<p>Monydad,
Congrats to your daughter on getting into Barnard. It seems like there is a great sense of school spirit among the women there. </p>
<p>As for this thread, unfortunately there will always be people who feel the need to put others down to make themselves feel better--even if it is just in jest. </p>
<p>CG</p>
<p>A big congrats to your daughter, Monydad!</p>
<p>One of our friends in our group of friends is a Barnard woman.</p>
<p>We certainly consider her our academic equal and our social equal.</p>
<p>In high school everyone knew a group that coasted and were academically superficial. It's a familiar clique. That clique does exist at Barnard and I'm not really aware of that at Columbia. </p>
<p>It's sad to see a school defined by its lowest common denominator ... or it's highest. Unfortunately, Barnard is often defined by Columbia students by its lowest and that's not fair. (See Columbia 2002's previous post on Barnard students. It's incredibly demeaning.)</p>
<p>There are many, many Barnard women who are very serious and truly interesting. My friend came from a small town and found the cozy image that Barnard presents very appealing. </p>
<p>Barnard stresses that ... I took the tour as well. You get the story, "we have these small groups, you have a serious advisor that will hold your hand, you have this academic support and you don't have to go over to that big scary Columbia unless you want to."</p>
<p>This really sells Barnard to some parents and some girls as well and they KNOW it. So the Barnard Family Decision ends up being a great compromise; the parents feels all warm and secure that their little girl is safe and the little girl gets to come to New York and be all secure and safe. They bought the Barnard package which can be very appealing.</p>
<p>But what happens when the little girl gets here and find out that she's not so insecure and she's really ready to swim in the mainstream academically and socially? Well, there's Columbia right across the street.</p>
<p>What Columbia did not sell was the reality that you will find your own niche and your own group of friends if the Admissions Committee really did their job and admitted the kind of student they really want. </p>
<p>Those Barnard girls who were really ready for a Columbia experience can basically have one if they want one.</p>
<p>Reality check: there really are packs of girls at Barnard who stand in front of the mirror for an hour and get their make up ready and their BCBG dresses all straight and go out in a group to a club and come back drunk. </p>
<p>At Columbia a coed group is more likely to be doing Oxy in a room and then heading out not really caring what they look like.</p>
<p>Just a reality check.</p>
<p>Then there's the majority that just work hard, study hard and occassionally go out.</p>
<p>Link here to the inflamatory --- "Why drive the Camry when you can have the Benz." <a href="http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/showthread.php?t=168550&page=2&highlight=barnard+girls%5B/url%5D">http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/showthread.php?t=168550&page=2&highlight=barnard+girls</a></p>
<p>This attitude is not prevalent at Columbia. Most people are just too busy to care.</p>
<p>Oh man, this whole thread reminds me of this girl posting on the Columbia Class of 2011 facebook group claiming that she is getting "an Ivy League degree" because she goes to Barnard. So annoying. It's insulting to both institutions to insinuate they are the same thing.</p>
<p>I mean get over it. Barnard was one of the Seven Sisters which was always prestigious.</p>
<p>It's not like Columbia is Harvard, Princeton or Yale. You actually HAVE TO tell most people it's in the Ivy League.</p>
<p>Who cares. Do you want to end up five or six years after you graduate posting on this thread for kicks with your only claim to fame is that you went to Columbia?</p>
<p>The 2000 Princeton survey indicates that undergraduate degrees equal out:</p>
<p><a href="http://papers.nber.org%5B/url%5D">http://papers.nber.org</a></p>
<p>The real merit test is graduate school.</p>
<p>
[quote]
It's not like Columbia is Harvard, Princeton or Yale. You actually HAVE TO tell most people it's in the Ivy League.
