Big, BIG dilemma---HELP?

College Search & Selection
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<p>Okay, okay! I re-read the agreement, and the mistake was my own. The part of the Early Decision agreement that I misread was the following:

I screwed up again, guys! Let the “how can you make it through college if you can’t even read a simple agreement?” comments ensue. </p>

<p>I would like to thank cptofthehouse for bad-mouthing Muhlenberg; not only did it prompt me to re-read the agreement, but it made me realize how attached to Muhlenberg I really am. I was cringing as I read your comments on Muhlenberg making a joke of Early Decision. I hope you realize now that Muhlenberg isn’t actually making a joke of the agreement. I just made a foolish mistake in reading the Early Decision agreement.</p>

<p>With that said, my main problem now is that I’m expected to pay the deposit without having an official financial aid package from the school. The agreement which I have in front of me right now says, “Usually, a nonrefundable deposit must be made well in advance of May 1.” Okay. That’s understandable. It doesn’t, however, say anything about being required to pay a deposit before being given a financial aid package. I still have to call the school and request an extension.</p>

<p>** Side-note: the “official” estimate used to be available on my account on the financial aid website. It is no longer there. I think its disappearance is related to the fact that they have now received my FAFSA. So, at this point, I don’t even have an official financial aid estimate anymore. **</p>

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<p>You understand your agreement now, and just need to know what the financial aid offer is before you sign up. I’ve heard elsewhere (books, I believe) that it is totally appropriate for you to ask for an extension until you’ve seen your FA offer. Maybe they consider what they have already given you ‘official’ for the terms of the ED agreement. Maybe not. Good luck!!</p>

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<p>Kittycatwindow, this is your first time in doing college apps. Muhlenberg does this thousands of times. They should have made it CLEAR even though, yes, it is in the application when you apply, EXACTLY what the next steps should be when they sent you your ED acceptance and Financial aid estimate. That you have received other acceptances and some merit packages, in the interim means you now have some basis for comparison as to what Muhlenberg has offered you They gave you the financial aid package and that was all. You can call and tell them that it is not enough, and that you know you can do better, and ask if they can come up with some more money, through financial aid or merit to what your family needs and wants for you to get to seal the deal. Otherwise, you don’t turn in the $400 deposit and acceptance and you OFFICIALLY TELL MUHLENBERG you want a release from the ED. Otherwise, they can put your name on the ED Accepted list and those schools that subscribe to it will flush your name and merit money, in terms of the ED agreements that all of these schools so sloppily have joined. Yes, that can happen. So you have to talk to Muhlenberg about this and make sure your name does not show up on the list if they subscribe to such a list, and yes, this list does exist. </p>

<p>Since the issue is merit money, and that comes from the Admissions Office, a quick resolution of this by Muhlenberg can be made. They either can and will give you a merit award that is acceptable to you at which point you sign the papers and send the deposit and let the other schools know that it’s game over as you agreed to do on your applicaton which you and some adults also signed, most likely. Or you tell them, and you had better do this in writing as well, that you are turning down Muhlenberg for financial reasons as permitted by your ED agreement and want to be free to pursue other options and want to make sure that Muhlenberg has totally released you from any obligations of the ED contract.</p>

<p>Though this whole thing is a mess, the problem is that it can all come together in the end when all of the deadlines, offers and agreements come to light by everyone and you can then lose it all if you are not upholding your end of the deal as you signed you would do and as ED is prescribed to work. That these schools are foolishly destroying their own hunting grounds is beside the point, once all of the air clears. They should not be issuing RD and merit offers before ED offers fo peer schools. February is ridiculously early. But none of that matters. You have to do as you signed you would do, or it could end badly.</p>

