best stretch schools for my DD

Parents Forum
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<p>she has a 3.3/3.4 GPA at a VERY competitive public high school (15% of the graduating class goes to HYPMS or the five other ivies, 100% go to college, one out of 400 went to community college, etc, etc) 2200 or so SATS, junior year took AP BC Calc, several AP and at least one post AP next year, good if not outstanding EC/summer activities. Interested in engineering/architecture, but likes liberal arts.</p>

<p>Her "match" schools are going to be RPI, UofR, Vtech, probably Lehigh, Lafayette, Bucknell, F&M, some other state schools. Safeties, maybe Drexel, U of Delaware. </p>

<p>Stretch schools have us befuddled though. Ruling out HYPMS based on grade average, EC's and poor match all around. </p>

<p>I think though, she should apply to one or more of the following - JHU, Chicago, Cooper Union, Penn, Cornell, Barnard. </p>

<p>Of those she has only visited Cornell so far, and liked it. She would presumably apply engineer or arch there, not arts and sciences. I think she would be a good match for JHU or Chicago (nerdy, intellectual, very non-alpha kind of girl). Barnard - she likes NY, Barnard gives access to Columbia, but a more protected community. Penn - I don't know, somehow we all think Penn is logical. </p>

<p>I realize at this level admissions is a crap shoot, and she has her GPA against her despite her excellent high school. I would love even a hint at which stretch schools might be more realistic for her, or just better fits.</p>

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<p>I saw your other post, and I think - though this would definitely be a reach - Caltech would be a good school for your D. It has great science/engineering programs (obviously), but has a small, quirky, “CTY” vibe to it. The major problem is that it is very selective - though it has a higher acceptance rate than MIT, it’s a very different applicant pool.</p>

<p>Has she considered Harvey Mudd? What about Olin (very unique application process, will probably rely less upon raw numbers)?</p>

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<p>OP- where do the kids like her from her HS go?</p>

<p>Are you NY residents and are the finances a concern?</p>

<p>Does she have any EC’s to suggest that engineering/architecture are more than just a passing fancy? </p>

<p>And is her math score higher than her verbal?? Among my kids friends, Cornell engineering was the most selective (stats wise) of the schools you’ve listed-- they seemed unwilling (or didn’t to) risk a spot on a kid whose math wasn’t at the tippy top, the rest of the profile notwithstanding. We know lots of kids who got into Penn for engineering who didn’t get into Cornell- even though I seem to recall that statistically, the kids should either have gotten into neither or both.</p>

<p>And see if she can tell you what she liked about Cornell. If it was the rural thing, Barnard and JHU and Cooper Union may not be such great choices.</p>

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<p>It would be helpful to know where she ranks in her class or, if the HS doesn’t rank, what decile she’s in. Unless her high school practices severe grade deflation, her GPA seems somewhat low for the schools you mention.</p>

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<p>Chicago doesn’t have any engineering programs at all, so if she’s interested in that, I wouldn’t spend time applying to UC. Again, consider caltech and cornell. Caltech would put a lot more weight on her math/science GPA. She could also apply early decision to, say, Cornell, which would improve her chances a lot. If she does do that, make sure she writes about her campus visit in her essay but in a unique way.</p>

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<p>Chicago may be an anti-match, since it has 0 undergraduate programs in engineering or architecture. There are some courses in architectural history and theory, and a lively amateur engineering subculture, but if she really wants to take a shot at studying those things as a primary focus Chicago would be very frustrating. </p>

<p>Hopkins has engineering, but not architecture. I don’t know whether engineering is available to Barnard students.</p>

<p>Cornell and Penn would be great, of course, but are super-reachy with her GPA, and 2200 SATs are nothing out of the ordinary there. If her school is in NY or NJ, I assume that a fair number of the kids going to Ivies are going to Cornell or Penn, so it ought to be reasonably possible to get a sense of how she matches up with the students those colleges accept from her school.</p>

