<p>I wouldn’t call it deflated. As difficult as the classes are, everyone is very smart and people certainly get A’s. Doing pretty well but not great will probably get you a B (3.0) and it’s entirely possible to get a C (2.0) if you struggle and do average to sub-par.</p>
<p>@Bigdoglover</p>
<p>I do believe there are programs for admitted students - I believe they include information about it along with your acceptance materials. I’m not too familiar with the spanish program; I know it’s decently strong, but I don’t know how it compares to other top colleges. As far as school spirit - obviously DIII athletics aren’t that big of a draw, and in my opinion there isn’t an especially large school spirit. That might be a problem for some, but it doesn’t really bother me at all. It’s still a great place to be. I’m not aware of there being a club field hockey team, however.</p>
<p>@TDOC55
I’ll just second what biocellular said. Write (or have your child write) them a letter explaining their great interest, but that you simply cannot afford to attend without more aid - as of now, other schools are offering more money. Might not work, but it can’t hurt.</p>
<p>@Aerobug
Nothing you can do right now will get you accepted. If after freshman year you still want to attend washu, you can apply as a transfer, but the acceptance rate for those isn’t that high. At this point, I’d look for the school other than washu where I’d be happiest.</p>
<p>@bosox17 and @DreamsAreReal
I believe that every class I’ve taken so far has been graded on a curve - thus the ease of earning an A depends at least partially on the competence of your classmates. I can’t speak for Olin, but premed courses are quite difficult - they teach a lot of information, and they expect you to know it all for the tests. There is no graded homework, so the tests (or labs) are your only grades. It takes hard work and dedication - you cannot simply blow it off and expect to get a good grade. That being said, if washu accepts you, then they believe you are capable of succeeding at washu. Acceptances aren’t random (contrary to appearances), and chances are that you can do well here if you put effort into it.</p>
<p>bigdoglover (& RyanMK) - there used to be a club field hockey team. They are not currently active (at least, they don’t have a operating account anymore), so you’d have to (re)start it up yourself if you wanted to play.</p>
<p>Thanks so much for the reply RyanMK (and Johnson181). Its very helpful to get these insights when making a decision. I was hoping for the field hockey club - looking for that thing that might push my D over the edge for WashU.</p>
<p>Some more feedback on 1) accepted student visit program 2) help paying for WashU 3) difficulty of Pre-med. </p>
<p>WashU does have an accepted RD student visit program - they will pay the airfare for your D and she will stay in a dorm. If it isn’t included in the acceptance package, call Admissions. </p>
<p>WashU has a philosophy that they will work with you to make the finances work. I didn’t apply for FA and my parents make a lot (our FASFA didn’t support getting aid). WashU gave me two subsidized loans. They even worked with me to increase my Perkins loan to what I needed. This was done after I accepted (ED). Friends of mine had their FA increased after they receive the letter on their award. </p>
<p>Regarding Pre-med. I am not trying to scare you. It is difficult. The classes are scaled. Almost everyone is a top student and I think 20-25% got an A in Gen Chem I last semester. This semester the mean in Bio will be scaled to a B-. To give you a comparison I got a 5 on AP Bio and a 4 on AP Chem I got a B in Chem I and hope to get a B+ in Bio. I also have Chem II this semester. Each Chem also has a separate Chem Lab (class and a Lab) which is 2 credits graded separately.</p>
<p>@Bigdoglover
Regarding school spirit:
WashU has school spirit but it is different than a school with D1 sports.
WashU’s school spirit is around many interest - sports is one of them (we have some very good D3 teams that are fun to watch), school activities including concerts, dorm olympics, intramurals and spring carnival, school clubs (you can develop a strong group of friends) and greek life. The Residental College structure builds close groups in your dorm and on your floor. You will see it the first day you are their during Convocation when each Res College enters going nuts with their chants etc.</p>
<p>Students are WashU enjoy being with people similar to them. They do take pride in being part of an academically university.</p>
<p>Thanks so much for your answer, onecot! Yeah, Chem is my weakest subject. I had an A- throughout all of high school, although I did get a 750 on the SAT II. Would that still be on the low end? Would I most likely be in the C range? Or B-? The one thing I’m most afraid of is Chemistry…It’s probably not easy at any school, but is it going to be “hard” at WashU compared to other schools? Like how would Cornell/Brown/NU’s pre-med be compared to WashU?</p>
<p>While people certainly do get Cs or worse, I believe that if you are dedicated to doing well in the class, and take advantage of all the available resources (there are a ton), then anyone should be able to get a B-. I’m not speaking from experience, but I would guess that washu’s premed program might be a bit more strenuous than the schools’ you mentioned.</p>
<p>I have no idea about the difficulty of the pre-med courses at the other schools.
