Asians acceptance rate at Vandy

Colleges and Universities A-Z Vanderbilt University
1

<p>Do asians have a higher chance of getting into Vanderbilt because they make up 9.2% of student population at Vanderbilt? Or is it harder because the college wants a limited number of minorities at Vanderbilt therefore they only accept a certain number of asians or of any ethnicity other than caucasian?</p>

2

<p>Vanderbilt certainly doesn’t want a limited number of minorities… That’s a pretty bold statement…</p>

<p>Asians have the same chance as any other race that isn’t under-represented.</p>

3

<p>If you check the Common Data Set for the previous years, it appears that the percentage of Asian students is rising year by year.</p>

4

<p>I’m confused by the statement, “any other race that isn’t under-represented”. Does this include any other than White?</p>

5

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<p>Since Asians comprise:
– 1.5% of the Tennessee population
– 5% of the overall U.S. population
– 9.2% of the Vanderbilt student population,
then they are OVER-represented at Vanderbilt.</p>

<p>Since Whites comprise:
– 79.5% of the Tennessee population
– 78.1% of the overall U.S. population
– 70.3% of the Vanderbilt student population,
then they are UNDER-represented at Vanderbilt.</p>

<p>source of data:
[The</a> Vanderbilt Profile<em>|</em>Undergraduate Admissions<em>|</em>Vanderbilt University](<a href=“Vanderbilt At A Glance | Undergraduate Admissions | Vanderbilt University”>Vanderbilt At A Glance | Undergraduate Admissions | Vanderbilt University)
[Tennessee</a> QuickFacts from the US Census Bureau](<a href=“http://quickfacts.census.gov/qfd/states/47000.html]Tennessee”>http://quickfacts.census.gov/qfd/states/47000.html)</p>

6

<p>Unlike many schools of similar caliber, I doubt that Vanderbilt has an “Asian ceiling” (yet) because it doesn’t receive as many Asian applicants as other top-20 schools. It’s an open secret that the top universities try to keep their undergraduate Asian enrollment at 20% or less for the sake of “diversity,” which makes for fierce competition if you’re Asian. There are just so many talented Asian applicants. (Personally, I think each student should be judged based on their personal profile, not their ethnicity. But…) Point is, an Asian student may have a better chance of getting into Vanderbilt than, say, Penn or Cornell, because Vandy probably gets fewer Asian applicants than those schools. The reverse may also be true: if you’re a white southern kid you probably have a better shot at Penn than does an Asian kid from a top east coast public school whose academic and ec profile matches yours. It may not be “fair” but that’s pretty much the deal. These schools can pick and choose who they want, and diversity of background matters to them when creating a freshman class. At my son’s high school the guidance counselor was very blunt about telling the kids that their admissions odds would be higher at schools where they would not be the typical applicant in terms of ethnicity, geography and academic area of interest.</p>

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<p>Post #6:

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<p>Do you have any evidence of this?</p>

8

<p>“Under represented” only gives an advantage to minorities in college admissions (hence URM, not just UR).</p>

9

<p>@SoCalDad2, yes there is evidence of this
<a href=“http://www.nytimes.com/roomfordebate/2012/12/19/fears-of-an-asian-quota-in-the-ivy-league/statistics-indicate-an-ivy-league-asian-quota[/url]”>http://www.nytimes.com/roomfordebate/2012/12/19/fears-of-an-asian-quota-in-the-ivy-league/statistics-indicate-an-ivy-league-asian-quota&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;

<p>Look at the graph in the article.<br>
<a href=“http://graphics8.nytimes.com/images/2012/12/13/opinion/AsianRFD/AsianRFD-custom1.jpg[/url]”>http://graphics8.nytimes.com/images/2012/12/13/opinion/AsianRFD/AsianRFD-custom1.jpg&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;

<p>As per U.S. Census data, the percentage of Asians in the U.S. has risen form 2.8% in 1990, to 5.0%. Since 1990, the percentage of 18-20 y.o. Asian kids in the U.S. has doubled. And at Caltech (which does has race-blind admissions) the percentage of Asian kids has risen commensurately.</p>

<p>But at the Ivy League schools, the percentage of Asian kids has stayed mysteriously flat, or has even declined (as in the cases of Yale & Cornell), and has converged to 20% for all the Ivy League schools.</p>

10

<p>Lots of things could be going on here – I would be very careful before I accused schools of suppressing Asian enrollment.</p>

<p>For example, Asians still are very over-represented. Why is that? Because they have comparatively higher GPA’s and SAT’s than other ethnic groups? If so, Asians would become less over-represented over time if colleges moved away from GPA’s and SAT’s, and considered more “holistic” factors at which Asians would not have such a comparative advantage. And, in fact, the recent explosion in applications to “top” colleges probably has forced colleges to place more weight on factors other than GPA’s and SAT’s just as a way to sufficiently narrow the applicant pool. </p>

<p>Also, what has happened to Asian applications over this time? Have they increased as much as applications from other ethnic groups? Or were Asians into the “prestige” schools long before everyone else was? If so, Asians could now be facing more competition for the spots at the top schools.</p>

11

<p>“Asians would become less over-represented over time if colleges moved away from GPA’s and SAT’s, and considered more “holistic” factors at which Asians would not have such a comparative advantage”</p>

