Advice anyone? Help my D narrow her app list?

Parents Forum
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<p>Hello CCers! My D has been reading the forums for a while and suggested that I join too. There is definitely a lot of useful info and support here for parents so I was wondering if anyone could help out a newbie in a quandary...</p>

<p>My D has a list of more than 2 dozen schools that she is interested in applying to based on academic offerings. This list was longer and she cut it down but I still think it's way too long. I know admissions are competitive even for kids with great stats--which she has--but the few supposed safeties on her list aren't really doing it for her. She attends a top 100 ranked public HS on LI--top 5% (no rankings--approx 450 Srs) in a very competitive class of overachievers. I'm not sure what's reasonable anymore or how many schools she should apply to in order to ensure that she attends one of her top choices.</p>

<p>She used a couple of student-written college guides to try to get a feel for the social environment but there seems to be a lot of conflicting opinions out there about what the general character of a student body is. Colored by perspective/personal experience?</p>

<p>She intends to major in Psych but would like either a double major or minor with Legal Studies or Law & Society type of program. She's also interested in another minor/concentration in Philosophy or Sociology or Journalism depending on the school. She's looking at schools with profs/advisors that might mentor her based on shared interests. Her goal is to become a criminal/appellate attorney (capital cases) and to counsel at-risk youth to help them avoid the juvenile justice system.</p>

<p>She's a very serious, focused, straight-laced type of person/student--doesn't want a huge party scene. She does want a politically active campus and a thriving arts community. She's an accomplished dancer and interested in theater. She's a vegetarian, does meditation/yoga, and is not religious. She's personally very conservative in her conduct--no drinking, smoking, drugs, or indiscriminate hooking-up--doesn't even use vulgar language--ever--I'm serious--not deluded--promise. Some of her friends engage in behavior she doesn’t condone, but she’s never given into peer pressure. She’s steadfast in her convictions. She's politically quite liberal--member of the ACLU & NCADP. She's not much for sports except a little recreational tennis and golf. By nature she's sweet, generous, empathetic and maybe a bit wide-eyed. She’d tell you that she’s a nerd but she looks more like a J Crew model. </p>

<p>If anyone has any experience with any of the schools on her list I'd appreciate any feedback. </p>

<p>Here's the list:
Amherst
Haverford
Swarthmore
Williams
Bard
Vassar
Bennington
Wesleyan
Middlebury
Barnard
Smith
Wellesley
Mt Holyoke
Bryn Mawr
Franklin & Marshall
Dickinson
Grinnell
Oberlin
Chicago
Northwestern
Georgetown
Cornell
Columbia
Rochester
Brandeis</p>

<p>I just want her to be happy and fit in.
Thanks so much.</p>

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<p>I have a young friend who is similar to your D who is very happy at Cornell.</p>

<p>My first impression though was that Amherst/Holyoke/Smith might be a good place to start checking out colleges in person.</p>

<p>I'm sure that more parents will start checking in here with good ideas.</p>

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<p>Thank you for your reply cnp55.</p>

<p>D's HS sends 4-6 kids to Cornell each yr. My impression has always been that it's HUGE, but I understand that there are now a few residential houses/colleges being established to give it the more personal LAC feel. They have fab Psych/Law programs which are the draw for her. </p>

<p>The Amherst consortium is my personal fave, but the admit rate at Amherst gives me pause. She'd give her right arm to get in there. She's convinced she needs to be her class val & to have discovered the cure for a rare disease to gain admission--she could be right! Still a couple of kids from her HS have gotten in. Amherst used to be her 1st choice but then no rep showed at our local Ivy fair & she found out they don't do interviews either--feels like a #. Still she's enthralled with the LJST major they offer. She calls it Ammie & pores over the viewbook with longing. She really likes purple too. It's sad really.</p>

<p>Thanks again.</p>

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<p>What about Brown? LAC atmosphere with big school opportunites?</p>

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<p>My D went to Wesleyan, and your D sounds very, very much like her. I would definitely keep that one on the list--it seems perfect from your description.</p>

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<p>I'd say that Columbia or Barnard look excellent for her as well. Perhaps Wellesley too. (Of course they may be reaches.)</p>

<p>We visited several of the schools on her list including Amherst, Wesleyan, Columbia, Rochester, Brandeis, Swarthmore, Vassar, Wellesley (I have a daughter too) and Cornell. They are all VERY different.</p>

<p>My son goes to Vassar, turned down Wesleyan, Brandeis, and Oberlin. I'm not sure that Vassar presents the right fit for your daughter, but I'd be glad to answer any specific questions that you/she might have. Feel free to PM me.</p>

