<p>With the growing number of Architect applicants and the decline of the housing market, will Architects have a future? I'm in the beginning stages of the MArch program and I'm worried there won't be a high demand for Architects in the future. Would anyone like to comment on that?</p>
<p>The housing market runs in cycles, and yes its bad now in a lot of places, but it will go back up, just like it always does. The older folks would be better suited for this question than I would but it seems like, with the rapid pace our world is developing at, architects will become even more sought after in the future - especially in the international community. </p>
<p>I know an architect who owns some real estate on the side but lets management companies take care of it when the economy is good. If stuff starts to slow down and he doesn't get as much work as an architect, he turns to his real estate so things never get too out of hand. I thought it was a pretty smart move, and investing in something else thats almost a constant (like renting apartments if they are in good condition) seems to be almost necessary for a field like architecture which is so dependent on economic circumstances.</p>
<p>yes, and if architects are only focused on form-making, we will soon become obsolete. we actually kind of are, considering that architects only design less than 5% of the buildings today. My feeling is that architects in the 21st century will need to be able to control larger forms of production that are changing our environments today. we have a lot of potential because our global environment today requires people who can think relationally and architecture training is one of the very few that trains us to think relationally.</p>
<p>I think you have to look at it from both a micro and macro cycle. From a micro-cycle (the next year or two), things are definitely tightening up in the market right now. It started with housing, but it is starting to hit the commercial side. Projects are having a hard time getting funded and are being put on hold. For graduates starting in the summer of 2008 things are not going to be the same as they were for the graduates of 2007. Whether that means you will only have two job offers instead of five remains to be seen.</p>
<p>From a macro point of view (the next 10 or 20 years), things look much better. There are not going to be enough new graduates coming out of school to take the place of all the retiring baby boomers. It is definitely going to be a sellers market. When we have large firm round-table discussions a major topic of conversation is where are we going to get all the new architecture graduates we will need. So I think the long term outlook for new architecture graduates is very strong, and I think that salaries are going to go up with the demand.</p>
<p>rick</p>
<p>It depends which market you go into. I, for instance, plan to go into the commercial real-estate market, which is faring better than housing. This market is burning pretty well here in Seattle, where I plan to study and stay, so it shouldn't be a problem.</p>
<p>While a competitive major, it shouldn't be too hard for you to get a job with a firm if you carry the proper expertise.</p>
<p>Umm... correct me if I'm wrong, but I thought architects are a dying breed nowadays. True more and more people are applying for the major in college but more than half of them flunked knowing (in the end) that they simply dont have the talent...</p>
<p>I don't know about commercial real estate, but I can see a trend of urban and close-in suburban residential building (houses) being either replaced with bigger houses or renovated to up the quality. For this kind of job, one could argue that you don't really need an architect, just a builder with good design capabilities. So, if its houses you want to build, maybe the $200,000K + tuition for a BArch would be better spent taking carpentry and construction management at a community college and then spending the balance to start a small design/build firm. Hone your design skills at your customers' expense :), dabble in real estate on the side, and over time make lots of money doing a variety of work. Of course, you'll miss getting written up in high falutin' journals of architectural theory and criticism...</p>
<p>This is my first time seeing this area on majors on CC. I have been reading the architecture major forum with much interest and nostalgia. </p>
<p>I studied architecture over 20 years ago and my embryonic career came to an end with the last recession of the early 90s. I remember a bunch of us back then who had recently graduated (the highest paid amongst us making a measley 21K/year!) discussing the ends of our careers.</p>
<p>Sadly, that came to pass for many of us. </p>
<p>Of those few who managed to stay in the industry, very few practiced architecture....most are in construction management, facility management and development. At the time, we thought it was the end of the architect -especially the way it was taught in colleges back then. What unis did not tell us was that when you got out, architecture was essentially a commercial venture and that you should only get into it if you have an entrepeneural spirit. So forget the high falluting design ideals!</p>
<p>I spent too much money and too much time to obtain my education and there was very little pay off. If I had known then what I know now I would have studied civil engineering with a masters in construction management or real estate development.</p>
<p>Personally I thought the architect was obsolete 25 years ago....I am surprised that students are prepared to invest so much in this career. The BArch is such a hard program and consumes all your time (I dont ever remember attending one campus party in all my years as an architectural student!). One of the hardest thing was seeing people who did only 4 years versus our 5 years, come out of uni was substantially more income than us. And their careers rose exponetially to ours.</p>
<p>someone talked about an architect making 100K at 40, really that's not much. Some majors can get you close to that within 5 years on graduation. You really have to have a plan B if you are to major in architecture. </p>
<p>just my 2 cents!</p>
<p>^^but being in a barch program is all about time management if you want to go out. there are plenty of us who find the time to do the activities we want to do, whether it is a sports team or even a frat/sorority. just because you are in a barch program doesnt mean that you are giving up a social life</p>
<p>that wasn't my point. My point was return on investment.</p>
<p>(besides, my architectural studies was pre-cad and we drew everything by hand! - no time to party!)</p>
