It’s a travesty that the US imposes income taxes on foreign-earned income. The US is one of the few countries that does this to its citizens & companies, along w China & Eritrea.
Big Oil is making a profit now? In case u haven’t noticed, oil prices have collapsed. What specific subsidies are u referring to?
Aren’t the vast majority of int’l undergrads in the US fullpay?
I don’t know how we got down to this, but…
I have a minimum wage paying job. The fact of the matter is that I, or anyone else doing that job, deserves the amount of money we are paid. It’s menial work that is meant for high school students. To think that they deserve TWICE the minimum wage or other numbers that people are suggesting is RIDICULOUS. I clean bathrooms, wipe tables, serve food. It is not hard.
No, I’m not trying to support a family. No one with a minimum wage job should. If you are, sorry, that’s your fault. In the US, where education is compulsory, there’s no excuse to not try and try to better yourself to get a better job to support your family. Now, if there’s some sort of extenuating circumstance such as you are mentally or physically disabled, you should receive government assistance in addition to your job if you’re able to participate in the workforce.
The best way to get higher wages for workers is NOT legislation. The solution would be to abolish the minimum wage. This way, businesses could decide what they are willing to pay their workers and the workers could decide where they wanted to work. For example: "You’ll pay me $4/hour? No thanks. $5? No thanks. $6? No thanks. Eventually, there would be an equilibrium where both the worker and business found appropriate, be it 8, 9, 10 dollars, whatever. At a certain point, businesses would place a limit on how much they are willing to pay and the employee would decide what is acceptable to them. If you don’t like how much you’re paid, maybe someone else will pay you more, or your current employer will up the wage. The market would be able to decide what the true minimum wage is.
There would not be an equilibrium because there is a steady supply of cheap labor. Many employers don’t want immigration reform because if employees are legal then they have legal recourse and can’t be treated (quite so much) like peons.
There is what I might call a conspiracy of power, though (just made that term up). Our local example . . . Boeing (designs and builds airplanes) just announced yearly bonuses. The machinists (you know . . the ones who actually build the product - the “makers”) got 3.1% and until the union bucked they counted all the fuselages that were damaged in the train derailment against the union productivity numbers. They still counted the parts that arrived from a non-union shop and needed reworking against union bonus numbers and the late deliveries caused by 787 rework out of Carolina. The engineers who design the planes got 4%. The managers who sit on their hind ends most of the time and are actually responsible for the planning that caused delays got 12%-20%. The system as management has arranged it is rigged.
In California it appears that the system is driving more and more students to the still-affordable community colleges. I imagine this model will extend to other parts of the country if it hasn’t already. The best part of my near-ivy education was living with the amazing kids I met from all over the world. From that standpoint I’d like to see wider use of Coursera PLUS make opportunities for great kids to meet each other and live together. e.g. study with a group online for three months and then your “class” (well all those that do well) all meets up in Madrid for a month to get the inter-personal benefits similar to that of hanging out in a Harvard house/dorm. Maybe even better.
The rate of inflation for college tuition from 2003 - 2013 is 79%. Now that’s “list price” not what students and parents actually pay but even health care is only up 40% over this timeframe. The total cost of attending a public university is $30K for in-state in most cases and private universities are all within a few thousand dollars of $60K. Even with this though, the ROI on a college education still has a very good payback. Total lifetime earnings are about $0.8M better for college graduates and the unemployment rate of college graduates is 1/3 that of high school graduates.I’m not sure what percentage of students actually end up paying full list price for college after either financial aid or merit aid but you have to wonder how many families will be able to pay $70K or $80K per year if the current rate of tuition inflation does not slow down. What is not talked about a lot actually is those students who have taken on a lot of college debt who dont end up graduating. It’s one thing to graduate with a lot of debt, it’s even worse to not graduate and have a mountain of debt.
In China, India, European & African countries where higher ed is free/cheap, it is strictly rationed. Only those with the highest entrance exams or those who were separated in a college-track stream early on in high school are permitted to attend. It certainly isn’t a “right” in those countries for everyone.
A lot of countries w “free/cheap” college have a lower percentage of college graduates than the US
^^^ and in countries w “free/cheap” college, the campuses don’t have lazy rivers
Nothing that happens is going to impact the value of any education that anyone has already obtained even if it happens while you’re still in college.
*" In China, India, European & African countries where higher ed is free/cheap, it is strictly rationed." *
@GMTplus7 No, it i’s not. I live in an African country and even people with the lowest scores have universities available for them for free. The scores don’t determine what university(s) you go to, rather it (for the most part, not always) determines what majors you are capable for applying for (a person with a 70% CGPA would not be able to get into medicine, for instance) and I can tell you for a fact that it is like this in a lot of African/Arabian/Asian universities. I admittedly do not know a lot about the system of education in China and India,but I hardly think it’s “strictly rationed”.
And not all college campuses in the US have lazy rivers. In any case, refreshing as seeing beautiful scenery is, a river/pond/orchard is not going to pay the debts students accumulate during their studies.
^^ Also, the link you provided shows evidence that suggests that that educational attainment has stagnated in the US compared to other countries. And no one argued that the rate of graduation is higher than in other countries; it does not change the fact that - like mentioned in previous posts - education is becoming more of a business as time goes by.
@InfinityMan said:
If public universities in Africa are so great and free, then why are you seeking to leave Africa to attend university in the US?
Do the public universities in Africa that offer the great and free education offer it for free to non-citizens? Is that why you are so upset about the cost of university in the US—because you want it to be free for foreigners?
I am living in Asia now. I can tell you for a fact that public university is not available for free to all; it is rationed to the students with the highest scores. As for Arabian countries, yet more examples of countries with large sovereign wealth funds derived from oil.
