<p>Overall, pretty shocking and disturbing. Penn Parents have received 2 emails regarding mental health and and a beefed up CAPS program from Penn's President in the last week. Of course, this is not limited to Penn. I remember Cornell had their own rash of episodes a few years back. Still, it makes you shake your head and wonder how to take some of the pressure off these kids. </p>
<p>I agree… I have a freshman S there now and believe it or not the school work is not the thing he feels the pressure from. While the workload is significant and difficult he is handling it without issue. He is finding get involved in activities at PENN more difficult than the workload. Participation in most of the activities is very competitive, and interview required etc. He has yet to find a group that he can participate in and the pressure is building. He was really over involved in high school and is now feeling lost because of this. Being part of a group or organization also is an additional support system which alleviates pressure? Everything there seems to be a competition. He is very happy there right now, has made many friends etc, loves the city just wishes he could be involved in activities as well as academics… </p>
<p>^ What kinds of activities and groups has he tried to join? There are literally HUNDREDS of activities and groups at Penn that are always looking for new members and participants, and for which membership and/or participation is NOT competitive. Perhaps he’s not aware of those? I’m curious as to which groups, or types of groups, he’s investigated.</p>
<p>Also, it’s not uncommon for freshmen to feel a bit alienated or isolated, especially after only one semester. Many students don’t find their niche, clubs, or activities at Penn until after freshman year. Perhaps his expectations are a bit unrealistic? Remember that most Penn freshmen are coming from a high school environment they had thoroughly mastered, and in which they were the “stars,” to a campus full of high achievers and at which their former “specialness” is somewhat diminished. And no one likes starting back on the bottom of the ladder, as it were, but that is the plight of the average freshman.</p>
<p>Isn’t Penn and all the other top schools filled with students with high expectations? It is how they achieved what they achieved. My S is working it out and seems fine, my point was directed at the initial comment about reducing the stress on the students. Interviewing to be part of a club that is not competitive (meaning competing against another clubs) seems like an excessive selectivity process. There were three groups like that he tried to join last semester but was not selected. He is now interviewing for two different ones this semester. That is five in total. There has to be a better way. Just my opinion.</p>
<p>^ But what kinds of clubs were they? And by “competitive,” I meant competition to join, not competition against other clubs. I’m just not aware of many clubs at Penn–other than performing arts, publications, or sports clubs–that have a competitive process (e.g., interviews, auditions, try-outs, etc.) to join. And even the performing arts groups and publications have lots of room for student participation for those students who may not get selected to perform in a particular production, write a column, etc. I know kids currently at Penn (and skim the Daily Pennsylvanian on-line .pdf edition virtually every day), and my sense is that the vast majority of clubs and activities are open to all interested students in some form or another. So again, I’m curious as to which clubs required that your son be interviewed in a competitive membership process. </p>
<p>Isn’t there some Wharton investment-management club that’s become like the Porcellian of Penn? That has a hyper-competitive selection process, no? And also fraternities. It’s not that hard to come up with three groups that might reject a particular kid . . . </p>
<p>^ But I was responding to Mamalumper’s statements:</p>
<p>
The implication being that there is competition to get involved with most of the extracurricular activities at Penn. That’s just not my understanding (or the experience of the kids I currently know there), which is why I’m curious as to the types of clubs for which Mamalumper’s son has had to undergo a competitive interview process. I assume that she is NOT referring to the traditional fraternities which, of course, do have a somewhat selective rush process.</p>
<p>45 Percenter
Maybe Mamalumper’s son was trying to join Wharton clubs. My son is a freshman and he had to interview for some Wharton clubs he tried to join. Many however, as you noted, did not have any interview process. </p>
<p>Most of these kids are high achievers who have previously had many successes. It may be new for them (and for their parents) to experience some “failiure” . But this is what life will bring, both ups and downs, and they have to be able to deal with it. Our role as parents is to help them realise it is OKAY, they dont have to be the best ALL THE TIME. Every interview and application process will add to their experience, and this is what they can treat it as…a learning experience. I think a lot of the pressure on the kids comes from parents who expect the kids to continue the winning streak in college. PS my response is general and is not directed at anyone in this forum</p>
<p>I will ask him which ones he interviewed for but he is not in Wharton. He is in Engineering. I know there are plenty of clubs and he is plugging along trying to find activities that he likes that evidently like him too. Really I did not mean to start a thread about activities. This thread was about the stress at Penn and the recent children who found it too much. He and I are taking the “failure” in stride… </p>
<p>As parents, we try our best to keep in touch with our kids, and to be available to support them. I’ve been telling my d that it’s ok to struggle and to tell us if/when she has ups and downs. I wonder how we can all adjust our expectations of our young adult college kids and to instill in them a way to adjust the expectations they have of themselves. Stress management is important and a true support system can make a difference. </p>
<p>It’s very harmful that people are continually trying to shift the conversation to stress at Penn when that is not the underlying issue. Yes, Penn can be an unnecessarily stressful place, but this alone will never be able to make someone take their own life. The real issue at hand is how students address their peers who are suffering silently with mental illness. While stress makes this situation worse, it also desensitize students to the issue and makes them more likely to focus on themselves rather than to help peers who they observe are struggling. It’s this culture that needs to change. Penn will always be competitive, what matters is how students treat each other.</p>
<p>A student friend of my child has had bad experiences with mental health support at Penn. She was in distress, having an anxiety attack and severe depression. It was after hours and she called the CAPS help line, she was put on hold for 15 mins and then the person who came on the line told her" I’m sorry you’re not feeling good, is there someone you can call" Well, that someone was supposed to be THEM. She called her out of state parents who tried to help the best they could but they are not professionals, trained in talking down a person in distress!!
After hours and phone support at Penn is sadly lacking. </p>
<p>@livn487 This has also been tried, these students mainly provide info for other available resources. Not very helpful for a student in immediate crisis. But I guess its good to have different options available for varying degrees of need.</p>
<p>This is not an issue unique to Penn, in any way. Unfortunately there are suicides at a lot of top colleges from time to time. People who go to places like Penn are likely to be of the personality type that is already predisposed to mental illness. I see that in a lot of people here.</p>
<p>Poeme, I hope you’re not pre-med. I’m just saying your sensitivity and bedside manner leave a lot to be desired. Imagine one of those people was a friend of yours and re-read your post.</p>
<p>" The real issue at hand is how students address their peers who are suffering silently with mental illness. While stress makes this situation worse, it also desensitize students to the issue and makes them more likely to focus on themselves rather than to help peers who they observe are struggling. It’s this culture that needs to change. Penn will always be competitive, what matters is how students treat each other." </p>
<p>@poeme: Thanks for pointing that out…My d at Penn says that there’s heightened awareness and there are conversations happening all over campus. It is a step in the right direction. From the outside, we can only see bits and pieces-- I’m in the midwest and there is very little buzz about the news here. I believe it is much different for the students on campus.</p>