<p>Okay. All I have to say is that Berkeley and Michigan are DEFINITELY not in the Top 6 Universities of the US. In the Top 15 possibly, but definitely not anywhere in the top 6.</p>
<p>Dylin88, for undergrad, I agree. However, if for grad, I would say that Berkeley is in the top 6, and if you are just talking about doctoral, then arguably in at least the top 3.</p>
<p>The OP was very interesting and I am much more interested and enthusiastic about Berkeley. I was worried that I wouldn't have the opportunites of a private school, but now I know that I can as long as I am an active student. Thank you so much! I obviously don't expect perfection, but I know that I can make it a great experience as long as I will it. Thanks again!</p>
<p>I would imagine harvard would be easier to endure because of the 4 year dorm system and excellent and diverse student body; quite a contrast to berkeley huge, and often rude and incompotent student body.</p>
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Sakky, we look at Berkeley and see two different places. I see a great university with a matchless faculty and unique opportunities for undergrads, which also happens to be in one of the most exciting places in the country. You see (only slightly paraphrased) a place with an especially cold bureaucracy and plenty of professors who do not want to teach.
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<p>You are wrong about me. I see Berkeley and, like you, I also see a great university with unique opportunities....but for GRAD students. I also see an undergraduate school that is not bad, but could be so much better than it is. </p>
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But in your innumerable posts on this site you dont group all research institutions together. You have a hierarchy. First, you are quick to criticize Berkeley. As I said before, you have an animus toward Berkeley. You are right there any time someone says something substantively positive about Berkeley. Dont kid yourself that you recognize Berkeleys great strengths. You may concede that Berkeley is good at X, but will come back immediately and say its crap at Y. Second, your hierarchy places top private schools automatically ahead of the top public ones. That may be true in many cases. But if there is one public school in competition with the privates, across a spectrum of activities, it is Berkeley. In extolling the privates you share with so many other posters at College Confidential an almost comical infatuation with private higher education.
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<p>Hardly so. It's not that I have an infatuation with private education. I have an infatuation with GOOD education, whether public or private. In fact, I have stated countless times that Berkeley is a great place to go for graduate school. If I'm really so biased against public schools, why would I be saying that? I have stated numerous times how impressed I am with the Haas School MBA program as well as obviously the myriad top Berkeley doctoral programs that are often times better than the doctoral programs of the top private schools. I have also stated that I believe that UCSF Med is the best medical school on the West Coast, beating out many private med-schools, including Stanford's. In other threads, I have also praised the law, medical, and business schools of the University of Michigan, and the law and business schools of the University of Virginia. I would hardly say that this is the mark of somebody who is biased in favor of private schools as a whole. </p>
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Harvard is nirvana for most posters. But if you can get past the name it has its own problems with undergraduate education. Consider these remarks from the March 6, 2006 issue of The New Republic about the forced resignation of Harvards president, Larry Summers. (Some of what follows pertains in varying degrees to most research universities).
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<p>Nobody is saying that Harvard is perfect. But on the whole, I think it does a better job with its undergraduate education than Berkeley does. On the other hand, I would say, and have always said, that there are plenty of doctoral programs at Berkeley that are better than Harvard's. </p>
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Sakky, do not seem capable of ever yielding. You do not recognize your hostility to Berkeley
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<p>Hostility to Berkeley? Then why would I spend any time praising Berkeley's graduate schools? Even the undergrad program, I have stated is arguably the best public one in the country. </p>
<p>My beef with the program is not that I am hostile to it, but rather that I see its shortcomings and I want them fixed. You seem to not want them to be fixed. If that is the case, then why not come out and say so - that you're not really interesting in having Berkeley fix its problems. Then at least we would be having an honest discussion. </p>
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You answer by saying that if I dont like Sowells column, I can go to the book he wrote on the same topic. How is this responsive. You mean to say that Sowell expanded his negative, misbegotten views on public research universities into a book? His views in this area are still wrong. If you want to support Sowell by writing that he is a distinguished scholar while Im just a Berkeley Parent do so, for that is the thrust of your answer.
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<p>And I would ask you, how is this response of yours 'responsive'? You have already made up your mind about Sowell without bothering to read his book. You don't even want to give him a chance to convince you. And you're complaining that ** I ** am not being responsive? </p>
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I encourage you to develop a little introspection and admit your bias. Maybe you're starting to. It seems I may have pushed you into saying a few unqualifiedly positive things about Berkeley. The last word is yours.
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<p>Oh really? You pushed me into doing so? And I have been saying on this board that Berkeley is a top grad program and a pretty good undergrad program for years before you even showed up on this board. Search back through my old post history if you don't believe me. You didn't push me into doing anything that I wasn't already doing before I had ever even heard of you. </p>
<p>If my opinions are strong, it is because nothing that I have seen has caused me to change my opinion about the problems of Berkeley. Berkeley still has problems in not allowing people to switch majors. Berkeley still has problems in not helping those students who are mentally weak-willed. Berkeley still has problems with a cold bureaucracy. Berkeley still has problems with weeder classes that screw over certain students. In short, all of the problems that I have been talking about for years have still not been fixed. </p>
<p>What I ultimately want is for Berkeley to fix its problems. That is why my opinions are strong. The question to me is, do you want Berkeley to get better or not? If not, then just say so.</p>