<p>Does anyone else seem to think Princeton and Yale are extremely alike? I just got back from visiting both of them in a two-day span, and it really seems like they are practically (look-wise) the same school (only yale somewhat in the city and princeton in a suburbia, on a closed campus). I love yale (accepted ea) but am still waiting to hear from princeton RD. </p>
<p>what are the main differences between these two schools, because i've certainly recognized many similarities?
thanks.</p>
<p>Yale was my first choice before visiting, but when I went I didn't really care for it. I ended up not even applying.
Princeton wasn't really in the running before I visited, but when I went, I fell in love. Now I'm holding my breath until April because there's nowhere I'd rather go.</p>
<p>I'm not really sure what to take from that except that sometimes these things aren't really logical.</p>
<p>Well, In my opinion, they don't look alike at all. Maybe that is just because I was at Yale on an extremely gloomy day. I think Princeton is the most beautiful place i've EVER seen!-and verrrry close to NYC in case you get bored with being in NJ.
The thing that separates Princeton from the 'pack' of similiar ivy league schools is its focus on the undergraduate program. Princeton IS an undergrad school for all practical purposes. Undergrad students get all the great professors while at other schools like harvard and yale, classes are often taught by TA's and the more 'famous' professors only work with graduate students. However, this is not to say that the Graduate programs at Princeton are weak...if fact they are extremely strong.</p>
<p>I loved them both too...and was also accepted EA to Yale! Yale ended up being hands-down my first choice, but that was mostly a sort of arbitrary decision, lol. I stayed overnight, and Princeton "felt" great, but Yale "felt" perfect. Plus Yale has a bit more focus than Princeton on my prospective major (history). I hope to see you in New Haven next year, but Princeton is a fabulous school too!!!</p>
<p>matty--I was in the exactly same position as you, I'm the class of 2009. I got accepted to Yale EA, and then applied to Princeton RD. I was torn until the last minute, sent in my Yes card to Yale, and then realized I made a mistake and switched to Princeton....here are some key differences I noticed:
-first off, the 4 year residential colleges vs. the eating clubs...Princeton is now trying to phase in 4 year colleges (right now they only have 2 year ones), and for the next couple of years there's going to be a mess of options for upperclassmen, ranging from full club membership to full 4-year college membership to a shared eating plan between the two, etc.
-Yale is definitely more geared towards the humanities. When I went for Bulldog Days, the general atmosphere on campus was the those "crazy" science people on Science Hill never had any time for fun, etc...also, the engineering departments are incredibly small in terms of # of people majoring in them per year, as compared to Princeton..in general, Princeton puts more money and attention and resources into its science and engineering departments--those simply aren't Yale's forte
-the general atmosphere and personality of the students--again, I can't comment on this without making at least some sweeping generalizations, but I found Yale students to be more artsy, theatrical, a little more esoteric, independent-minded, liberal, etc. It's not that Princeton doesn't have any of that, it's just that it's the predominant feeling Yale gives off, at least to me.
-there's no senior thesis requirement at Yale (I believe it's an option, only if you want to graduate with honors), and you can double-major at Yale (you can't at Princeton)
-you can't transfer to Princeton, so if you choose Yale over Princeton, you can never switch back after you matriculate (but you can vice versa)</p>
<p>there are other lots of little things. hope that helps</p>
<p>thanks guys. all of this is helping a lot.
voolvi,
can you comment on the general type of princeton student, like you said yalies seem to be artsy, theatrical, etc.</p>
<p>also, can you comment on your experience with academics. one worry that i have is that yale seems to be more relaxed in terms of grades. i think the best undergrad experience is one where you can study with and learn from the other thousands of amazing students that are admitted to these amazing schools, and fear that princeton students, with grade deflation, are less willing to work together (and i'm hoping i'm wrong).</p>
<p>thanks again for previous input, and thanks in advance for any other comments/feedback!</p>
<p>we're not allowed to double major at pton???</p>
<p>GettingIn, I had the exact opposite experience, lol. I visited Princeton on a rainy gray day in February, I think, and while I loved the architecture (it really is just stunningly beautiful), the weather (and the orange and black color scheme) just killed my interest. On the other hand, I visited Yale on a gorgeous day in April... and that's where I'm almost 100% sure I'm headed next year :)</p>
<p>Nope. ONly a "certificate," which I hear is somewhat of a minor. </p>
<p>Strictly based on looks, here are some more differences of the general atmosphere between the two schools that I picked up
-princeton is located in a wealthy suburban area, while New Haven would not be considered the safest location of the Ivies.
