gt;http://wsjclassroom.com/pdfs/wsj_college_092503.pdf&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p>

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<p>Right...some people may have truly disliked their experience at Harvard. However, that doesn't dispell the fact that there are students unhappy everywhere. It's just that a book about why students hate University of somewhere, somewhere just won't sell. </p>

<p>The point is, I doubt one can find a single university where every student is happy. Harvard (despite the fact that it is Harvard) is not exceptional in this regard.</p>

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<p>
[quote]
that maybe the great horns of Texas have finally beat out the ivy coated gates of Harvard?

[/quote]
There might just be a reason UT is ranked 52nd while Harvard is ranked 1st in educational circles....</p>

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<p>yeah I think that ranking says a lot when it comes to the admission of college admission's correlation to graduate admission. I think that if you were to compile a list of the selectivy of these schools you'd prob. also come out with something very similar... that ranking, in my view, supports the conclusion that colleges are merely "selection-effect" institutions, and that they earn their big buck during admissions... and true, in that regard, Harvard is king.</p>

<p>Does anyone know if a similar thing exists for graduate programs? Someone mentioned something about the colleges which had graduated last year's PhD recipients, and there was a list of the top ten. Anyone know of anything similar to that?</p>

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<p>I think this conversation about Harvard being the best is a bit misleading. Does Harvard have the best name recognition? Yes. Is it the oldest university in America? Indeed. Are its schools and the quality of its education top-notch? You bet.</p>

<p>But is Harvard the best place for undergrad? I came to the conclusion that it is not necessarily the best - especially at this point in its history.</p>

<p>Larry Summers, who had been one of the most promising leaders in American higher education, was forced to resign by a faculty that was too arrogant to critically look at their quality of undergraduate education. Summers had been key in making plans for its Allston expansion, another capital campaign, major curriculum changes, and its financial aid initiative. Now, without a permanent president, and with a divided faculty, plans for most of these promising advances have been halted or delayed. It's even been reported that many donors have reneged on their multimillion dollar pledges because of a lack of confidence in Harvard's leadership.</p>

<p>When I visited Harvard during its Pre-frosh Orientation Weekend, no one could tell me what the graduation requirements would be, including whether or not there would still be core classes. Why? Because the faculty hadn't decided what to do. No one knew how delaying the choosing of your major would affect Junior Tutorials. Why? Because the faculty hadn't made up its mind. No one could tell me if pre-med students would have to take the life sciences sequence. Why? Because faculty hadn't agreed on what to do with it after so many students complained on its impracticalities.</p>

<p>Scores of administrators have resigned or have been fired recently (Kirby, O'Brien, etc.). The school administration has been restructured recently in a way that some people don't know who is in charge of what.</p>

<p>Harvard students complain of their social lives so much that Harvard has hired a "Fun Czar" who organizes social events for them. I mean, come on!</p>

<p>Obviously Harvard is a great school. But I discovered that I wouldn't want to spend my undergraduate years in a place that is plagued with so many internal conflict, questions, and confusement, not to mention its lukewarm focus on undergraduates.</p>

<p>Anyway, I just wanted to provide another viewpoint on this Harvard lovefest.</p>

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<p>Actually...</p>

<p>The Life Sciences sequence has been approved by all medical schools in the U.S. to be a viable replacement for one semester of General Chemistry and one semester of General Biology. I have taken these classes (so has just<em>forget</em>me). It's not impractical; it is a very noble goal on part of the professors to devote so much time in revamping the science curriculum when they could've left it as be.</p>

<p>In terms of concentration requirements, the fact that concentration declarations could be delayed until the middle of the sophomore year does not mean that the Core has changed. Basically, everything stays in place - until it changes. I still have to fulfill seven core requirements. </p>

<p>Hanna puts it best about this myth on "lack of undergraduate focus" - Harvard Law focuses on its students. Harvard Business focuses on its students. Harvard College focuses on its students. Period. </p>

<p>In terms of a "fun czar," I'm sure there are offices of Student Life at other colleges. A "fun czar" is no different. Besides, there's too many things to do on campus - acappella groups, orchestras, plays, etc. Just to mention few of the biggest events - Hasty Pudding Man/Woman of the Year, Ghungroo, Bhangra, Cultural Rhythms, etc. </p>

<p>When there is a change in leadership, there is bound to be some loss in faith. Harvard has $25.9 billion in its purse, so I'm sure no one is crying over a loss of a couple of million.</p>

<p>Again, Harvard is not for everyone - obviously, it was not a place for you. It was a place for me.</p>

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<p>is there a reason to go OTHER THAN the fact that people will be impressed?</p>

<p>im not being serious though...the previous posters have given some excellent reasons other than "make your parents proud!" or "it's harvard!"</p>

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<p>no doubt... but one of my contentions was that more people should ask themselves that question just to ensure that its what they want. On the Ellison take-back - clearly, no one at Harvard is worrying about the 115 million... as you properly mentioned, Harvard's endowment makes this sum appear to be simply a drop in the bucket - and it is. However, the symbolism and political impact of that is actually much more costly. Here you have one of the wealthiest men on Earth taking back what would've been the largest single university gift in US history... its def. a slap in the face of Harvard. And, to be quite frank, it has only managed to earn negative mentions... there was Summers' initial remark, then the friction with the faculty that lead to him resigning, then the student who plagiarized her book, then the paper regarding Israel's lobbying power that received criticism for having been published... to the point that the KSG tried restricting access to it... I think Summers said it best when he cautioned the University not to fall in "complacency," 'cause it sure seems that they are headed in that general direction.</p>

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<p>why not go to harvard for undergrad????
I would go ,if I can go!!!</p>

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<p>
[quote]
Here you have one of the wealthiest men on Earth taking back what would've been the largest single university gift in US history... its def. a slap in the face of Harvard

[/quote]
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<p>Columbia received a $200 million gift for a neuroscience center a few months ago and I don't even think that was the largest US university gift ever.</p>

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<p>Getting back to the OP: How do you know the Harvard is a good fit for you when "if you get into Harvard, you go"? I have two good friends who graduated from Harvard who felt that it wasn't a good place for them and that my daughter should not apply. They were unable however to answer the question "why didn't you tranfer?" The admissions committee must spend a larger portion of their time figuring out why applicants apply than committees at other colleges.</p>

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<p>Information on entrepreneurs</p>

<p>Harvard is gold standard for education, therefore would like to know some information. This thread in no way put down the school but would like the information. Do you know many current students who are attending Harvard who are budding entrepreneurs who have already started their business in schools? Do they have a business where they make tons of money? Thanks :)</p>