<p>Also, any ED financial aid package is just an estimate. You don’t get the final package from any school until all of the numbers are verified. ED particularly is an estimate because you likely gave them estimated numbers, given how early the PROFILE needed to be completed for ED. So you have your Financial AId estimate from Muhlenberg. It 's the estimate they sent you. It’s not easy to give MORE in fin aid as you have to have the numbers to back up need. Usually ED kids get the best financial aid packages but lousy or no merit money because there is no stipulation for merit money. Strictly speaking, you can back out only if your financial aid is not what you and your family can afford, no mention of merit if you reread your materials. But now that you know what you can get for merit, it naturally changes your perspective on what you expect from M, and you and your family could probably give a rat’s ass whether it is fin aid or merit money. You just want the money.</p>

<p>The way it is supposed to work and usually works is that you get the acceptance from your ED school with the estimated aid package and you don’t get anything else from any other school–maybe something from your rolling admissions state school. So you would not have known that schools like your other choices would offer you anything. All you would have is the Muhlenberg fin aid estimate in hand and it would be take it or leave it. You can see how it changes the situation drastically when that flock in the bush all alight into your hands.</p>

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<p>Kittycat - I gave you a hard time this morning, and you were mistaken about being allowed to compare financial aid offers before deciding . . . but I have to agree with cptofthehouse on this and place the bulk of the blame on Muhlenberg.</p>

<p>I know the ED rules because they’ve been discussed extensively on CC. But I’m guessing you have other things to do with your time than hang out on CC all day reading about ED agreements . . . and, frankly, you shouldn’t have to. The schools that use ED should go out of their way to make their agreements clear and easy to understand. And they don’t.</p>

<p>Muhlenberg was late with their offer of admission. The other schools were early. And now Muhlenberg’s offer looks pretty lame in comparison. I think you should go to them and ask them to reconsider. And I get it now - you still don’t have financial aid offers from the other schools, just merit offers. So whatever you decide, you’re taking a chance . . .‘cause you don’t know what the other schools’ final offers will be. You’re stuck with that . . . that’s the way the ED game is played. But you should still go back and try to negotiate with Muhlenberg. What have you got to lose?</p>

<p>Just make it very clear that the merit offer you received from Ursinus arrived before Muhlenberg’s ED admit letter . . . so they know you didn’t break the ED agreement.</p>

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<p>Why do you say this? From any individual school’s point of view, making an early merit aid offer to a desirable student is a smart thing to do. Are you saying this because of some agreement between peer schools related to reciprocal ED respect or something?</p>

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<p>Yes, because of “some agreement”. One of the few agreements. I hate seeing any agreements being thrown to the winds, as there are so few of them. The ED agreement is quite clear. Though, I am not a proponent of it, I do believe that when there are such agreements, they should be honored. Of course, any of those schools may be ones that do not subscribe to ED agreements, and they may not be peer schools. </p>

<p>I over reacted to the whole thing because it was just such a wreck the way it all turned out, Mathmovt. It’s complicated enough, this whole process is, and when more curve balls are added to the process, it’s crazy to expect amateurs which most of us are to be able to figure out how it all works. Integrity is the thing Admissions Officers will tell you is utmost in how they feel people should operate, and yet, time and again, we see that they are hardly holier than thou. </p>

<p>My suspicion is that the OP would have gotten some merit had she not applied ED to Muhlenberg. We’ll see if they come up with any upon being told that a half dozen other schools have antied up.</p>

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<p>Colleges issue RD offers on whatever schedule they like – should they have to care about other schools’ ED dates? Obviously, to be competitive, they want to give decisions no later than April 1, but they can give them earlier if they feel like it.</p>

<p>Obviously, an ED applicant should not count on seeing other schools’ decisions before the ED deadlines.</p>

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<p>First of all, I want to apologize to the OP for making a bunch of inflammatory statements. I have a thing about ED, and when I see these things, it makes me go off on a flyer, and it was inappropriate of me.</p>

