My daughter is in love with Yale, in particular and then Brown. She has very high test scores; she’s been a straight A student Sophomore and Junior year. But she had a mixed Freshman year with As and Bs during the COVID remote year, which was a hard year for us as a family – as it was for most people.
She wants to EA Yale, but I am thinking the weaker Freshman year would make admissions impossible and not sure whether to dissuade her or not. How much sympathy is there for the difficult remote freshman year?
There’s a lot more to admissions than strong grades and a strong test score - whatever that is. There’s rigor, essays, LORs. ECs and more.
At Brown, 70% have a 750 SAT for reading and 87% a 750.
Your student could be perfect with high rigor ahd still not get in. But she does need to apply to have a chance. Brown accepted 5% last year. Yale even lower.
Don’t fall in love with any school. The most important school on the list - the safety. There are many schools out there where your student can thrive.
Good luck.
As for applying early, if there are no private early action schools of interest or if others respond after Jan 1, then go ahead if that’s the true desire.
Applying Early to Other Colleges and Universities
Single-Choice Early Action applicants may also apply through other early admissions programs if the other program fits any of the descriptions below:
The early admissions program is a non-binding rolling admission program.
The early admissions program is a non-binding early program at a public institution.
The early admissions program is an Early Decision or Early Action program that notifies applicants after January 1.
The early admissions program is at an institution outside the United States.
My feeling is nobody really knows what colleges are going to do with this cohort and their first years in HS being the COVID year.
So here is some advice I like. Start by assuming your GPA just is what it is. Identify a couple each of likelies, targets, and reaches given that assumption, and which would be affordable and you would love to attend.
OK, now go ahead and add a couple more each of targets and reaches assuming instead your first year is ignored.
You are now solidly covered either way.
Sounds like Yale and Brown could be her reaches assuming her first year is ignored. Assuming they would be affordable, those are fine choices for those slots, so go for it.
I would not go for Yale unless she has truly outstanding extracurriculars with strong leadership positions. Yale early will be looking for extraordinary accomplishments inside and outside the classroom. Academics alone will not be enough and you will likely get deferred, which is unhelpful as it keeps the hope alive. If she has very strong scores and academics and can do a great job on the video submission, but not outstanding extracurriculars with leadership, I would go Brown ED, even if both are a reach for anyone.
No sympathy for an average excellent student. Maybe some sympathy for hooked kids, which she doesn’t seem to be. There will be students who managed straight A’s during Covid, and there will still be a zillion applicants to both schools. She should apply EA if she really loves it, understanding that she needs a balanced list.
Unless one is a Dean of Admissions somewhere I do not see how one can say definitively there is no flexibility/understanding for a rough COVID year.
If I had to guess, I would think a covid year fall off wouldn’t be a positive but wouldn’t be a disqualifying negative. There are so many different situations, kids, and schools, and I do belive AO’s are basically empathetic people who know they are working with imperfect 13/14/15/16 year olds.
Brown is easy to fall in love with. I assume Yale is too, although we never toured there. My daughter’s grades are much like yours, with some B’s the covid/online 9th grade year, and almost all A’s since. I’ve encouraged her to fall “in love” (or at least “in strong like” as no school is perfect) with a couple likely schools, one has a 40-50% acceptance rate, the other is 80%. The current admissions climate is tough for average excellent applicants, girls especially. Go ahead and apply but also make sure she applies to at least 2 schools she has a good chance at being admitted to and would be happy to attend (and are affordable to your family). ETA she still has 3 schools with under 20% admit rates on her list
We don’t know enough to comment. If she has extraordinary accomplishments outside of school, in the arts for instance, she might have a chance. Holistic admissions is not hierarchical in the sense that all A’s gets in instead of all A’s and one B, or a 1580 versus a 1540. Schools like Yale want an interesting mix of students.
Check out the website for Colleges that Change Lives and google “little Ivies” for ideas.
But we need some that aren’t uber reaches too - and we know little about the student - but they’re smaller - but Grinnell (somewhat reach and Kalamazoo (easier and solid) have open curriculum - as does Rochester I believe and Wake has an option.
OK - so there’s Kalamazoo - much smaller but safe for open.
For Yale - and correct me where I’m off - Wheaton I’ve seen mentioned as an easier admit.
I just hate when I see lists - and when they show subs they show all heavy reaches. On one website, it says Wheaton combines the best of Brown and Yale - just crazy luck.
Just a few other thoughts that might be attainable - not that Brown/Yale aren’t for this student - we don’t know.
These are two VERY different schools in almost every way I can think of. Location. Breadth of curriculum. Religious affiliation. Size of town. Deep enough pockets to provide need based aid to higher earners.
Maybe the open curriculum is the only similarity.
Any student who is considering Yale, really needs to visit Wheaton. These schools are very very different.
While Yale and Brown admissions rates are 5% or below, your chances are 0 if you don’t apply. If your daughter has test scores at or above 1500 or 34, she should give it a shot but with realistic expectations that admission will be unlikely and have matches and safeties on her list. Contrary to popular belief, plenty of unhooked “average excellent” applicants without national awards or newsworthy EC’s are accepted at highly selective colleges. What we don’t see is the way the LoR’s and essays tie with academic and EC interests/accomplishments. The EC can be mundane, but what the applicant has done can be distinguishing and memorable to the AO.
One other note on REA for Yale. Yale has moved away from deferring most in the REA round. Last year Yale accepted 776 out of almost 7,800 applicants. 5,188 were rejected (67%) and 1,626 were deferred.
It may be - I can’t speak to either although I’ve been to Yale many years ago. But alas, I relied on a list and here’s what it says - frankly, I was dumbfounded it mentioned those two schools and no others - like a dream for OP come true.
We like to think of Wheaton as a school that combines the best parts of Yale and Brown. Wheaton students are a little bit crunchy and a lot a bit intellectual, driven, creative, and eager to strive for change. The college’s proximity to both Boston (50 mins) and Providence (30 mins) makes it feel like a true scholarly sanctuary. This means that students aren’t running off to “the city” every night, making the social and extracurricular scenes on campus varied and stimulating. Students who attend Wheaton enjoy the depth of academic creativity, something Yale students speak about as well. Students rave about Wheaton’s engaging “connections” curriculum which requires students to take courses (or create their own) that combine two seemingly disparate interests.
This in turn implies your chances after deferral are higher now, although it would be nice if such statistics were published.
Incidentally, all this has been tied to Yale changing its process, including in response to the increased volume of applications, many not very competitive in the end. They now have a first step, what they call Initial Review, where a senior AO does a quick screen for non-competitive applications. If it looks strong enough, it goes to an area AO for full review. If not, it is fast tracked for likely rejection.
And one of the things they are looking for in the Initial Review (this is all from the Yale Admissions podcast on the change) is that “You need to have a strong and consistent academic record that’s showing strength, especially in your most recent semesters.”
That’s a rather interesting statement for the OP, because of course while their academic record is not perfectly consistent, it maybe fits this condition in their most recent semesters, and then there is a reason for the inconsistency early on.
Does that mean I know the OP is going to pass the Initial Review? Very much not. I don’t know exactly how that AO will evaluate that academic record, and that in turn is one of just several criteria in the Initial Review.
But it is things like that which make me think it is fine to give it a shot at Yale, at least as long as you think the rest of the application will be competitive. And then have a robust set of other options if that doesn’t work out.