worried about my engineering letters of rec

Graduate School
1

<p>I'm considering applying to top phD programs, probably in either applied physics or electrical engineering. Although my gpa and GRE scores are ok, 3.85 in math/physics double major, and 800 Q, 490 verbal, and 5.0 AW, I'm very concerned about the strength of my letters of rec.</p>

<p>prof #1: I did an REU with him last year, and he mentioned that he would gladly write me a letter of rec if I apply to grad schools. He wrote me a letter for the REUs I applied for this summer (I rejected those and did an internship instead)</p>

<p>prof #2: I took a class with this prof, got an A, sort of got to know him, but that class was a year and a half ago. My guess is that he wrote 'Student did well in my class' for the letters of rec he wrote for me that got me into the REU last year</p>

<p>prof #3: I have no clue who to ask. I have 3 options: profs A, B, and C
A: I probably saw him in office hours only once or so. I got an A in his class, but I think he barely knew me. But since I transferred to my university last year, I had to ask him for the letter of rec to get into REUs. Apparently his and prof #2's letters were decent enough to get me into an REU. However, last semester I helped out prof 3A with his research for about a week, but I think I told him that I changed my mind and decided to help out prof 3B with his research instead. All I remember is that I contacted 3A to tell him that I updated the powerpoint presentation that I was gonna present to his research team, but he did'nt respond. I then asked him if he knew of any companies that were looking for summer interns (I was looking for summer internships this summer), and he didnt respond to that email either</p>

<p>B: He's a post-doc in applied math, and I helped him with his research for 1 semester, which consisted mostly of just programming and data-entry. However, he ignored my email when I first tried to contact him to help him with his research. I had to see him in his office for him to agree to hire me as his assistant. Then, a few weeks ago, I emailed him again to say I can help him with his research this upcoming semester, and he ignored me again! I'm hesitant to help him with his research this upcoming semester</p>

<p>C: I took his class for 2 semesters of quantum mechanics. He seemed to know the names of most of the students in the class, but only remembered my name towards the end of the 2nd semester. I got 2 A- in his classes</p>

<p>Which of the options is the best to ask for my 3rd letter of rec?</p>

<p>I don't know how reputable these profs are, but I can tell you this. I had prof #2 and prof #3A write me the letters of rec for last year's REU, and i got into 2/13 of the programs I applied to. This year, I had prof #1 and prof #2 write the letters of rec for this year's REUs, and I got into 2/3 of the programs I applied to. Then again, when I applied last year, I only had 1 semester's worth of university classes on my transcript, after transferring from a community college</p>

<p>Clearly, my letters of rec arent the strongest, in fact, possibly even very weak. Thus, I'm considering either just accepting the fact that I won't go to a top school, or I may decide to just wait another year or so, and do research with another prof during that time, and get a good letter of rec from him. Is the latter a good idea for my situation?</p>

2

<p>There is a law of diminishing expectations with LOR’s - very very few will have 3 stellar letters. Nonetheless, you are correct, yours are on the weak side. I would recommend that if you use person #3b and that you might want to try to maintain the relationship so that he maintains the quality of his letter. Remember, a lot of academics are hard to reach by email - they get a lot of junk and a lot of requests, so it is hard for many of them to seperate the “keepers” from the “keep-outs”. One of my strongest LOR’s came from a guy who I was only able to contact only twice - he replied to one email agreeing to write the LOR, and in December confirmed that he had written it only after I caught him in a local coffee shop! The fact that you have done some research with him (however small the role) will make his letter much more valuable than another “A in my class” letter.</p>

3

<p>But I had to contact prof #3b usually more than once per week by email, and he responded to every email, when I helped him with his research last semester, as my work involved programming at the computer lab. I hardly saw in person (only three times or so) to discuss the progress of my research. Which is why I see his ignoring my emails as more than just that he wants to ignore junk email</p>

4

<p>Rather than guessing, go find out. There are a lot of people who only respond to emails when they want something, not when something is wanted from them. Go ask him in person, if he says no then you are no worse off than before.</p>

5

<p>ok, I’ll see him in person soon. I forgot to mention that when I walked into his office to ask if I could help him with his research a few months ago, he mentioned that he ignored my email but was sorry, if that means anything</p>

6

<p>It does mean something, namely exactly what he said. I worked with a professor for a summer and I wanted to work with him during the semester as well. Anyway, after sending 3 emails and getting no reply, I went to his office. He apologized and we went straight to work.</p>