<p>SoCalDad2, what exactly do you mean with this statement? Are you stating that the only reason that Asians are overrepresented is b/c they get good GPAs and SATs? Essentially that they are grade-grubbers who have aren’t “holistic” applicants?</p>

<p>Quite a slippery you’re taking, and I’d advise you to tread with caution.</p>

12

<p>Elijah, that is the reason Asians are overrepresented. Asians on average tend to have higher GPAs and SATs, it’s a fact. Just as Hispanics tend to have lower GPAs and SATs. No one is saying they are “grade grubbers” and aren’t holistic Asians just have an advantage in those two measures and it has made them overrepresented in top colleges.</p>

<p>The extracurriculars are probably more equal across the board-- I don’t think there’s any evidence to the contrary. SoCal isn’t saying the Asian applicant pool is disadvantaged in this category, he’s saying they don’t have a particular advantage. If schools reduced emphasis on SAT and GPA, you would naturally start to see the Asian advantage going away and a more even distribution as predicted by the rest of the application outside of SAT/GPA.</p>

13

<p>There was a Duke paper about the academic performance at Duke of different racial groups. While the uproar over the paper was about black Duke students, quietly buried in the paper is: that not only did the asian Duke students have higher academic stats coming in, but they also had higher scored (as rated by the Duke admissions officers) EC’s, recs & essays. All the bars were set higher for the asian kids applying to Duke, not just the SAT bar:
<a href=“http://marginalrevolution.com/marginalrevolution/2012/01/not-catching-up-affirmative-action-at-duke-university.html[/url]”>http://marginalrevolution.com/marginalrevolution/2012/01/not-catching-up-affirmative-action-at-duke-university.html&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;

<p>Since duke is in vandy’s peer group, I would expect similar profiles for the asian students at vandy.</p>

14

<p>Oh, well, that would suggest we’re both wrong. Interesting. Still I would expect Asians to have a larger (and more quantitative, obviously) advantage in SAT/ACT than other areas of applications.</p>

15

<p>Here is an example that expands on my post #10 above: Asians make up x% of college age students. Assume that if colleges accepted entirely on the basis of grades and test scores, Asians would make up 5x of students at top colleges. If colleges accepted entirely on the basis of factors other than grades and test scores, Asians would make up 2x of students at top colleges. Thus, Asians are outperforming other students on all measures, but are comparatively better at grades and test scores than on other measures.</p>

<p>If colleges shift their focus from grades and test scores to other factors, the percentage of Asian students will decline. Such a change in focus probably has occurred over the past 20 years: colleges have moved more to holistic factors to achieve diversity, and more to holistic factors as an additional way to narrow done the ever expanding applicant pool. Thus, the representation of Asians in colleges could stay about the same even though the percentage of students who are Asians increases. And it is not because of any policy to limit Asians.</p>

16

<p>“Since Duke is in Vandy’s peer group I would expect similar profiles for Asain students at Vandy”<br>
Duke is far more popular with US and international Asian students than Vanderbilt. Duke has already hit their Asian ceiling making it very difficult for Asian students to get in. Vanderbilt is still looking to attract and grow it’s Asian student body so it probably is easier for an Asian student to be accepted into Vandy.
The referenced article was about the failure of affirmative action for black students at Duke. I’m sure one could find articles supporting it as well.</p>

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<p>Do you have any evidence of that?</p>

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<p>The Ivies have an Asian quota of 20% it seems since none of their Asian populations seemingly ever cross that threshold (Harvard for sure). The best non-Ivies tend to enroll a greater percentage of Asians for some reason: Stanford, MIT, Duke, Johns Hopkins, UChicago, etc.</p>

19

<p>I would not put much faith in the reported ethnic mix at elite universities. First, more and more students elect to leave the race question blank. It’s not unusual to see >10% of students as race unknown. Next, international students race is blank. International students can comprise >10% of the students at elite universities. The percentage of mixed races continues to grow (aren’t we all) and can make up >5% of the students. So 25% of students at many elite universities are race unknown and that is before students stretch the truth.</p>

20

<p>“The Ivies have an Asian quota of 20% it seems since none of their Asian populations seemingly ever cross that threshold (Harvard for sure)”</p>

<p>I’m not sure if this really works. Perhaps set that as an upperbound at the admissions stage, but I don’t know how they would control the percentages (doesn’t Harvard have like over a 75% yield rate? Maybe not that high, but high nonetheless) that actually enroll. I suppose places like that can sync the two because they have likely gotten to the point where the amount they accept is much closer to the desired size of the class than at other schools (as would be the case for a 75%+ yield rate). For all we know, the other non-Ivy top 25 or so schools could be attempting a similar thing, but since their yield is lower, they get a much larger Asian enrollment (with places like Duke, Chicago, and Rice hovering between 20-30%, Emory 30-35%, etc.) than what they may have been aiming for. Though honestly, these places seem not to mind it.</p>

<p>bud123: But wouldn’t Asians (both international and Asian Americans) have less ability to do that simply because of the name. I think you may more likely see this among whites, and yes, maybe international students. Oh, and a question. Are you saying that international students would not or are not asked to reveal their ethnicity? I ask because, apparently last year, Emory’s class had 34% Asian/Pacific Islander, etc, and apparently 18% of that incoming class was international (with China, India, and South Korea likely being the majority of those students). Does this mean that the 18% of those and the 4% of the unidentified student body is not included in that figure or do you think such schools would just present an approximation for that category?</p>