<p>re #218: DadII, avert your eyes. You will NOT, I repeat, NOT rob a convenience store!</p>
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In my opinion, society needs to encourage, support, and reward students such as Navonil Ghosh, because society will be the ultimate benefactor of such students’ commitment to excellence.
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<p>Why is the yardstick with which we measure "commitment to excellence" or "reward students for high academic achievement" solely defined by an acceptance to HYPS? </p>
<p>The absurdity of the college decisions depends from one's point of view. Since we are allowed to offer different opinions here, I'd say that Ghosh's quitting a job to hire himself as Chief Strategist in College Applications was a study in absurdity. And it would have been even with 100% acceptance rates. </p>
<p>The only difference is that the results not only indicate how absurd it was but also how irrational it was. This story was not about the student but about his father. Staying out of the limelight seemed too darn hard, even in the article linked by the OP. Why was the father "contribution" ever mentioned? Afraid we would miss the puppeteers' act?</p>
<p>"No, the irony is that people who are trashing Ghosh's father have said nothing about the dad who is incarcerated (on another thread on the Parents Forum). In fact, the kid whose father is incarcerated considers it a hook."</p>
<p>What would you want people to say about the dad who is incarcerated? Assuming he did whatever he was convicted of, his incarceration speaks for itself.</p>
<p>As for his incarceration being a hook for the student -- why not? If the student managed to academically achieve despite having a dad who is in prison, that student has done an excellent job of overcoming some odds that would defeat most people. And it's ridiculous to imply that the father committed a crime to give his offspring an admission hook. More than likely, the dad has never been an involved father at all to his offspring.</p>
<p>On another thread, there's an Ivy admitted student whose worried that because his grades dropped to Bs and Cs this semester due to his having to work 30 hours a week after his dad was laid off, he may be rescinded.</p>
<p>On still another thread, there's a post by a high achieving, low income girl who's struggling to go off to college even though her entire family wants her to stay home and not go to college. She had to take a gap year because the colleges that accepted her didn't give her enough money to attend. </p>
<p>Meanwhile, Ghosh, through an accident of birth, has a(n apparently well educated father) who was able to afford to quit his job to devote 3 years of his life to helping Ghosh get into colleges like Harvard. </p>
<p>While Ghosh must be very intelligent and hard working to have made the achievements that he did, he had far more help in doing so than most people do, and colleges would take that into account.</p>
<p>The top colleges evaluate students in the context of their resources, not just by what they have achieved. If the CC poster with the incarcerated parent, the girl whose family is against her college plans, and the Yale admittee who is having to work 30 hours a week had had the advantages that Ghosh had, for all we know, they may have matched or exceeded his accomplishments.</p>
<p>"The top colleges evaluate students in the context of their resources, not just by what they have achieved. "</p>
<p>And I know of any Indian girl who got into Yale EA and Harvard RD. Her parents have no clue of the college process and have never been to college and not very well off. She received 2400 on SAT without prepping and is a Presidential scholar. Everything that she did was on her own.</p>
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As for his incarceration being a hook for the student -- why not? If the student managed to academically achieve despite having a dad who is in prison, that student has done an excellent job of overcoming some odds that would defeat most people. And it's ridiculous to imply that the father committed a crime to give his offspring an admission hook. More than likely, the dad has never been an involved father at all to his offspring.
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<p>I agree with the above. This is the kind of kid that should be accepted everywhere. I think judging from his acceptances he did get into a lot of excellent schools.</p>
<p>I don't want to comment on Ghosh here, but I take exception to posts suggesting that having an incarcerated father is a hook. Mr. Tubbz had an absent father and a mother who, though hard-working and loving, could not help him much because she herself was not a college grad. He writes that she was passed over for promotion three times because she did not have an AA degree. By his own work, he overcame these problems and wrote an essay that brought tears to my eyes. He did not just devote himself to academics but was involved in quite an array of community activities. I believe adcoms at many colleges, like many of us on CC, saw something truly admirable in this young man. He will achieve much, go far, be a role model (he already is) and contribute much to his college and to society in general. We cannot say that of every admit at top colleges.</p>
<p>o.k. guys, don't push me. </p>
<p>Re #221. I would not rob a store - </p>
<p>Because I think that is a felony.</p>
<p>"...but I take exception to posts suggesting that having an incarcerated father is a hook"</p>
<p>Well, it's listed under his hooks section...I didn't make this assertion--he did.</p>
<p>Incarcerated father as a hook -- why not?</p>
<p>The highly qualified student whose father is in jail has to show far greater drive, resiliency and character to achieve as much as the student whose own father quits his job to ferry him from one EC to another.</p>
<p>HYPS "by hook or by crook".</p>
<p>If "hook" means having a characteristic that colleges want to have in their student body, all colleges want students with the brains and character to overcome difficult odds. Consequently, a student who has done well in terms of academics and ECs despite having an incarcerated father would have a hook.</p>
<p>This article might be quite exaggerated.