-yale's architecture is phenomenal, very reminiscent of european cities such as Paris. Even the ****ing stadium is modelled after the Roman coliseum. I truly believe this is where the "artsy" feeling comes from.
-Princeton is more spread out. The campus is not restricted to within the gates- whereas at Yale, it would probably be a hazard to leave the gates open at night. I consider the historical war site next to the campus a part of Princeton</p>
<p>whimsicalhippo, you probably could design your own major with whatever you want to do if you're talented enough, etc. I think the reason why there are no double majors is the Senior thesis requirement (it would be extremely difficult, perhaps nearly impossible, to do two Senior thesis papers).</p>
<p>jon314 is right on this one. You're allowed to double major at Princeton. Almost no one does, however, because of the daunting task of doing two thesis papers.</p>
<p>You cannot double major at Princeton. Degree and departmental honors at Princeton are granted in one department only. However, if you have interests that cannot be studied adequately within an existing department, you can apply for the Independent Concentration Program. An independent concentrator designs a program of studies with the support of two faculty advisers, choosing eight or more upper-level courses in the special field of concentration. Aside from Independent Concentration, another popular option is to pursue a certificate<a href="or%20many!">/i</a> in the second field of interest. Princeton offers 33 certificate programs, such as European cultural studies, neuroscience, and finance. *</p>
<p>Taken from: <a href="http://www.princeton.edu/%7Eoktour/virtualtour/Info03-Major.htm%5B/url%5D">http://www.princeton.edu/~oktour/virtualtour/Info03-Major.htm</a></p>
<p>I think this is a plus, actually, because it means you'll be doing very thorough research in one aspect of your major. And, you can tailor your major extensively by adding certificates or, if you're a brave soul, doing an independent concentration.</p>
<p>I love that Princeton offers a certificate in European Cultural Studies. The sad part is that I'd probably need those courses to become reacquainted with my own culture -- I've become so Americanized since I moved here. :p :rolleyes:</p>
<p>^^There you go, for those of you who want to double major at Princeton. So I guess if you wanted to major in math and philosophy at Princeton, you could do that as an independent concentration--though Yale actually has a specific major "mathematics and philosophy"</p>
<p>I'd say the schools have a lot of similarities. Yale's campus is a little more confined and established than Princeton's, but some people (like me) need a campus that is not so enclosed and gated off, even though Yale has some extremely beautiful buildings. I also don't care for the semi-urban setting in which Yale is situated, and when comparing departments, Princeton had a more established Ecology and Evolutionary Bio department (established 1990, vs. Yale in 2004), and it offered more variety for off-campus study and involvement in research in this particular department, although both schools definitely have great opportunities for that as a whole. So it was a photograph finish in the application race, but Princeton won by a hair.</p>
<p>Sorry debryc, when I visited my tour guide told me one could double major. She lied to me! ; )</p>
<p>You can't double major, but you can get a certificate (which is Princeton's equivalent to a minor), in a variety of subjects.</p>
<p>abiste, no need to apologize! I'm actually in the process of training to be a Orange Key Tour Guide... wish me luck!</p>
<p>My seminar class was talking to our professor during a break. This guy did his undergrad at Harvard, grad at Yale, and is teaching here at Princeton. Basically, he's brilliant. Anyways, we started asking him questions about the differences in the three schools since he's the first person we've met who's "attended" all of them. Here are some things he said about Yale and Princeton:</p>
<ul>
<li><p>Princeton's social life is centered around campus (Frist, the Street, extracurrics) which makes for a cohesive student body while Yale's students go out to bars our restuarants around town which means more choice.</p></li>
<li><p>Yale has more literary publications and seems more artsy and in touch with the real world. Princeton students live in an "Orange Bubble".</p></li>
<li><p>Because of its small size and cohesive campus, Princeton's administration is very smooth. The example he gave was with dining staff. The dining staff at Princeton is not unionized because wages and benefits are good and because the workers' rapport with both students and administration is great. (I love the people who work in dining.) Yale is very large so its administration is a little more cumbersome... while he was a student at Yale, the university was almost shut down when three unions, including the unrecognized grad student union, went on strike all at the same time!</p></li>
<li><p>Yale's residential college system is for the entire four years which means people are a lot more loyal to their colleges there than at Princeton where the majority of residential colleges are only for two years.</p></li>
<li><p>Princeton's focus is in its undergraduate college while Yale's focus is its top notch graduate schools.</p></li>
<li><p>Princeton students as a whole seem to him, very pragmatic in their approach to solving problems.</p></li>
<li><p>Yale is located in New Haven and the town-gown relationship can be a little strained because Yale is also New Haven's biggest employer. Princeton, NJ, is small, quiet, and not as intricately involved with the university.</p></li>
<li><p>Princeton is tradition rich with extremely loyal alumni in love with Princeton and their undergraduate experience. Yale students seem a little more jaded.</p></li>
</ul>
<p>As you can see, he pointed out both the good and the bad. He did conclude that Princeton students seem to have more fun, though (=</p>
<p>Hope this helped!</p>
<p>I would like to present a little of the Yale perspective on this issue, and particularly to address a couple of the issues raised by debryc.</p>
<p>
[quote]
- Princeton's social life is centered around campus (Frist, the Street, extracurrics) which makes for a cohesive student body while Yale's students go out to bars our restuarants around town which means more choice.