[/quote]
dude. it's not even that. when i say columbia, they're like, "the third world country?" it's rough, man. then i'm like, "no way, it's in ivy league!" Then they're like, "ivy league? the band?" and i'm like, "no no no -- that football conference that started in the 50s," and they're like, "columbia plays football?" and i'm like, "yeah yeah yeah -- we lose every game, haven't you heard?" and they're all like, "dude. *** are you talking about, you coked up colombian," and i'm all like, "no no no -- haven't you heard of the core?" and they're like, "ok. **** this," and they walk away. it's not cool.</p>
<p>Exactly. Exactly. So I don't see why some people get so ****y about someone wanting to claim Columbia.</p>
<p>I don't even bother with the Columbia thing ... it's like "Why would you want to go there, aren't you scared?" </p>
<p>At first I thought they were talking about being scared because I was in New York. It took a while to figure out they were talking about Colombia.</p>
<p>So who cares if someone wants to latch on to Columbia.</p>
<p>Face it, SEAS admissions is easier than CC. And General Studies is not the same thing, and then there's the Teachers College thing. But they all claim Columbia.</p>
<p>So -- really you sound like such an idiot saying NO, I GO TO CC WHERE THE ADMISSIONS RATE WAS ...........</p>
<p>And you sound like such an idiot posting on these boards that going to Barnard is SOOOOOOOOO different when it does not have it be.</p>
<p>It's all what you make of it. I'll stand up for my Barnard friend any day.</p>
<p>My mother drank the cool aid after the Barnard visit and really wanted me to go there. They do a real sales job to the parents about how supportive and safe it is with the little advisors to just hold your hand all the way. I'm surprised the people that give the tours don't show some kind of crossing guard to help the girls across the street to Columbia. They do a hard sell on support, and our own nuturing environment and you don't have to live with BOYS ...and I think it's aimed straight at the parents. I just kept telling my Mom no way, no way. But in all honesty the BOYS are really messy and I don't mean to sterotype but they are the worst to live with.</p>
<p>But that does not mean that those people that do go there are all idiots. They're not.</p>
<p>My favorite part of the thread linked in #44 was how one poster attacked Barnard for having a new dorm on 110th st, rather far from campus and all the other dorms. I have several friends who are seniors at Barnard and have chosen to live there because it's so much nicer a building than the alternatives. (I also have some friends living in the community-resident part of the building, in the penthouse - the whole place is pretty sick living space).</p>
<p>Also, while I agree philosophically with monydad, he is one angry old man.</p>
<p>Denzera, come on now, who in the world would want to live in that neighborhood? Go a block or two east (and maybe a block or two north) and you probably won't even make it out alive.</p>
<p>i'm a transfer from barnard to CC and this is will be one of the few things I say about the process.
obviously, having been part of both schools and having half of my college career in each school, I see advantages and disadvantages to both schools. </p>
<p>Here they are and I'd like to drive the point that the whole Barnard/Columbia process is really what you make of it. There are people on both sides of the street that are happy with staying on their side of the campus and other students who seem to enjoy benefits from both sides.</p>
<p>Barnard
Advantages - more focus on the individual student which is especially useful for freshman (this is through general advising and different programs intended to bond the general body); great in the following departments: Romance Languages, Dance & Architecture (which Columbia doesn't have); underclassmen housing (i say underclassmen bc Columbia does have great upperclassmen housing); more freedom to take courses you'd like; much better food</p>
<p>Disadvantages - minor identity crisis.. are you Columbia or not (there is really no One answer); limitations to classes you can take at Columbia and an excruciatingly painful process to get into courses; no strong Math/Sciences; my personal opinion - frustrating administration</p>
<p>Columbia
Advantages - better facilities and dorm access; yes the 'prestige' of Columbia; better major advising in certain cases; world's leading departments in several cases with a long list of famed academic professors</p>
<p>Disadvantages - general advising isn't as helpful; heavy core (which can be good to certain people)</p>
<p>--</p>
<p>Obviously as you can tell, this is a biased list based on my own preferences. Food and dorm access may not be important at all, you say but for freshman making a bunch of new friends and wanting to overcome the Barnard/Columbia gap, the idea of dorm access is an invisible but nonetheless existing barrier.</p>
<p>I'd be more than happy to answer any individual questions regarding the difference between the two schools. But my point is that there are people that succeed regardless of what school they are from because in the end, it's a matter of what benefits YOU seek to extract. Neither school will feed you things on a silver platter. </p>
<p>Overall, I'm much happier at Columbia because of different personal dissatisfactions at Barnard and there are two other women this academic year who transferred to CC from BC. And please don't forget that CC/SEAS isn't the perfect place for everyone. Plenty transfer out.</p>
<p>
[quote]
Barnard
Advantages - [.....] underclassmen housing (i say underclassmen bc Columbia does have great upperclassmen housing)
[/quote]
</p>
<p>don't freshmen have to live in pretty small triples and stuff? ....also columbia is one of the very few schools where you can (with some luck) get a single all four years.</p>
<p>most freshman at Barnard live in doubles. I'd say less than 25% live in triples, less than 25% live in quads - which is two doubles connected and most live in doubles. But by living conditions I also mean meal plan (which would be mandatory), facilities (like bathrooms, kitchens/ovens) and overall housing office that tries really hard to create innovative events to introduce students to the city and bond, etc.</p>
<p>and for columbia "with some luck" are very exceptional case. I'd say it wouldn't be impossible but most people would prefer doubles (or walk-through doubles) in buildings like schapiro with fast elevators and music practice rooms over Wien with their horrible single situation. overall, it mostly works out that people live in doubles at least once in their undergraduate life at both schools. And if they do live in singles all four years, these singles aren't the best quality</p>
<p>
[quote]
I'd say less than 25% live in triples, less than 25% live in quads - which is two doubles connected and most live in doubles.