<p>Others to put on the table: Rice! Great college, students love it, and not as competitive for applicants from the Northeast as any of the stretch schools mentioned above. Smith, with its unique, fully accredited engineering program, and five-college consortium. Northwestern and Notre Dame, which actually have engineering and architecture. Michigan and Wisconsin, where her GPA may hurt her but her test scores may be enough to overcome that.</p>

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<p>Carnegie Mellon might be a possibility. If she’s interested in architecture she should realize that there are two major paths. One is to major in something else (which at a few schools can be a BA in architectural studies of some sort) and then go on to get an M. Arch., or she could go for the B. Arch now. However at many schools that requires a portfolio - I don’t recommend it unless a kid is pretty sure they want to be an architect. It’s a lot less expensive since it requires only 5 years of schooling instead of 6 or 7.</p>

<p>I’m guessing RPI is pretty safe, especially as a young woman. At least at our high school they accept (3/4) or waitlist (1/4) nearly everyone who applies with weighted GPAs down to the low 90s.</p>

<p>Second the suggestion of Rice, my nephew has blossomed there. He chose it over Cornell.</p>

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<p>Third suggestion for Rice: gorgeous campus, cosmopolitan city, inclusive and friendly student body, lots of faculty support, terrific academics and lots of flexibility with changing majors and doing research / creating programs and pursuing activities… :)</p>

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<p>This place. They might be forgiving of her GPA with a great GC rec and school profile. [The</a> Fu Foundation School of Engineering & Applied Science - Columbia University](<a href=“http://engineering.columbia.edu/]The”>http://engineering.columbia.edu/)</p>

<p>They actively recruit women.</p>

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<p>Vandy, Northwestern, also for non-binding EA get early apps into Michigan, Wisconson and Tulane. Case Western is a good engineering school/match or even safety that is known for good financial aid if that is a concern.</p>

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<p>Barnard has a good architecture program, but Barnard doesn’t have the same cross registration with SEAS as it does with Columbia College.</p>

<p>I would suggest applying to SEAS and Barnard.</p>

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<p>Just a thought…MIT. I just read where the admission rate for girls is 20% and they specifically say a mix of As and Bs is okay.</p>

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<p>If you don’t mind me saying so, I think you have some reaches on your list already. I think 2200 SAT makes it look worse that she has 3.3 GPA. Some of those top tier schools expect kids to take most rigorous courses and get As.</p>

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<p>If she is considering Barnard, your “nerdy, intellectual, very non-alpha kind of girl” may like Bryn Mawr. Bryn Mawr offers at least one 3-2 Engineering program. Students interested in Architecture often major in Growth and Structure of Cities, then pursue a Master’s in Architecture.</p>

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<p>Wash U
Tufts
Trinity
Smith</p>

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<p>Wash U has both engineering and architecture. A very good school all around…</p>

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<p>I think the first thing your daughter needs to decide is if she wants to go directly into an engineering or architecture program or if she wants a BS/BA liberal arts program. Not that she couldn’t apply to both, but her reach/match/safety list would be very different depending on which route she takes.</p>

<p>She may have the skill set (and/or talent) that would get her into engineering or architecture that would make her GPA/scores less pertinent, but then she’d have to commit herself to enginnering or architecture which would preclude a general liberal arts education. I’m not saying that one approach is better than another, just that they are very different in the way she would assemble her shortlist, craft her application, and, ultimately, spend her undergraduate experience.</p>

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<p>In addition to Bryn Mawr, she might look at some of the other “Main Line” colleges, Haverford and Villanova, but I think the suggestion for BrynMawr is excellent.</p>

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<p>Admission to architecture at Cornell is extremely selective and very dependent on an extensive portfolio and an interview. This is not something to be approached casually.</p>

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<p>Blossom has some good points. It is unclear to me and maybe others what your daughters likes and if she is set on engineering. As many have said Chicago is an outlier as it has no engineering or architecture. It is also a place that is self selecting. Perhaps if you gave more information about your daughters likes it might help. Clearly she has good solid test scores and GPA but not tippy, tippy top although if she will get a slight boost as a female.</p>