I know that AP scores are rarely the x-factor, but I’m wondering if self-reporting these scores on the Common App will be helpful or hurtful overall when applying to Harvard:
Junior year:
Comparative gov (self-study): 5
Macroeconomics (self-study): 4
Microeconomics (self-study): 4
Physics 1: 4
Psychology: 5
Statistics: 5
Government: 5
Literature: 5
Sophomore year:
European: 5
Calculus AB: 4
Chemistry: 4
Freshman year:
Biology: 4
I know these scores are mediocre (they’re probably the weakest part of my application), but I don’t know if self-reporting is a bad idea. The rest of my application focuses on my interest in the social sciences/government/policy/economics. Thanks for the help!
These scores are quite good; calling them “mediocre” strikes me as beyond disingenuous and is insulting to those applicants whose scores are not as strong as yours…
AP scores can help, and will not hurt, IMO. Your scores will not be the reason you get rejected from any college .The “woe is me” attitude that you seem to have, if apparent in your essays and/or recs, will most definitely not win you points. Good luck.
I don’t see how you fill up your transcript with 9 AP classes and then expect adcoms not to notice you didn’t report 4 of your scores. If you dont, understand they may assume the missing ones were 3’s or lower.
“I don’t see how you fill up your transcript with 9 AP classes and then expect adcoms not to notice you didn’t report 4 of your scores.”
If I choose not to self-report then I won’t report any of them.
“…calling them ‘mediocre’ strikes me as beyond disingenuous and is insulting to those applicants whose scores are not as strong as yours”
I’m not sure why my post is being construed as an insult; I didn’t mean to offend. All I’m saying is that, compared to many of Harvard’s students, those scores would be considered mediocre - I’m not trying to fake humility, but it’s undeniable that scoring 4’s on 50% of your exams won’t impress many Harvard admissions officers.
“AP scores can help, and will not hurt, IMO.”
I’ve heard conflicting things about this. Do you have a reason for thinking this?
“The ‘woe is me’ attitude that you seem to have, if apparent in your essays and/or recs, will most definitely not win you points.”
Take it easy, bud. No, that attitude isn’t apparent in my essays. The only reason I said my scores were mediocre is that I’m trying to give an honest assessment of my AP scores in the context of the rest of my application. I’m sorry that it frustrated you, that wasn’t my intention.
Students got accepted with 4’s.Some even got accepted with gasp 3’s. Scores are but one part of the application package. Harvard is looking at that, and much more.
It’s undeniable that unless you’re of the Malala category, little will “impress” Harvard AO’s, so don’t use “impress” as your yardstick - that’s just folly.
If you don’t report any, adcoms can still assume it’s because they were sub 4. Theres nothing that says, if you don’t report, we’ll give you a bye, assume you did fine. Meanwhile, the competition…
Again, you could be clear this is about the 4’s not the 5’s.
Yes, lots of applicants will have high scores. It’s the nature of the crazy fierce competition. Your solution is to know as much about what the college wants, needs and expects and show that.
Thanks for the replies you two; they’ve been helpful. My takeaway is that I should submit all my scores and to expect them to have a more or less neutral effect on my application. Do either of you have a source for your info? I’ve heard so many competing things.
Edit: I’m specifically wondering about sources for the info that my application will be net-better with the scores reported than without them.
Your 4’s and 5’s on AP tests say to Admissions you are “well qualified” or “qualified.” Your scores, while not ALL perfect, are top notch! So, what’s not to like!!!
Your scores are decent. The 4s on economics were a little bit unfortunate as those two are easy ones. But you also have 5s on harder ones, such as European History and English Literature. Combining with your (unknown) SAT/ACT scores, I would say a score between 2 and 3 for your academics.
I’d report all of them except the self studied Econ 4’s. That way they’ll see all your scores on classes that are reported on your transcript, so it won’t look as if you’re hiding anything, plus they’ll see that you had the initiative to take (and score a 5 on) Comparative Government.
It’s the internal Harvard scoring that’s come out as part of the lawsuit. As far as I’m aware, self-reported AP scores don’t play a significant role in it.
It’s too soon for an outside observer to know exactly how H assesses. And there’s sometimes an urge to want to rank one element more important than another. But in holistic, it all presents a picture. Each piece is input. Bottom line is: no one can predict a rating just with a course listing and scores.
OP, in admissions to a tippy top, there’s a lot you can’t control for. It’s important to do your own very best on your full app and any supp. The competition is nuts. As ski pointed out, kids do get in with 4 scores. But adcoms arr looking for the right full presentation. Don’t assume any less.
I liken the various components of the application to the Avengers; they are all important in their own way, but there’s a reason that the guy who shoots trick arrows and the dude that shrinks didn’t go up against Thanos. AP scores represent Hawkeye.
There has been much publicized about the recent Harvard lawsuit, and many details, previously considered priviliged information, has been posted on the internet. I will admit that I have not scrubbed through them all meticulously, but in my cursory glance, nowhere are AP scores mentioned.
^ Which favors both of our positions. They may not always be either a clear boon or a bust. But in a fierce competition, imo, no detail can be presumed not important. Fitzsimmons was quoted in the past saying AP scores are a prime indicator. Granted, that was some time ago.
OP’s 4’s are not bad. But many kids will have more 5 scores. I suggest he play to the strengths he ‘can’ control for, at this point. We don’t know what his are.
In general, that’s Activities, all short answers, getting the right LoRs, and ensuring the personal statement shows the attributes they seek. Can do. But no guarantees. Anything can tip a kid out of the pool, including geo diversity.
Which is a reason why I don’t say AP scores carry no importance. And Fitzsimmon’s quote was from 9 years ago, which is a lifetime in the college admissions arena.
But I think we are all saying variations of the same thing - everything is considered. And there’s also an intangible “it” factor that comes into play. The reality is that Harvard will reject 95% of applicants, most of whom could have done quite well at Harvard. We can give out perspective, but as @lookingforward says, there are no guarantees (at least for ~99.9% of applicants).
@skieurope, @lookingforward, do you two agree with the advice that my best option, with regard to AP scores, is to self-report all but the economics scores? Or would it be best to report those too?