<p>You did not do anything wrong. You applied ED2 to your top choice school and you were accepted with a financial aid estimate, just the way it should work ideally. You have until Wednesday to send in your deposit and claim your spot, or let Muhlenberg know that the estimated financial aid offer is not enough for you to go there, much as you would like to dd so, and that you have in hand a bunch of merit offers from other schools that show you that you can go to college for much less, and if M cannot give you more financial aid, whether they can come up with merit money. If the best they can do is not enough for your family to afford M, then you withdraw your app and accept from M, and that is the end of that option. Make sure you get their official permission to withdraw, as ED is a serious commitment and breaking it can put you on a list that can get your apps flushed from other colleges. So if a school releases you from such a commitment, that is something you must make sure is addressed. </p>

<p>I still think it’s ridiculously early the way offers are coming out in February, but it’s my opinon and as Ucbalumnus and others have said, it’s what ever a school wants to do. They are cutting their own throats and complicating the matter when they are not taking ED schedules, their own in some cases, into account in doing this, but it’s up to them and they are certainly allowed to do this. Clearly, it gives some advantage in snagging some kids. </p>

<p>I don’t like ED because what a student/family gives up is getting to see all those offers most of the time and making their decision in a vacuum. As you have personally seen, it makes a difference. Had the other schools not offered anything, you would be stuck with having to decide to take or leave Muhlenberg with no idea that you could do better in terms of money. That you have these offers as additional info, has given you a leg up in the process. I don’t think you are going to get much more than M gave you, in terms of financial aid, as schools usually give ED applicants a good go with the aid as they do not want to lose them. ED is supposed to be a 100% yield for them. Merit is a whole different story, and i’ve always suspected that schools “cheat” ED kids from that since it is not covered in teh ED agreement, and why do they have to give someone a discount that already has committed? The whole purpose of merit is to try to get the students you want most to come, and if they are already coming, it’s not a wise use of money. Not all schools operate that way, but a number of them do. Every year for the past 15, really more sporadically, I’ve seen parents upset that their ED kid who was clearly top catch in just about every way did not get merit offered to their peers who have to decide by May where to go. The ED kids are a done deal and the RD kids still need to be “caught”. </p>

<p>You are in the great position of getting to eat your cake and keep it too, as you have the ED accept along with being able to see what other schools would offer you, and the ability to negotiate with M with those other offers a reality. Those options are usually what an ED applicant loses when they sign that agreement in exchange for earlier acceptance and usually some leeway in the admissions scrutiny. So, congrats and good luck to you. Talk to M and see if something can be done. Otherwise you have some great choices. I’ve yet to meet a Ursinus or Allegheny grad that I did not like. My neighbors like M so much they sent both their kids there who have graduated and loved the experience and are doing weill, and they paid full freight. All good choices and one certainly not worth a whole lot more in cost than the others.</p>

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<p>Kittycat- Find out who your financial aid advisor is and talk to him or her. I actually cried real tears and they gave me a much better package. Tell them that you really, really want their school and then tell them about your expenses!</p>

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<p>Call Muhlenberg now. Spell out this whole mess. Ask for an extension until the financial package from them is available. I have found them to be OUTSTANDING. They will work with you, I am certain. S applied regular decision everywhere but had a better initial package from Ursinus until we got the school aid from Muhlenberg. Muhlenberg worked out better after all the packages were on the table. Honest. Talk to them and best of luck.</p>

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<p>Why should a school which has completed its admissions evaluations in February delay letting applicants know the results?</p>

<p>Here is an example: San Jose State University admits purely by the numbers, intended major, state residency, and local area residency. It has completed its admissions evaluations and has posted the thresholds, so that any applicant can easily find out if s/he was admitted: [url=<a href=“http://info.sjsu.edu/static/admission/impaction.html]Info.sjsu.edu[/url”>http://info.sjsu.edu/static/admission/impaction.html]Info.sjsu.edu[/url</a>] .</p>

<p>Are you saying that it should have delayed notification and posting of the admission thresholds until April 1? Note that SJSU does not have any EA or ED program of its own.</p>