I agree with Ryan about the resources. For the Chemistry courses they offer a peer learning class. You go for 2 hours every weekend. It isn’t offered for Biology. </p>
<p>I disagree with Ryan that anyone that is dedicated and uses the resources should be able to get a B-.</p>
<p>I believe that 25% of Fr. Pre-med students will drop pre-med by the end of their first year at WashU. I also recall a WashU thread from last year that overall 50% of students who initially plan to do pre-med change at WashU. I don’t know how this compares to other top universities.</p>
<p>Another piece of info, many students take organic chem during the summer (some at WashU and others at college near their home).</p>
<p>I apologize, I worded my last post quite poorly. It was not my intention to imply that those students who received lower than a B- simply did not try to do well in the class. Instead, I wanted to say that a B- should be reasonable goal/expectation going into the class if you are prepared to take advantage of your resources. It’s a difficult class, and it may simply be that you can’t possibly do that well, but I wouldn’t go in thinking that way.</p>
<p>Thanks Ryan and onecot! Now I know what I should expect at Wash U. It’s a bit intimidating so far, but who knows? Thanks so much!</p>
<p>I’m not class of 2017, but I am a junior who’s currently researching schools. What’s your favorite place to hang out at WashU?</p>
<p>oh wow, this is really scaring me. So you mean to say that all of these genius kids with 35 act scores and a million AP classes and crazy amounts of extracurriculars filling up their time and 4.0s can’t handle the stress of premed classes? uh oh
Is the material just a lot to memorize or too difficult to conceptually understand? Are the tests written in a way that make them unnecessarily hard? Are the kids that get A’s just way smarter/studious than the rest of their classmates (which says a lot seeing as everyone is smart)? I’m just worried that I am not smart enough to get an A, or even a B, regardless of how hard I work or how many parties I skip or how much sleep I give up to study or whatever :(.
Is the first chemistry class a review of what you learned in AP chem? The last chem class I took was in 10th grade, and I don’t even remember the most elementary/simple things. I think this will be a huge disadvantage for me…</p>
<p>Lots of people struggle at Wash U, same as any other college. The simple fact is that most people found high school to be easy, and that simply isn’t the case at an institution like Wash U. If you study hard and spend the necessary time understanding and practicing the material, you can get an A. But the pre-med track is very difficult. Don’t expect to get anywhere near a 4.0 because you just won’t, and that’s fine with the top med schools. They know Wash U has rigorous academics so they won’t take one look at your application and immediately dismiss it for your 3.4 or 3.5 GPA.</p>
<p>In some cases there is a lot of material to memorize. In many cases the material is difficult to conceptually understand. In many cases the exams are made to be very difficult. It all depends on the class you’re taking.</p>
<p>For example, the first biology class you’ll take is all memorization. You’ll learn about lots of different enzymes, chemicals, cell parts, biological processes, etc. and you’ll have to memorize their names and functions for the exams.</p>
<p>Your first semester of chemistry is actually nothing like the chemistry classes you took in high school–it’s entirely based on quantum mechanics. The material is difficult and completely foreign to incoming freshmen. However, the gen chem professors tend to be very good lecturers so it’s not impossible to understand the material if you go to class and really try to understand the underlying concepts. But if you tend to skip class with the intention of making sure you watch the lecture videos “sometime before the exam,” you’re probably setting yourself up to not do well. The exams are pretty difficult and it will take complete knowledge of everything (i.e. concepts of quantum mechanics and knowing how to do appropriate calculations) to do well. The second semester of gen chem is much more like what you’ve done in high school, with chemical reactions and equilibrium and such. I didn’t take this course, but I can assure you it’s also very difficult.</p>
<p>Complementary to the gen chem lecture course is a two-credit chem lab course, which is stupidly difficult. As a freshman, you’ll have the luxury of being able to study and do the pre-labs and lab reports with people you might meet on your floor. I didn’t have that luxury as I took my required semester of gen chem my sophomore year. The course itself is just dumb. Depending on who you are, you may find the lab procedures somewhat interesting. However, the professor makes the class much harder than it needs to be. And when I say that, I mean she puts things on the exams/lab reports that she never even teaches in lecture. It’s stupid. I don’t know how or why she expects you to know some of those things, but she does. The midterm and final are pretty difficult and the grading is set up so that it’s hard to get an A but also fairly hard to get a C or lower, i.e. there are a lot of B’s.</p>