<p>Joix had it exactly right. If you want to be an architect, you must have a Plan B. Most people will leave the profession in the first five years realizing 1) they are not terrific designers 2) even if you are a terrific designer, it is till very difficult to prove yourself depending upopn what kind of firm you end up in 3) you still won't make much money. Most people end up as project managers which does not always require you to be a Frank LLoyd Wright. </p>
<p>My advice is that during those first five years, be on the constant lookout for what the ohter options are for using your architectural skills. Suggetions are law (leases), banking (construction lending), business MBA, real estate development, construction management, facilities management, government, etc. If you are not familiar with these areas then I suggest that you do so in order to understand what options you may have as part of a Plan B.</p>
<p>Great advice, alanarch.... makes me think twice before actually doing arch, do you personally think civil eng is better? I'm not familiar with construction management, is that a major or a sub-major?</p>
<p>My view is study what you are interested in. Most studies indicate 50% of people are not working in the field they majored in. My son is a junior in high school and wants to be an architect. I would never discourage him because of pay, job prospects, etc. I have an undergrad in electrical engineering, an MBA in Marketing, and a teaching certificate 6-12 (6 credits short of a Masters in Teaching. I spent 5 years as a software engineer and 20 years in high tech marketing. Even in engineering and marketing, layoffs were a constant. I also found out I enjoyed studying engineering more than I liked practicing it. I loved all my jobs but the endless layoffs were a pain in the neck. After 25 years in the business world, I went back to school to get a teaching certificate for 6-12 math. Best career decision I ever made. Love teaching. </p>
<p>Also, do take some electives that help you when you get out of college--business courses, etc. You never know, whatever your major is, where life and the job market will take you. Being able to think and solve problems gets you everywhere today.</p>
<p>joix: my entire first year was without computers. all hand done drawings and hand made models.</p>
<p>@ msheft - if you dont mind me asking, how much did your first job with your electrical engineering pay you?</p>
<p>@ Laurstar07 - lol! ok, so you clearly are a better time manager than I was! (or perhaps you just enjoy partying more than I did!!).</p>
<p>or I could say that 1st year is easy......and the real killer is senior studio/design thesis and contruction documents in the same year! Could you go partying then?!</p>
<p>(I am just teasing you. I get your point completely!)</p>
<p>Joix - My very first job, believe it or not was in marketing. The company was looking for an engineer for a marketing position. This was 1976. Pay was $13,000. Two years later moving to software engineer pay was $16,000. Even now, while engineers pay is very good, marketing in high tech pays better if you have experience. To become a teacher, I took a 50% pay cut. Money isn't everything, happiness and enjoying would you do is everything!</p>
<p>Joix, I am sorry that it did not work out for you 15 years ago, but the profession has changed. Starting salaries have more than doubled, and even with the downturn we are in, hiring will continue to be strong for good graduates. We went to recruit at Iowa State this spring, and there were 72 firms there trying to recruit 35 students. This demographic trend is going to continue, especially as the baby boomers retire.</p>
<p>Yes, college is going to be a lot of hard work, but I managed to letter in two varsity sports and always maintained a dating relationship during college despite the hours. Those years in studio were some of the best I have ever had. </p>
<p>The partners in the significant architecture firms in my town are making more money than the partners in the structural and MEP engineering firms. Frankly I would never trade places with an engineer, even if I made less money. Construction management graduates will make more coming out of school, but it evens out pretty quickly.</p>
<p>My only advice is to work hard in school, put together a good portfolio, and if you don't love what you are doing, find another major. Look for good places to work, they are out there, and don't give up on your dreams.</p>
<p>rick</p>
<p>Thats not as bad as I expected Rick, thanks.</p>
<p>Egh, this thread just deflated my recently renewed excitement for architecture.</p>
<p>I'm now a senior since I "was" an architecture major back in my freshman year. I never even took a studio class on campus, just an intro to arch lecture course. But I got out because I was reading and hearing a lot more than I had known previously about architecture. I realized architects weren't in as much demand as I thought they were, and that most architects were employed by firms who had you design a closet or a bathroom, at most. But more so, I figured out I really didn't have much of an artistic talent when I was coming up through high school. For one thing, I had noticed better art pieces done by my classmates in art class who weren't pursuing careers or majors in art. At the same time, I never really 'wowed' anyone with my art pieces, except for this one clay project I did for an English class.</p>
<p>I did take some architecture courses at Pratt Institute but I was terribly discouraged by the achievements of my peers. I was light years behind. I had absolutely no previous art or architecture experience except for the typical art classes in school, and everyone else had portfolios ready to go. Still, I went to college determined to follow my dream.</p>
<p>Fast forward a few years later, a few majors later, I'm looking into landscape architecture. The programs seemed a little easier and the combination of the environment were more appealing to me. But then again, it's not much different from pure architecture.</p>
<p>I've never really taken the time to discover my artistic talents. While my current school doesn't offer architecture, I was planning on taking classes in sculpture and computer design courses to complete for a minor or even a major. Afterwards, if I felt confident, I would consider a masters landscape architecture program.</p>
<p>But now I'm not sure. My only other interest is in the field of geography, which I'm hoping would lead me into the urban planning field.</p>
<p>On a side note, I've taken construction management courses before after I dropped architecture, and they're very different from your typical architecture course. Obviously, the design aspect is nonexistent, but the field is really for your typical, blue collar man's man. I felt so out of place even as a guy, that I decided to return to my previous liberal arts school. But like everyone's mentioned, there is definitely a high demand for construction managers, who can rack up 6-figure salaries within five years from graduating. It was too big of a change from architecture that I wasn't willing to head into.</p>