<p>^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^</p>
<p>I know some people truly believe this, but over the course of a long life, in many different jobs, and living all over the globe, I'd have to say that this is very much over-emphasized.</p>
<p>Basically, it boils down to this - if you're good at what you do, you'll have opportunities throughout life, regardless of your college of origin. What ivy league college did Bill Gates graduate from?</p>
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<blockquote> <p>social scene (Cambridge/Boston-Theater! Dancing! So much food!<<</p> </blockquote>
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<p>My D thought that she would be in Boston every weekend while at college. Truth is, she doesn't leave Cambridge much except to go to the symphony (and to NYC on breaks). So I wouldn't choose Harvard over UCLA because of the social scene.</p>
<p>But she has found the new people and the new environment to be huge plusses to broaden her experience.</p>
<p>If you aspire to work in one of the top-tier law firms on the east coast some day, then you should go to Harvard. Those firms (this is what I do for a living) ONLY recruit from the Harvard, Yale, Columbia, NYU, Boalt law schools and, all things being equal, you'd be more likely to get in from Harvard undergrad. That said, you could get into any other law school in the country from UCLA if you have the stats and have a wonderful and successful life. It all depends on your future plans. I've known many lawyers over the years in private practice or public interest law who are professionally and financially successful and live beautiful lives coming out of lesser known law schools. It comes down to deciding your priorities, both now and later, and then seeing which school best fits those goals. You should consider sitting down with a piece of paper and making a list of priorities in the immediate term, in five years and in ten years. You may surprise yourself.</p>
<p>Ah, somehow I imagine those east coast firms manage to stumble their way to Stanford Law (only ranked #2 by US News this year). And I suppose Philadelphia law firms have never heard of oh, what is, it, oh, yeah, University of Pennsylvania. (But,yes, the fancy corporate law firms do recruit at a select set of schools; it just isn't as narrow as zoosermom says.)</p>
<p>Anyway, I happen to be at one of the larger law firms, with offices across the country. Of current lawyers, 55 went to Harvard Undergrad; 30 went to UCLA undergrad. If you consider just Associates -- which picks up more current hiring practices -- there are 20 Harvard Undergrad; 17 UCLA undergrad. Yes, the UCLA undergrads tend to concentrate in the West Coast offices, but many find their way east.</p>
<p>$100,000 is a lot of money.</p>
<p>(But,yes, the fancy corporate law firms do recruit at a select set of schools; it just isn't as narrow as zoosermom says.)</p>
<p>My list was intended to be representative, not exhaustive. The point was individual priorities, not law firm recruiting.</p>
<p>But it seems that the big law firms recruit based on what law school the individual attended, not the undergraduate school. And a very smart kid who is Harvard-worthy would most likely be at the top at UCLA -- and thus likely to get in to a top-notch law school (Harvard, Yale, columbia, NYU, etc.) Is being an undergraduate at Harvard a guarantee to getting into Harvard Law? Or is the competition fierce among the undergraduates? Just asking. </p>
<p>I wonder whether this is analogous to the notion (raised by Jay Matthews a few years ago) that to get into a top tier college, it is better to go to a regular high school and stand out at the top instead of going to a competitive private school or magnet program where the student may be in the top among many many others.</p>
<p>Again, there is no evidence whatsoever that a student who attends H. undergraduate with very substantial financial need has any advantage whatsoever in admission to Harvard Law than that same student who attended 40 or 50 other colleges or universities. The data to support such a conclusion, or even to infer such a conclusion, just doesn't exist - and it would be quite "interesting" to break down the family income, parental occupation, and legacy status of H. undergrads attending H. Law.</p>
<p><<<< But it seems that the big law firms recruit based on what law school the individual attended, not the undergraduate school. And a very smart kid who is Harvard-worthy would most likely be at the top at UCLA -- and thus likely to get in to a top-notch law school (Harvard, Yale, columbia, NYU, etc.) Is being an undergraduate at Harvard a guarantee to getting into Harvard Law? Or is the competition fierce among the undergraduates? Just asking. >>></p>
<p>My thoughts, too. </p>
<p>By the way Burnthis, I never suggested that someone could go from UCLA to Harvard/Yale Law and STRAIGHT to the Supreme Court. My remark was in reference to the comment about Harriet Myers not going to an Ivy law school and therefore "not acceptable" to many. </p>
<p>My point (and it was obvious) was that going to UCLA AND THEN to Harvard Law (or Yale Law) would not put the OP in the same position as Harriet Myers (who I believe went to SMU Law) who had never been a judge and was further "suspect" because she hadn't gone to an Ivy Law.</p>