<p>You’ll take a year of physics, which isn’t terrible. The material is difficult because it is more complex than what you took in high school and also teaches some concepts you may not have ever seen before (relativity comes to mind, in particular). But if you do the readings, pay attention in lecture, and do the homework, this is probably the class you can most easily get an A in. I won’t begin to go very in-depth about which specific courses/professors to take since you’re not even enrolled yet, but the format for Physics 197/198 (as opposed to 117/118) keeps you on top of the material due to mandatory homework assignments. It’s a pain, but very helpful.</p>
<p>Pre-med also requires a solid background in math, so you’ll take calculus. Depending on your exposure to calculus in high school, you’ll probably take either single- or multi-variable calculus.</p>
<p>I won’t even delve into organic chemistry because I don’t know anything about it, except that it’s even harder than gen chem. I think it’s pretty much considered the hardest pre-med course. If you didn’t learn IUPAC in high school, you’ll definitely need it for orgo. It can be tricky to learn, and that’s just the naming convention for organic molecules.</p>
<p>Sorry for the huge wall of text. I’m not trying to scare you, but this is my honest perception of the kind of course load you’ll see in just your freshman year (minus organic). There are plenty of resources to help you out, but there is definitely no hand-holding. It’s a ton of work, it’s very hard, and it takes a lot of time and effort. You’ll still have time to go to parties, hang out with friends, and enjoy yourself. But even if you don’t do any of that, you still won’t get a 4.0. Academics in college are very different from what they are in high school. It’s daunting at first, but you quickly get used to it.</p>
<p>I completely agree with ravnzcroft just said. I will expand a bit on orgo though. It entails quite a bit of memorization - you are presented a few reactions each lecture, and you are expected to know them all for the test. It’s a bit less of pure memorization than bio, as it entails memorizing general concepts then applying them to specific cases. The concepts can be a bit difficult, but not as much as 1st semester gen chem.</p>
<p>Edit: Also IUPAC isn’t really necessary. They teach the basics, and that’s all you’re really expected to know.</p>
<p>TDOC55 - We are in the EXACT same position as you. If I didn’t know better I could have written your post. Wash U is her #1 and we want to also try and find way to make it happen for her as well. We have merit awards from other schools and if nothing comes through from WashU it will be emotional but we will have to go elsewhere. A loan is the last thing we would want to take on. I wish you all the best and just wanted you to know you are not alone.</p>
<p>I’m not class of 2017 either but WashU has been my dream school for a while. After looking through some threads i’m scared that I may not be academically qualified enough to get in 
I’m a junior and wanted to know if theres anything I could do to display my interest in the school. I really feel like it’s perfect for me. I’m visiting later this month. Would visiting multiple times help?</p>
<p>Also, does anyone know if applying to Olin and minoring in art is possible? Cause i really want to go into marketing but also have a huge passion for art (i’ve been doing it ever since I could remember) and I’m well aware that WashU has an outstanding art program. Thanks!!!</p>
<p>Well, some things to show interest involve joining the mailing list, visiting (go on tour and to info session), doing an interview, and applying ED (if that happens to be feasible in your situation). I doubt visiting multiple times will be worth it.</p>
<p>I’m pretty sure that majoring in Olin while minoring in Sam Fox is possible.</p>
<p>@satanonymous Visiting once is sufficient, but make sure you get an on-campus interview. Also, I recommend that you submit an additional essay explaining your academic interests and why you want to go to WashU. You can contact your admissions counselor about this when next year’s application is up. I did all of this and I was accepted on Friday to Olin with an average ACT score by WashU standards (33 superscored). Also, it is completely possible for you to also have a minor in art. Best of luck to you!</p>
<p>@Ryan thanks!! I’ve done all of what you said and plan on applying ED, except for the interview. Is that done after I’ve applied?</p>