Do the public universities in Africa that offer the great and free education offer it for free to non-citizens? Is that why you are so upset about the cost of university in the US—because you want it to be free for foreigners?" *
@GMTplus7 For the first question - and sorry if this sounds a little rude - it is really non of your business. I have my reasons as to why I want to study abroad. A lot of my friends are actually studying here and are happy with the education they’re getting.
As for the second question, I have no idea how you jumped to that conclusion. I have made no references whatsoever to international students costs. I actually spoke on how expensive colleges were for Americans themselves. I do not expect universities in the US - or rather any other country - to be free for foreigners, and I never said I did.
“As for Arabian countries, yet more examples of countries with large sovereign wealth funds derived from oil.”*
Yes, because America is really poor, right? Having the world’s largest GDP ( 16.7 trillion, I believe) must make it * such * a hardship for them to provide cheaper educational services for their people. The Arabian countries have a total of approximately 4 trillion dollars, combined, by the way.
“I am living in Asia now. I can tell you for a fact that public university is not available for free to all; it is rationed to the students with the highest scores.” *
Is that why you seem to be supportive of the notion that university prices in the US stay high for Americans? Because if your country does not have tuition free admissions ( unless in some circumstances), no country should?
Asia contains 60% of the wolrd’s population and about 50 countries, including Arabian ones. I can’t imagine making such a blanket claim about Asia education
Well most colleges in Latin America are free or cheap, but the quality is incomparable (obviously there are some exceptions).
Statistics I’ve seen show that only the top 5%, at best, go to high school in China. Also saw in an article from SFGate, that in Africa “Just 36 percent of youth go to high school, the United Nations says. And just 6 percent go to college.” Seems like a far cry from everybody going to college.
Where my dad is from, they still have to ship kids out to go to high school, most just stay in the village and work starting at 12 or 13.
Lol, when did I EVER in my years on CC support that university prices in the US stay high for Americans??? I was merely pointing out the reasons why some countries are able to offer it for free: they have a golden goose (oil); they offer a no-frills product (no lazy rivers or cable TV); they limit access to the few (only the top achievers).
My country is America.
“My country is America.”
My bad. I meant the country you * currently * live in.
** I was merely pointing out the reasons why some countries are able to offer it for free: they have a golden goose (oil); **
So does America.
**they offer a no-frills product (no lazy rivers or cable TV) **
They do. Even in my country 
(I’ll admit we don’t have a lot of lazy rivers. We’re big on fountains, though :stuckouttongue: )
** they limit access to the few (only the top achievers). **
Again, not true for a lot of countries.
And education does not * have * to be free. Cheaper would be nicer. More affordable for the average citizen would do. Again, just like schools, Higher education must *not * be a luxury. At the current prices, it pretty much is one.
FYI, as @rhandco pointed out, only a small percentage of kids in Africa are even enrolled in secondary school, so an even smaller percentage will be headed to university. So it’s really disingenuous to claim that in Africa, anyone can go to university for free/cheap.
See data below, from the World Bank: http://data.worldbank.org/indicator/SE.SEC.ENRR/countries?order=wbapi_data_value_2012+wbapi_data_value&sort=asc
Gross enrollment ratio (GER)
Secondary School enrollment worldwide as a percentage of the population of official secondary education age. GER can exceed 100% due to the inclusion of over-aged and under-aged students because of early or late school entrance and grade repetition.
Year 2012, Country
16 Niger
18 Central African Republic
23 Chad
26 Mozambique
26 Burkina Faso
27 Mauritania
28 Burundi
30 Eritrea
32 Rwanda
34 Malawi
35 Tanzania
37 Pakistan
38 Madagascar
38 Guinea
40 Papua New Guinea
43 Congo, Dem. Rep.
44 Djibouti
47 Lao PDR
47 Yemen, Rep.
48 Solomon Islands
50 Cameroon
53 Lesotho
54 Bangladesh
54 Congo, Rep.
54 Afghanistan
58 Ghana
66 Nepal
69 Morocco
69 El Salvador
71 Sao Tome and Principe
73 Honduras
73 Comoros
74 Bhutan
74 Lebanon
74 Syrian Arab Republic
76 Dominican Republic
83 Indonesia
83 West Bank and Gaza
83 Macedonia, FYR
84 Belize
84 Panama
85 Venezuela, RB
86 Mexico
86 Samoa
86 Turkey
86 Iran, Islamic Rep.
86 Malta
86 Egypt, Arab Rep.
87 Ecuador
87 Thailand
87 Tajikistan
88 Jordan
88 Moldova
88 Fiji
89 Hong Kong SAR, China
89 China
89 Chile
90 Peru
90 Cuba
91 Montenegro
91 St. Lucia
92 Serbia
93 Cabo Verde
93 Colombia
93 Bulgaria
94 Oman
94 United States
94 Slovak Republic
95 San Marino
95 Romania
95 Russian Federation
95 Cyprus
95 United Kingdom
96 Bahrain
96 Mauritius
96 Armenia
96 Switzerland
96 Macao SAR, China
97 Czech Republic
97 Korea, Rep.
98 Slovenia
98 Poland
98 Austria
98 Latvia
98 Kazakhstan
98 Ukraine
98 Sweden
98 Croatia
99 Sri Lanka
100 Aruba
100 Azerbaijan
101 St. Vincent and the Grenadines
101 Guyana
101 Germany
102 Hungary
102 Japan
102 South Africa
103 Mongolia
104 Costa Rica
105 Antigua and Barbuda
106 Lithuania
106 Belarus
107 Estonia
107 Belgium
108 Finland
108 Brunei Darussalam
110 France
111 Norway
113 Portugal
114 Saudi Arabia
119 Ireland
120 New Zealand
125 Denmark
130 Netherlands
131 Spain
136 Australia