Looking for info about admission for voice/opera. My dtr is going to be a HS senior this year and we need to figure out where to apply. She has a 30 ACT, 4.1 GPA (weighted) 9 APs, lots of clubs, volunteer hrs, etc. Here’s the problem: she wants to continue her classical singing even though she doesn’t think she wants a career in singing. She wants a double major in vocal performance and liberal arts ( maybe English). She could get good merit at many schools with those stats, but probably not at the schools her voice teacher recommended:
Boston University
Tufts
Oberlin
Carnegie Mellon
Rice
Lawrence
Penn State
John Hopkins
Curtis Institute
Cleveland Institute
Expensive schools with high ACTs. I know nothing about how competitive the vocal side of it is, but I imagine it is very competitive for a soprano!
So, we are stuck flying across the country for auditions for a girl who may not even want a career in music? Plus she may not get in and we are left with what? Does anyone have info about these schools or have a list of the next tier down schools? I just can’t see spending that much on a school for vocal performance when she really might not use that degree or might not even finish that degree, plus the added stress and cost of super competitive auditions. She wouldn’t listen to me before on my suggestions for schools and now that her teacher gave her this list, it’s even worse. I’m afraid that she will end up not getting into any of these or if she does, we won’t want to pay the crazy price for a kid who could get a great deal at another great school.
Looks like your D got a list of the best music/voice schools from the teacher, rather than the best ones for what she actually wants to do. All of those are challenging admits, vocally and/or academically. I would say Lawrence and Oberlin might be the most flexible for double majoring. Rice is not flexible. If you are studying music there, that’s where they want your focus. You should get her to apply to a couple of safeties. Does you state school have a decent VP program?
Our state school with voice is on our city so that us out as she wants to go away. She prefers east coast. Any good safeties in that area of the country? That’s what I need to find. And if one more person tells me to try a sample lesson, I will lose my mind! I would love to do that but don’t have any safeties to do that at.
"Here’s the problem: she wants to continue her classical singing even though she doesn’t think she wants a career in singing. "
In my experience, a VP Undergrad at top level schools requires a great deal of focus and drive. A double degree can work (at a place like Oberlin, Johns Hopkins/Peabody or Lawrence) but be perfectly clear that the expectation will be that your D will be expected to be AS driven and focused as a VP BM-only candidate, PLUS an additional major. Essentially, it’s double the work (almost); music professors will not be content with VP as a sort of secondary focus (at any of the schools listed above). I think I would look at some high level LACs with less competitive, less Conservatory-like (yet still very strong musically) VP programs.
Here are some thoughts on LACs to look at…other parents will have more input ( I hope!):
St. Olaf (major in English, take lessons and sing?)
SUNYs
Ithaca
Lawrence (might work!)
Miami University (Ohio)
Bard?
Wesleyan?
Pepperdine
Just throwing some ideas out there!
You and her should read the dual degree dilemma
http://talk.qa.collegeconfidential.com/music-major/1948726-double-degree-dilemma-essay-written-by-david-lane.html#latest
I really think for someone like this, the better fit might be to find a fit school (possibly a LAC) for her humanities interest where she could work with a good voice teacher - either through the college or locally (sometimes more urban settings can be a better fit for this). And make sure the school that also has some performing opportunities (choir, ensembles, etc). I think many schools your music teacher suggest are not going to be a fit for a multi interested kid. Lawrence and maybe Oberlin may be good, but that would be a 5 year program and will definitely be highly competitive auditions for a soprano looking for a performance degree.
Where might be good to look depends on your financial restrictions. If you can afford your EFC and qualify for need based aid, meets need schools may be good. If you are full pay and/or your EFC is challenging and are hoping for merit, that might be another set of schools. Schools with an ACT 75% of 30 or lower might be good for schools you’re hoping from merit from.
@singingdaughter , does your family qualify for need grants? Need institutional grants at universities are given regardless of degree pursuit or major. Talent merit scholarships though are lost if your D changes degrees. Check out Boston University Trustee Scholarships. Your D might qualify for it (she has the grades). The good thing about applying for the scholarship is that you have to apply early and the live auditions for the Trustee scholarships are usually the first week of December. You will know early in the process if she is successful with the application.