<p>But it seems that the big law firms recruit based on what law school the individual attended, not the undergraduate school. And a very smart kid who is Harvard-worthy would most likely be at the top at UCLA -- and thus likely to get in to a top-notch law school (Harvard, Yale, columbia, NYU, etc.) Is being an undergraduate at Harvard a guarantee to getting into Harvard Law? Or is the competition fierce among the undergraduates? Just asking. </p>
<p>The competition is FIERCE among undergraduates. Law school is quite popular these days. You are right and I hope that I made it clear that law firms recruit based on law schools. They certainly do, but Harvard undergrad grads hold an advantage there, as well. I guess what I'm saying is that if your dream is to be a partner in one of the big law firms, then choose the Ivy League school. If something else holds your heart, go with UCLA and ditch the debt.</p>
<p>Does anyone know where the stats are for those admitted to H or Y Law? Such as how many are from which undergrad schools? Are their law school admits overwelmingly from fellow ivies (or H & Y in particular)?</p>
<p>dstark </p>
<p>thanks!!!! Great list.</p>
<p>Seems that UCLA does pretty well in the admits dept. Not as well as H or Y but about as well as the other Ivies.</p>
<p>This list also gives some insight into what H thinks about various other colleges.</p>
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This list also gives some insight into what H thinks about various other colleges.
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<p>I would not take the statistics as indicative of what HLS thinks about various colleges and universities. Although the number Yale admits was only half the number of H grads, it may be due to the fact that more Yalies applied to Yale law School (ranked #1 by many) than to Harvard. UCLA and Cal did well in the sweepstakes, but I also think many of their grads applied to Boalt Hall or Stanford. Ditto for Chicago or Columbia.</p>
<p>Unless you know how many applied, and what their academic qualifications were on admission to undergrad, it basically tells you nothing at all.</p>
<p>
[quote]
But it seems that the big law firms recruit based on what law school the individual attended, not the undergraduate school.
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</p>
<p>Big law firms do NOT disregard the undergraduate school. It is one of several elements in making a successful application to a big law firm. The undergraduate school is not the ONLY element, or even the most important element, in seeking a job that requires a professional school degree, but it can matter--I have seen it matter. UCLA is a better-than-average state university, and not a place with a lousy reputation among lawyers, but Harvard is Harvard, and the original poster, were I his parent, would see me exhausting my creditworthiness and cutting back on personal spending if he were admitted to Harvard, so that he could go to Harvard. </p>
<p>Best wishes to the OP and his family in weighing the alternatives.</p>
<p>Doesn't it matter whether the OP actually wants to work in a big high-powered law firm? I'm a lawyer, and I knew that this was exactly where I did not want to work, despite the lucrative salaries. (And don't forget - if you're getting that salary in NY, you have to live in NY, which costs a lot, and you won't have a lot of extra time to spend it.) But if the OP spends all that money on Harvard, he may feel obligated to take one of those high powered big law firm jobs just to pay back the loans and to make that Harvard education "worth it". </p>
<p>That's not my idea of "keeping all options open." Each choice closes off something.</p>
<p>Well truth be told, I'm not sure at all what sector (corporate vs public interest) I'd like to be working in, nor can I even be absolutely sure I want to do law at all. I guess in that sense it means I should be looking at the schools from a compromising perspective? As in, which school will keep as many doors open as possible. Ahhhh, so much money on the line! And I thought buying a hamburger yesterday was expensive! :)</p>
<p>Just became aware of another development: going to UC means I can take advantage of AP credits and graduates in two or three years. I know I already qualify for advanced standing which means if I really have to I can graduate from Harvard in three years (though I hear it adversely affects your chances of admission to law schools/job opportunities because you had less time to develop extracurrics etc.). Thank you for all your input!</p>
<p>the company that i work for did a study about the top ceo's of companies and where (or if) they got their mba from. the results showed that only a very very very small percentage got their mba's from a top school. actually, if i'm remembering right, more of them had NO mba as opposed to having an mba from a top school.</p>
<p>If money is not an issue, then I would recommend you go to Harvard.</p>
<p>It is the number one univesity in the world. It will add significant weight to your graduate application. It will add significant weight to your career becasue the WORLD is now focused on American brand names and Harvard has the top brand name in the US.</p>
<p>UCLA is great, but 95% of the students are from California. It cannot offer the same social experience as a school with wider diversity.</p>
<p>Harvard, if you can afford it, is worth the money.</p>