[/quote]
</p>
<p>While the "more choice" part is probably true, I don't think the implication that this makes the Yale student body less cohesive is. Though there is certainly more to do in New Haven than in Princeton (as towns), most Yale students do not stray too far from campus for the most part. The major difference with Princeton is that while Princeton has one major street with most of the restaurants, etc, Yale is surrounded by streets of this sort. That is, Yale students do not go farther from campus, they just have more directions to go.</p>
<p>
[quote]
- Princeton's focus is in its undergraduate college while Yale's focus is its top notch graduate schools.
[/quote]
</p>
<p>First of all, in the context of PhD programs, Princeton is no weaker than Yale, and grad students there certainly receive as much attention as at Yale (my father got his PhD at Princeton, and he certainly didn't feel neglected). The essential point here is that Yale and Princeton are much more similar in degree of focus on undergraduates than is often claimed. To say that one focuses on undergrads, while the other focuses on grad students is at best exaggeration and at worst a blatant misrepresentation of the real situation. Note that the professor from whom debryc got this description was a grad student at Yale. I'm sure he got plenty of attention as a grad student, but this does not mean that undergraduates are not the central focus at Yale, just as they are at Princeton. </p>
<p>GettinIn1 made a similar, though to my mind even less accurate claim when he said
[quote]
Undergrad students get all the great professors while at other schools like harvard and yale, classes are often taught by TA's and the more 'famous' professors only work with graduate students.
[/quote]
</p>
<p>This is demonstrably false. At Yale (I won't presume to speak for Harvard) all professors, as famous as they may be, teach undergraduates. From noted Chinese historian Jonathan Spence to the world's leading Shakespeare critic, Harold Bloom, you will find that Yale's most renowned faculty devote tremendous energy to teaching undergraduates. As for TAs teaching classes, GettingIn1's claim has some merit, in that TAs at Yale lead discussion sections for large lecture classes, which happens to a lesser extent at Princeton (though it certainly still happens, part of the job of a PhD program is to provide its students with teaching experience, so Princeton would be failing its grad students if they did not have the chance to teach undergrads). I personally will go through my entire first year at Yale without being taught by a TA in any context (except for one on one foreign language tutorials, which I would call an extra benefit), so don't think that, to the extent it is true, this claim would have a huge impact on the quality of your education.</p>
<p>Finally, debryc argued
[quote]
- Princeton is tradition rich with extremely loyal alumni in love with Princeton and their undergraduate experience. Yale students seem a little more jaded.
[/quote]
While it is true that Princeton has a higher alumni giving rate than Yale (which is the only way I think you could actually attempt to test this claim) that hardly means Yale alumni are jaded. After all, while Princeton is 1st in the country in alumni giving according to US News, Yale is 4th, behind only Princeton, Dartmouth, and Notre Dame, so unless the alumni of all but three colleges in the country are "jaded" Yale's alumni certainly aren't.</p>
<p>In closing, let me say that both Princeton and Yale are fantastic schools, and if you do indeed have the opportunity to choose between them, you should consider yourself very lucky. I encourage you, if you have to make this decision, to attend both schools' admitted students programs. I was in a similar position last year (choosing between Yale, Princeton, and Stanford), and for me, the visits in April made all the difference. Personally, after my visits, I loved Yale and hated Princeton (though, don't get me wrong, that was just me, and many have the opposite opinion), but if I hadn't visited, I would have been totally unsure as to which I should choose.</p>
<p>You may be right, but at Princeton, the graduate students are in a completely different part of campus, and play little role in the campus social life (so I'm told). In addition, graduate students are outnumbered ~2:1 at Princeton (the ratio is ~1:1 at Yale and ~1:2 at Harvard--roughly). That's a good ratio if you're an undergraduate.</p>