We definitely don’t qualify for need. I have done a lot of research on how to choose a school for merit aid, which can easily be done with my daughter’s stats, unfortunately all that I have learned is going to waste with this list of schools. Even though we don’t qualify for need based aid, I can not pay for these schools. I feel so stuck. I also don’t feel like this list of schools is right for her, especially for what she wants to do.
So east coast schools with VP majors where she can get merit aid and double major? I am not as familiar with that area of the country as some on this forum but off the top of my head I would check out Hartford, U of Maryland, Temple, U of Richmond, Ithaca and Bard. Maybe Vassar if they give merit aid.
Now, if she decides she wants to try some warmer weather, I could come up with a bunch more. LOL.
I would like to hear those. Maybe I can convince her!
I second also University of Richmond. Have you heard of the Richmond scholars? They have arts scholars. Scholars awards include full tuition and/or full rides. Arts scholars are a combination of talent and academics.
These responses are the most help I have had in months. Thank you!!!
Your posts confuse me. Have you read the Double Degree Dilemma essay?
She can do a double degree with performance and academics, but a double major at a school of music would not include an academic one, generally speaking, though if she could find a BA program at a school of music perhaps she could fit in another major.
She really needs to be clear on whether she wants a BM, a BA, a double degree or double major.
I agree with Musakparent’s suggestion of an LAC with private study in voice and extracurricular performance- as I think I wrote once before on another thread.
Tufts has no school of music, but many on your list do. It is a bit of apples and oranges.
Look at the Colleges that Change Lives website (also a book and national fairs) for ideas. College of Wooster, Clark U., many others.
Just to clarify - Curtis is free tuition.
You can PM me if you need Oberlin info. D just graduated in VP.
Thank you for the info! Congrats to your daughter! How many did they accept the year your dtr started there? Does she know what she is doing next?
Free tuition would be great, but not sure yet if it would be a good fit. Will have to do some more research.
Again, Curtis is a conservatory and she could not study liberal arts there. They might have some consortium type arrangement with UPenn, I don’t really know, but most classes would be music with little room for English as a focus.
Oberlin is obviously both a college and a conservatory. She could do a 5 year double degree there, in VP and English for instance. And in the college she could do a BA double major in music and English, but make sure that the best opportunities and teachers don’t go to conservatory students. That is one reason to think about schools that DON’T have a BM program on campus. But there are exceptions. You just need to be careful on this.
If she wants to do a conservatory BM and take excellent liberal arts courses Oberlin Con is a good choice but music will be 2/3-3/4 total classes. Ask about how many liberal arts classes would be possible for a conservatory student interested in English.
Our daughter (who will be a HS junior this fall) is also a vocal performance (classical/opera) and liberal arts (probably English) person, so she’s also looking for a school that is strong in both. We’ve been doing lots of research and come up with several other possibilities that look good in addition to the excellent ones listed here: Princeton (they have their own opera company and a jr. semester abroad program with the Royal College of Music in London, a really good English dept., and also have truly stellar financial aid); Bard (they have their own conservatory now, and a wonderful English/writing program); Kenyon (fabulous for English, and looks strong - for an LAC - for opera, with an Opera and Musical Theater workshop class that puts on productions); Vassar (excellent music dept. with good vocal opportunities including opera, campus that’s full of the arts, and a good English dept. too); and Davidson (tons going on musically, including opera, and really good English).
I’m following this thread with a lot of interest - so much good info here for our daughter’s search too!
Bard’s VP program is, I believe, in the college not the conservatory. (For non VP musicians, the Bard Conservatory requires a double degree for every student)
cschpu has a great lis!.
Many LAC’s and universities will be a good fit. (Princeton is not the only Ivy with good music opportunities.) Check out Barnard as well- right next door to Manhattan School of Music and has programs with Columbia. Being in NYC has advantages. https://music.barnard.edu/
It looks like Bard does not have undergrad voice, only grad.
@singingdaughter Bard does have a vocal performance major - but it’s a BA through the college, not the conservatory. Here is the info on the program: http://music.bard.edu/classical-vocal-performance/ The downside is the merit money from the conservatory would not be available, the upside is there would be more flexibility in the academic choices. All concerts from the conservatory are open to everyone, and all the master classes in Dawn Upshaw’s graduate program would be open to attend.
Thank you so much! This is so helpful!