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<p>It is time to dump the guidebooks and brochures into a pile and start making tours.</p>

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<p>I'm not a parent, but I am a current student at Wesleyan, so I thought I'd throw in some comments about my school:</p>

<p>First, on academics (and sorry if you already know this): although we have a great psych major, we don't have any law type major. However, we do have the College of Social Sciences which is a really cool program that tends to draw some pre-law type which might interest her: <a href="http://www.wesleyan.edu/css/%5B/url%5D"&gt;http://www.wesleyan.edu/css/&lt;/a>. Also be aware that we don't offer minors, so unless she wants to triple major (it's been done, but it's not common), she'd have to chose between CSS vs. Philosophy/Sociology (no journalism). </p>

<p>And socially: given your daughter's goals and politics, Wes could be a great environment for her. She'll definitely find a HUGE number of students and organizations that hold similar ideas as her (in fact, there's even a group on campus devoted to prisoner's rights and education). As I'm sure you know, Wes isn't anything if not politically active, and there is also a great arts scene (including a student-run theater production companies that puts on great shows with people of all levels of experience, and multiple student run dance groups, as well as opportunities to dance in pieces choreographed by dance majors). </p>

<p>And in terms of the personal social stuff: she won't be the majority at Wes, where funky clothing styles and personal conduct ranging from a bit more lenient to completely liberal is more common. However, she won't be alone in her style or conduct, and, more importantly, as long as she doesn't mind being around people who act differently than her, she will be accepted too —Wes kids tend to have a very "live and let live" attitude, and respect other people's choices. For instance, I had several friend who don't drink or do drugs, and as soon as they told people that, people stopped offering (and even the offering was not meant to pressure them…it was just friendly!) (Of course that's in general: I can't promise that she will never feel ANY pressure to change from individual peers, but hey, it sounds like she can handle it, and that will be true anywhere :D ). And if she considers herself a nerd, I think she could be a really great fit for Wes.</p>

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<p>In thinking about it a bit more ... Brandeis could be a good fit too ... huge on social justice and not a big party scene at all. Boston is nearby as well, affording lots of great cultural experiences. Not sure about the arts community on campus though.</p>

<p>Is your daughter a rising junior or senior in high school?</p>

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<p>Your daughter sounds a lot like me, except I don't look like a J. Crew model (I am a nerd, though.) I don't drink, smoke, do drugs, hook up or plan to do any of them. I've found a lot of people with the same attitude among the people I've talked to. Oberlin is very politically active and has a thriving arts community, and a great art museum, and a great art rental program :D. I think she'd fit in very well!</p>

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<p>beprepn: thank you, but no have some issues with Brown from previous experience & it didn't excite her.</p>

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<p>I would get a feel for what type of location she wants - some of the colleges on the list are urban and some are very rural. Then, definitely start visiting. Colleges high up on the list can drop to the bottom & vice versa after a visit.</p>

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<p>Weskid:</p>

<p>Thanks for taking the time to share all of that. She did some pretty thorough research on academics, re CSS etc. Not every school on her list has a legal program per se. Some have the "spirit" or related courses like Wes does. I think the "live & let live attitude" is what she's looking for, but all of those "naked party" anecdotes threw her a bit! She doesn't see herself being comfortable with that. I think mostly, she doesn't want a roommate that is inconsiderate or constantly binge-drinking/vomiting or bringing guys back to the room so she has to seek other accomodations.</p>

<p>Thanks again.</p>

<p>Also garland thanks for your input on Wes too</p>

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<p>edad thanks for your input</p>

<p>Tours/interviews are planned for the early autumn.<br>
She wants to sit in on classes and meet certain profs.</p>

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<p>buckeyemom2:</p>

<p>Thanks for the advice but the academic program is her priority. She doesn't care much about the location--rural or urban, etc.--that's why the list is a mix of big and small in different regions. Almost all of these campuses are attractive in some way to her.</p>

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<p>twinmom my D is a senior. You seem to have a lot of knowledge to share. Thanks I will PM you.</p>

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<p>Great list for what sounds like a great kid.</p>

<p>Here's a thought for what it's worth: </p>

<p>Columbia/Barnard/Vassar/Bard are all day trips from LI, so you can mix them in any order.</p>

<p>For traveling, visit Northwestern and Chicago on the same trip. She'll like one better than the other for sure, they are very different (preprofessional vs. intellectual, suburban vs. urban). Then visit Cornell and Williams, both in the middle of nowhere (about 4 hours apart) but very different. Then maybe hit Philadelphia (Swarthmore, Haverford, and Bryn Mawr) and then Amherst/Smith/Holyoke, then Boston (Wellesley/Brandeis). </p>