The father might deliberately quit his job JUST to shuffle his kid around, or he could have told that to the newspaper to increase the sensationalism and shock-factor of the article. Like, he could've not had a job in the first place, or was about to be laid off anyways, and so made the best of his unemployment to help his son. He might also have been a helicopter parent, but that doesn't mean his son wasn't or couldn't be as qualified or intellectually passionate enough to go to a top school. There are many stories like this, so it's not unusual that a "perfect" applicant gets rejected from most colleges.</p>
<p>Besides, the people who are criticizing him for touting his perfect SATs and ACTs should realize that even though it sounds like he thinks that they are everything, it may not be true at all. This is a newspaper article written for mostly people who are not as familiar with college applications as we on CC are, and perfect numbers (2400, 36, only 4 in the state, etc) stand out more than, say, he was extremely passionate in biomedical engineering and created a premed club, etc.</p>
<p>However, there was probably something wrong with his application to be turned down from even the easier colleges/programs. </p>
<p>If he truly was a finalist in usnco, then how much could he have done in order to stand out? It seems like his helicopter father was a dealbreaker, and that with his "resources" he should've achieved more...but how much more is possible, honestly.</p>
<p>BTW that yale student who got rejected from princeton is now at harvard. i find that funny^^</p>
<p>Didn't the student post his essay to offer some background on his life? The essay was also in a direct response to the prompt, "How I changed my own life."</p>
<p>The mere fact that his father was incarcerated is not the hook; the fact that the student was able to break the chains of bondage and the more insidious ones of low expectations and unending poverty cycles IS the hook. </p>
<p>The story of Mr. Tubbz is not only real but also extremely rare.</p>
<p>haha tubbz is a cool last name</p>
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I don't think that is true at all, quitting ones job is not admired in any culture, even to help your child, there are other ways to help a child.
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I totally disagree. Quiting the job to take care of a child is pretty much expected from the mothers - mothers who are professionals with full time jobs have to constantly defend their decision NOT to quit their jobs and are often snubbed by our society. It is only when the FATHER quits his job it is all of a sudden unacceptable.</p>
<p>Do we know that the schools knew that his dad quit his job? It is quite possible that there were other factors surrounding the unemployment that didn't make it into the newspaper. </p>
<p>Further- so what that he quit his job- he thought it was the right move and obviously could afford to do it. We don't know what the mother does for a living and we don't know that the student then had to file for financial aid. They could be independently wealthy.</p>
<p>Re: using your father's incarceration as a hook.</p>
<p>Finally! A rational explanation for Elliot Spitzer's behavior! Having been told by their college counselor that his daughters were not slam-dunks for Princeton solely on the basis of their accomplishments to date and his (a) alumni status, (b) wealth, (c) prominence, and (d) high elected office, he did the only honorable thing and assured their admission by giving them the ultimate advantage: a disadvantage to rise above!</p>
<p>"Do we know that the schools knew that his dad quit his job? It is quite possible that there were other factors surrounding the unemployment that didn't make it into the newspaper. </p>
<p>Further- so what that he quit his job- he thought it was the right move and obviously could afford to do it. We don't know what the mother does for a living and we don't know that the student then had to file for financial aid. They could be independently wealthy."</p>
<p>The father has posted on an Internet site that his son applied for financial aid.</p>
<p>Given the father's discussing his job situation with the newspaper, I think there's a good chance that teachers, GCs, and the colleges involved know about his situation.</p>
<p>Since the father was driving the son around, and also seems very involved in S's applications, there's also a good chance that the dad met the interviewers and may even have told him that he quit his job to assist his son.</p>
<p>"I don't think that is true at all, quitting ones job is not admired in any culture, even to help your child, there are other ways to help a child."</p>
<p>Doing so is almost universally considered admirable if it helps a kid who is seriously ill or handicapped, and needs lots of parental assistance to live or to live anything approaching a normal life. Parents' quitting a job is sometimes is considered admirable if it helps a kid to sports superstardom or entertainment superstardom.</p>
<p>Parents' quitting a job to help a smart student have the best chances of getting into Harvard, however, is something that most people who are born in the U.S. would think is way over the top.</p>
<p>Does that count as falling on his sword?</p>
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I totally disagree. Quiting the job to take care of a child is pretty much expected from the mothers - mothers who are professionals with full time jobs have to constantly defend their decision NOT to quit their jobs and are often snubbed by our society. It is only when the FATHER quits his job it is all of a sudden unacceptable.
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<p>Especially for Indian culture. I know more mothers quit their jobs than fathers. In fact, most Indian husbands often urge their wifes to quit their jobs to take care of the family. But there is always an odd case here and there. :D</p>