My DD was on the fence between Engineering and Architecture, this summer she took pre-college summer classes for Architecture and decide it wasn’t for her. Wasn’t a cheap experiment, but in a long run a bargain. So we’re narrowing to engineering, but she is having trouble deciding which specialization in engineering. I suggested that she try a 3-2 program so that can more easily switch to another major or still have the opportunity to pickup engineering at a different school if she finds engineering a good fit. Also she won’t be married to a school which my not have an engineering discipline she wants to end up with. It is another year of school, which can be significant in dollars, but allows for some flexibility and options. Has anyone here done, or have/had a child who has done one to provide some insight?
3-2 doesn’t mean she can try out different engineering options. Usually it is at an LAC that doesn’t offer engineering, so the student majors in physics or math for 3 years and then transfers to an engineering program at a bigger university or a STEM school. I don’t see how she’d know more about the engineering specialties after taking physics.
Some engineering programs offer general engineering for a semester or year for students to ‘try out’ the different types of engineering. My daughter took Introduction to Engineering her first semester, a class which introduced them to all the majors offered at the school, including subspecialties like ocean engineering.
Very few students who do a 3+2 actually transfer to the ‘2’ school. Cost, leaving their friends as a senior in college, difficulty in the courses are some reasons. When we were looking at schools the option sounded attractive, but upon looking into it, it was not a good option for my daughter at all. The biggest negative for her was that the offerings at the LAC weren’t very good in the physics and math departments. That isn’t true at all schools, of course, but it was for the ones we looked at.
I don’t have any knowledge of 3-2 programs, but I would suggest that she consider Architectural Engineering as a major. That’s what I majored in, because I was interested in the engineering of BUILDINGS - I didn’t want to major in civil engineering and also study highways, pumps, etc. This field has been around a long time, although a lot of people don’t know about it. I had to take a couple of architectural design classes, to get a better feel for what architects do, but it is a pure engineering degree. I went on to get my master’s degree in structural engineering.
Agree with the above poster. Your daughter might be better served looking for an engineering program that has a general first year engineering curriculum with intros to all the disciplines, and then a transition to major at the end of freshman year or after first semester sophomore year. The down side to this is that there is generally a minimum GPA requirement to transition to the major but IMO, if kids are struggling with a 2.8/3.0 in intro courses, they aren’t on the right path for engineering anyway.
3+2 programs are mostly marketing by LACs that do not natively have engineering. Relatively few frosh intending to do 3+2 actually transfer to the “2” school. Some reasons why that is uncommon:
- Not admitted to the "2" school. Often, there is a high GPA requirement or competitive admission.
- Not enough financial aid at the "2" school, which is not necessarily known at frosh entry. For example, Columbia, a common "2" school in 3+2 arrangements, does *not* promise to "meet need" for 3+2 students like it does for frosh and other transfers.
- Extra year of costs, even with financial aid.
- Limited engineering courses and activities at the "3" school, which may make it difficult for the student to keep interest.
- Limited selection of majors at some "3" schools. Some allow any major as long as the math/physics/chemistry courses for pre-engineering are completed, but others limit the major (e.g. to physics).
- Not wanting to transfer away from friends and "3" school that student likes.
- Characteristics of the "3" school that were the basis of choosing it may be absent at the "2" school (e.g. student wanted a small school, but the "2" school is a much bigger school).
Some schools where it works: Agnes Scott (GTech is close enough you don’t lose your friends), Haverford/Bryn Mawr (you actually get a Master’s in one year after your BS and Penn is in the same consortium).
Women’s colleges with engineering: Smith, Sweet Briar (very supportive of girls interested the field, obviously).
LACs with engineering: Union, Bucknell, Lafayette, Trinity, Clarkson. (The offerings aren’t as comprehensive as at tech schools but you have the student focused education and support as all LACs.Note that except for Lafayette these are Greek- heavy.)
Engineering small schools: Harvey Mudd, Cal Tech, Olin
Tech schools where girls have an advantage applying: RPI, WPI, Embry-Riddle, Rose Hulman.
Look for WISE clubs or LLCs.
Ask for ‘persistence’ stats wrt female students (what % of female students who start in engineering actually finish).
At one point we investigating 3-2 programs but decided that in most cases it is not a good idea. Do your homework. There are many other 3-2 threads here discussing the topic.
"I don’t have any knowledge of 3-2 programs, but I would suggest that she consider Architectural Engineering as a major. "
I looked it up and it looks like there are 26 universities which offer the degree.
In a 3/2 she won’t have any idea of whether or not she will like engineering until after she leaves the first school. There is no engineering in the first school, only math and physics. That’s why they have to partner with a transfer school.
It’s far easier to move OUT of engineering than in. As such, I would suggest she look at schools with a broad array of majors, that have the engineering types she is interested in, and where changing majors isn’t overly burdensome. She should start in engineering and switch out if she doesn’t like it.
As @colorado_mom alluded to, there are lots of 3/2 threads, almost all panning them.
What classes did she take and what didn’t she like about them?
As the others have said, you really are looking for an university/engineering program with a first year engineering program, or is very flexible when it comes to selecting majors.
The larger the program, the more engineering fields/options are available. That also applies to non-engineering majors. The more comprehensive the program/university, the more choices are available.
It’s not uncommon for an engineering student to switch schools, if their major is not available. However, the do tend to pick a major offered by that school, verses leaving all of their friends, etc. I would recommend a program that offers several engineering programs, to reduce the chances she’ll have to transfer.
You can use the ASEE (American Society for Engineering Education) online profiles to review each engineering program. It includes which majors are available, how many students are in the program, info on new applicants, etc.
Good Luck!
Be careful in that some schools have their engineering majors enrolled to full capacity, meaning that there is little space to accommodate those who want to change major (so changing major means a competitive admission process).
Some which have a first year engineering program have competitive admission to declare major later. This may create somewhat of a “weed out” environment.
Schools that make one essentially re-apply in their second or third year to their engineering program with no guarantee they will be accepted to an engineering major from day 1 do a disservice to their students. Accepting more students initially than they know they have the capacity to accommodate in the engineering class later is dishonest in my opinion. If you are sure you want to be an engineer, start out in an engineering school that does not play this game. You will be far better off.
Note - You should also check each school on your list to see if there are GPA requirements for transferring out of engineering and into another major. Engineering students often have a low-is GPA (especially if they don’t like it).