<p>Each trip with the largest contrasts will probably eliminate a whole swath of schools helping her narrow down the choices to a reasonable number and figure out what she really likes. Also, Hampshire is an unusual safety in the 5-college consortium with access to Amherst, so you might want to add that on the Amherst/Smith/Holyoke trip. </p>

<p>Then she can select a few safeties to match the learning style she likes best. </p>

<p>Good Luck and make sure you change your oil!</p>

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<p>A great list. You might want to add Connecticut College to your list. My daughter sounds very similar to yours. She ended up applying to 11 schools, mostly from your list and we visted almost all of your list. I also liked the Amherst area very much though I wonder if the more alternate schools Bard (son transferring there from Bates), Vassar, Wesleyan, Oberlin might be a better fit for a theater person.</p>

<p>Enjoy your travels. I liked visiting Chicago very much but neither child applied. Be sure, if possible, to fall in love with some match and safety schools. It is very easy to love the top schools but outcomes are never certain so she need schools she loves that she is likely to get into.</p>

<p>For example with my daughter -Top, 2%, 1450/2120, SATIIs (780,770,740,710), AP (Junior two 5's and one 4 Senior three 5's and one 4) theater, flute/oboe, etc. etc.</p>

<p>Rejected: Brown, Swarthmore, Princeton, Harvard, Amherst
Accepted: Vassar, Tufts, Franklin and Marshall, Connecticut College
Waitlisted: Haverford, Wesleyan (didn't stay on the list for either)</p>

<p>She loved Vassar (it was her brother's first choice last year but he didn't get in) and is very happy about going there. It probably ranked number 3 or 4 on her preferred list so all turned out well.</p>

<p>By the way, F&M s a great place (my alma mater) to check out with new some nice new buildings opening this fall..but...when I was there Psychology was a lab science and that may not be the part of psychology she is interested in. You should check on that as it may have changed since I had my rat for the intro lab!</p>

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<p>BAfromBC, it would be helpful if we knew more specifics on her stats: standardized test scores, UW GPA, # of APs, scores, etc. If she's top 5%, combined SAT>2300, in the top tier competitive schedule in her school, then the list can be narrowed much much more. I see that she, like my D (who's a rising sophomore in college), doesn't care to go west of the Rockies or south of the Mason-Dixon. Her list is VERY much like my daughter's preliminary list of >20 schools (with the exception of my D's home state school of U of Michigan which was added because of rolling admissions). I would strongly recommend taking this list, matching it with her profile, and breaking it down into safeties, matches, and reaches for her. If she's truly top tier, I'm suspecting it will look something like this:</p>

<p>Safeties:
Haverford
Swarthmore
Bard
Bennington
Smith
Bryn Mawr
Franklin & Marshall
Dickinson
Rochester
Mt. Holyoke</p>

<p>Matches:
Vassar
Barnard
Wellesley
Brandeis</p>

<p>Matchy/Reaches:
Wesleyan
Grinnell
Oberlin
Northwestern
Georgetown</p>

<p>Reaches:
Amherst
Williams
Middlebury
Chicago
Cornell
Columbia</p>

<p>I see that she has both co-ed and women-only colleges on her list. Immediately, go visit a women's only college to see if she remains interested. For you, Barnard would be closest, but this school is unique in that it's women may attend some classes at Columbia. After we visited Wellesley, my D took all women's colleges off her list, though she loved Wellesley's offerings. Next, visit a small (Amherst size...very conservative, BTW), medium (Brandeis and Coumbia size...you can visit tour Columbia same day as Barnard), and large (Rochester/Georgetown size) school. Then start cutting down on the size of the list. If your D's list is "top" heavy (i.e., reach-heavy), she needs to apply to more schools, due to the hard knocks of admissions statistics. If it is balanced, she only needs 1 safety, 2 to 3 matches, and a couple of reaches. It sure is best if the safety or a match is a rolling admissions school that she can apply to very early, so she has an acceptance under her belt in the fall of her freshman year. Once my D had her acceptance to U of Mich (with offer to apply to the Honor's program), she withdrew her preliminary applications from all except 4 other schools: Wesleyan, Brandeis (matches) and her two reach schools. She was accepted to all 5, and is completing her sophomore year at one of her reach schools. PM me for more information.</p>

<p>Good luck!</p>

<p>Addendum: One more thing. My D found that the Stats Eval available from this site was very helpful to her in narrowing her list and bald-facedly assessing her chances at the schools she really wanted to attend. If you can afford the <$100, it's worth it. P.S. I have absolutely NO connection to the site or it's owners in any way.</p>

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<p>Thanks ClassicRockerDad--pretty much what we have planned!</p>