<p>Most professors read emails, tell themselves they’ll reply later and forget. The best way to contact a professor is by going to his office.</p>

7

<p>oh ok, that certainly is a sign of relief, as I didn’t know profs were like that</p>

8

<p>I wouldn’t say profs. I’d say people. In this age of spamming and massive amounts of emails that we get, it is so easy to forget to reply. I do it often enough too.</p>

9

<p>man… professor replying an email to a student took his class more than a year ago… it’s like President Obama replying an email to his college friend</p>

<p>you are the last person on their “to help” list, you just gotta take the initiative,
sometimes professors seeing students using email to ask for something is a sign of lazyness/unrespect</p>

10

<p>^which prof are you referring to? prof 3A? He ignored my email AFTER i joined his research group, even though he had responded to every previous email, so I thought he was starting to ignore me as he sensed that I was uninterested in the research project</p>

<p>Anyways, if i ask 3B for a letter of rec for grad schools, how can I make a better impression in front of him considering that we only saw each other in person a few times last year, and will probably only see each other a few more times this semester, since I work in the computer lab?</p>

<p>if the quality of my letters stay the way they currently are, do I have any chance at the top 20 grad schools in EE?</p>

11

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<p>No one will be able to answer this. First of all, you don’t know the quality of your LORs. And sometimes all it takes is one excellent letter. Next, as you know, too many factors go into grad school acceptances for them to boil down to LORs, as important as those are. Yes, if all three are bland, informationally weak letters, it will be tough for you. But you really don’t know how convincing yours LORs will be.</p>

<p>Relax. You cannot change what is already done. Apply. If grad school is really important for you to begin next year, make sure you include less competitive programs with the others. Otherwise, you can apply only to top 20 programs, and, if you don’t get in, then you can use the year to strengthen your application for the following cycle.</p>

12

<p>Slightly disagree with mom on the “you don’t know the quality of your LOR”</p>

<p>I’ve seen someone once said “If you are not sure about the quality of your LOR, then you probably shouldn’t ask LOR from that professor”, take my case for example, the “good professor” happily agreed to help me calling my dream professor and I received offer letter right after. After working with your boss for 1-2 years, you really should know inside-out what your professor will say about you.</p>

<p>It’s probably not realistic to be in great terms with all 3 professors, but if you have been working hard in lab, at least 1 of the letters you should have good idea of the quality, like Mom said one good letter is important. But yes the other 2 letters you will have no idea, bottom line is to have at least one strong letter, and do NOT trust what the professor say to you when you ask for letter.</p>

13

<p>Mr. Zoo, here’s the issue: some profs are not good at writing LORs, and others can make the student sound stronger than he is. Unless you see the actual letter, you cannot know this.</p>

<p>But, yes, obviously you can have a good idea based on conversations with a professor. If you hear unsolicited comments such as “you’re a natural researcher” or “you’re better than most of my grad students,” then you’ll probably get a wonderful letter. But if you’ve worked with a prof and haven’t heard anything like this, it doesn’t mean that you won’t get a glowing letter. Some profs know you better than you might think. Conversely, the ones who know you really well might write perfunctory letters or recommendations filled with superficial comments.</p>

14

<p>‘Otherwise, you can apply only to top 20 programs, and, if you don’t get in, then you can use the year to strengthen your application for the following cycle.’</p>

<p>how would i use the year to strengthen my application? If I find a job after I graduate, but then later find out I dont get into my grad schools of choice, would it really be worth it to quit that job just to do research with a prof to strengthen my letters of rec?</p>

15

<p>There are always things you can do to strengthen your application if you were unsuccessful at your desired skills:</p>

<p>Retake the GRE for a better score.</p>

<p>Take relevent grad-courses as a non-degree student.</p>

<p>Participate in research, either at work or “on your own time” with a professor.</p>

<p>Cultivate better relationships with new/old letter writers to get better LOR’s.</p>

<p>Improve your SOP(s) to present your case in a more focused and relevent manner.</p>

<p>There’s lots of stuff.</p>

16

<p>‘Cultivate better relationships with new/old letter writers to get better LOR’s’</p>

<p>well if I leave school to get a job somewhere, how can I cultivate better relationships with my profs?</p>

17

<p>I just emailed prof 2 about writing letters for me, and while he agreed, he mentioned that its been awhile since I was in his class, so he suggested i ask someone who’s work closer to me. Does that mean I’m better off asking 3C?</p>