[/quote]
</p>
<p>another way to say that is: about half the freshmen live in triples or quads</p>
<p>
[quote]
and for columbia "with some luck" are very exceptional case.
[/quote]
</p>
<p>the only time u need to get lucky is sophomore yr and if you are that against living in a double you can always apply to the LLC.... btw, i lived in a single all four years and never in wien....i'd say most of the buildings are pretty good quality</p>
<p>Shraf, very few Barnard first years live in quads or triples. I think the largest dorm is Sulzberger, and almost all of the rooms in Sulz are doubles. So on each floor there might be 3 triples and 20 doubles. (I don't know the exact number, but floorplans are available from the Barnard web site). The triples are all much larger than the doubles, too -- this is not a case of 3 kids being crammed into a room designed for 2. Only one of the dorms (I think Brooks) has the quads, which really are 2 doubles with desks in a common area; I think the triples there are also suite style, with 2 adjoining rooms, 2 students in the larger, one in the smaller. You can see floor plans here:
<a href="http://www.barnard.columbia.edu/reslife/reshalls/firstyear.html%5B/url%5D">http://www.barnard.columbia.edu/reslife/reshalls/firstyear.html</a></p>
<p>In any case, the vast majority of first years are in doubles. </p>
<p>FWIW, my daughter is in a double and was pleasantly surprised by how much space she has. Obviously it is a dorm room, but I have the sense that she is comfortable and does not feel cramped -- she certainly didn't hesitate to ask me to ship out more stuff to her, so I assume she had a place to store it all.</p>
<p>I have no clue how it compares to Columbia -- my only point is that if you want to continue to play this bash-Barnard game, you won't get too far by complaining about the housing.</p>
<p>well put calmom</p>
<p>For me a single is not about space at all.</p>
<p>It's about privacy.</p>
<p>One of the smallest rooms I had was my freshman year based on square footage. 91 square feet I think.</p>
<p>With smart arranging and creative storage solutions it was great, absolutely great. The small square footage caused me to aggressively seek storage solutions which were very useful in larger rooms later.</p>
<p>Privacy to study at two or three a.m. and play your music gently knowing you are disturbing no one is to me priceless.</p>
<p>Privacy mean freedom. You can handle the space issue you cannot handle the privacy issue.</p>
<p>furthermore, all barnard first-years are in the quad, which is not my idea of ideal freshman-year housing. i loved the fact in carman how my bathroom was my own, and i could store stuff there (even if shared with 3 other guys). in the quad, you have a communal floor bathroom, which is fairly awkward. my barnard gf freshman year lived in a quad room in Brooks - two doubles with a doorway but no door between them. the only time we could "spend quality time" at her place was a 2-hour window each week when all of her roommates had a class. it sucked royally.</p>
<p>so i'm with About Time on the privacy issue. 91 square feet may sound spartan, but it's very workable once you put your mind to it. and the average single at columbia is...</p>
<p><em>queries it up</em></p>
<p>119 square feet.</p>
<p>There are still many good reasons to go to Barnard, and it's not like the living situation is abysmal - I just think Columbia has better housing stock.</p>
<p>
[quote]
You can see floor plans here:
<a href="http://www.barnard.columbia.edu/resl...firstyear.html%5B/url%5D%5B/quote%5D">http://www.barnard.columbia.edu/resl...firstyear.html
[/quote]
</a></p>
<p>i LOVE how calmom included ".columbia" in the web address even though when you search for "barnard housing" from columbia's website you get this address:
<a href="http://www.barnard.edu/reslife/%5B/url%5D">http://www.barnard.edu/reslife/</a>
.....very very amusing that someone would go out of their way to do that.</p>
<p>.....but back to the issue....a friend of mine lived in a triple freshman year (don't remember which building) and the room was smaller than the doubles in carman. You have to bunk and loft beds and stuff like that in order to fit three beds and three desks into the room not to mention it was a hallway style dorm.
The pictures on the barnard website either dont have room sizes or the text is so small you cant see the sizes so i cant comment specifically on that.</p>
<p>Are all people at Columbia as obsessed as you, Shraf? I Googled for "Barnard housing", then posted the link that Google took me to. Here, see?
<a href="http://www.google.com/search?q=barnard+housing%5B/url%5D">http://www.google.com/search?q=barnard+housing</a></p>
<p>I am sorry that you are upset about the fact that barnard.columbia.edu and barnard.edu happen to resolve to the same place. Would you be happier if I just used the IP number, like this? <a href="http://160.39.96.33%5B/url%5D">http://160.39.96.33</a></p>