<p>There are other cases where a school has an automatic admission threshold so that some students know that they are in (ironclad admissions safety) when they apply.</p>

<p>I agree with you in not liking ED, but I do not agree that schools need to consider other schools’ ED schedules when releasing their own admissions decisions.</p>

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<p>I believe one of the things cptofthehouse was saying is that many of these schools are on the same ED schedule as the peer schools they’re trying to poach from . . . so, in the end, they’re poisoning the water for themselves as well.</p>

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<p>I’m going to raise this again lest it get lost in the shuffle: One thing the OP has to keep in mind is that merit and need-based aid usually do not “stack”. The OP could get a merit award from Muhlenberg, have their need-based award reduced by the same amount, and end up owing the exact same $$$, particularly if they were not actually “gapped” but are just shocked by their expected contribution. Similarly the merit awards offered by peer schools may mean that the need-based award from those schools is that much lower than M’s.</p>

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<p>I’m about to call! I’m not sure whether to call Admissions or Financial Aid, though, since both are involved. I guess I should start with Admissions to see if they can extend my deadline, and then I’ll make my way over to FA if needed.</p>

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<p>Kittycat - Merit aid comes from the admissions office, not the financial aid office, so that’s who you need to be talking to. You’re asking them to meet another school’s offer - and that’s an admissions decision.</p>

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<p>Yes, call admissions first. However, if they cannot (will not) offer you merit aid, you could also ask if it’s possible to get any additional need-based aid. You can at least ask them to clarify what they computed your “need” at. If they included loans in your package, you could see if they can meet your need without loan (as would likely happen at a school where you received significant merit) allowing you to use the federal loans you are entitled to anyhow to try to meet some of the family contribution part.</p>

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<p>^^^I have to say, I admire you for handling all of this on your own. I think most kids’ involvement with the college app process ends when they press submit on the common app. That you are manuvering your way through the FA as well - a process that intimidates most adults, (including myself!) speaks to your maturity. I hope it all works out for you…and you get to go to your dream school. And keep in mind, that wherever you end up…even if it doesn’t seem to be “the dream”…will be a great expereince if you keep an open mind. Good luck!</p>

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<p>Yes, call Admissions first and tell them the situation. You did not get enough money from Financial Aid to go there. You want to go there. You have already gotten acceptance and merit money in the amount of $X from other schools and if you don’t get more from M, you want to be released from the ED contract. Until this gets resolved, you need an extension on your deadline.</p>

<p>Be aware that though you will likely be sent over to Fin Aid, they may not be able to raise your aid money. They can’t do it i without the financial numbers to back it up? What is your EFC? That will give you some idea as to how much your family is expected to pay for college, and it’s not doable to simply give you more when you don’t qualify. THere has to be demonstrated need to back up financial aid awards. </p>

<p>But merit money which is usually given out by Admissions is a whole other story. Usually there is a lot of discretion as to who gets how much in merit money. So you might want to let Admissions know that you understand that Fin Aid might not be able to raise your award, and that you would like Admissions to see what they can do on their end about this.</p>

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<p>Actually, luckily for me, the Dean of Admissions is also the Dean of Financial Aid. I just spoke to him on the phone, and I guess I was too nervous to actually get anything accomplished because now I’m off the phone and I still have the same problem. </p>

<p>He said that the estimate I received should be counted as the financial aid package… so me asking for a deadline extension didn’t exactly work out. </p>

<p>He then said he could confirm the package over the phone, and the estimate he told me actually increased (a whopping $95) from the estimate I got on the internet. </p>

<p>I meant to ask what Muhlenberg computed my EFC to be, but I completely forgot. I don’t know if I should call back or something.</p>

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<p>kittycat, did you ask about merit aid explicitly? Did you tell them that your parents don’t think they can afford the amount their aid package leaves them to pay, and ask if there’s any way it can be improved? It may be worth getting your parents involved at this point. Good luck!</p>