My child was fortunate to be accepted to Brown and to be accepted to Tulane with a Stamps scholarship that covers full COA + funds for enrichment pursuits [knock me over with a feather right?] I am in over my head as I am purely a product of public education and likely cannot appreciate the value of different private education opportunities.
My strong inclination is Tulane with the full scholarship for the obvious financial reasons. We ‘could’ pay the Brown COA but not without serious commitment of resources and we would feel the “loss” of roughly $230,000 [$280K - $60K saved] that we would pay for college instead of saving and investing.
So I am reaching out to this group of people that are likely knowledgeable about Brown and what it has to offer for thoughts and feedback as to what I might be missing and why Brown might be worth passing up the Tulane+Stamps opportunity.
Also, to any student that may read this and who has just undergone the college application process at this level, you have my sympathy and admiration. It is a brutal, insane and demanding process that bears no resemblance to the process that I [and by proxy your parents] went through. Wherever you end up - congratulations and keep up the good work!
For starters, what part of the country are you from? What are your child’s long term plans? Intended major? Do you think the $280,000 could be used for grad school? That might give us some more ability to weigh in.
It’s my understanding that being a Stamps Scholar follows you for life - in the best way. Tulane is a fantastic college even without Stamps. I would find that very hard to turn down.
@jsnowut : Tulane is associated with some mental issues and Brown is the opposite. Just google “Tulane suicide rate” and take a close look. If you are sure your child won’t have that kind of issue, the next step is considering premed. In case you don’t know, junior doctor’s salary is close to $200K, specialists earn a lot more. So all your loss can be gained back in a few years if everything works out. However, premed rule #1 is you and your child do not talk about pre-med until the end of first semester, preferably after your son finishs organic chemistry. If things don’t work out, obviously free tuition is the best. Brown is the most friendly place to do premed, that is, if your child’s academic capability is indeed strong. The bottom line is if you indeed go for premed, where he can have the best chance to succeed. Engineering is physical science. Premed is life science. They are quite different. From your posts, it seems that you don’t have a lot of experience with STEM. Very few premeds are engineering majors. In fact, GPA is the most important thing for premed. For engineering majors, your son must start engineering curriculum at freshman year in order to graduate in 4 years. For pre-med, your son can major in anything. However if he failed, there are not many jobs available for those “failed premeds”. Well, it is a bit complicated as you can see.
@jsnowut : My previous post is purely from short-term investment perspective. It does not take into consideration of the four year life experience difference, the four year which might change your son’s life down the road. Be very careful about those “suicide” schools. They get their reputation for a reason. Brown’s reputation is happy school and indeed my child is very happy. There are numerous treads on this site titled XXX Full Pay or YYY Full Ride as well as “Prestige” v.s. “State Flagship”. The key is different life experience. The most precious four year of one’s life. My understanding is that for STEM, there is no difference in outcome in terms of earning power. However, it is the life experience which DOES matter. Obviously you can afford it. Do you want your child to have Brown experience? You don’t know what your child is missing if he does not come. The outcome won’t be different for STEM. I have been wondering why people are applying to some schools if they are not willing to go when admitted. I think it costs at least $75 (excluding Princeton’s $65) to apply. I would use it to go to a dinner instead of donating to a college and contributing to the denominator of their admission rates . There are hundreds if not thousands of people who are dying to get a spot. They will be very happy if you give up your son’s spot.
I have never heard of Tulane being some sort of outlier with regard to a disproportionate suicide rate and I have had extended family members attend, and currently the son of a very good friend. I know they had a cluster in 2014-2015, but I do not believe Tulane has that reputation. @nrtlax33, is that what you are referring to?
First, congrats to your son. We were in a similar situation years ago. My daughter was accepted to many wonderful prestigious universities, and she also was accepted as a Stamps Scholar at the University of Miami. This was a tough decision, but she had not fallen in love with one school (unlike her older sister who fell in love with Dartmouth). It turned out to be an excellent decision, She thrived at Miami, and she was at the top of her class. The Stamps program offers incredible opportunities in addition to being a full ride plus scholarship. Mr. Stamps is incredibly generous with his time as well. He had all the Stamps scholars in Miami over to his house for dinner. There were frequent get togethers as well as a national meeting with Stamps scholars from every school. I could go on and on. If your son was absolutely in love with Brown and felt it was the only school for him, I’d choose Brown. Otherwise, i would 100% go to Tulane and not look back. If your son wants to talk to my daughter, feel free to pm me. As an aside, D1 went to Dartmouth and D2 went to U of Miami. They both work for Google now. You can be successful from any college.
If your child is seriously considering premed, and you don’t have the extra 230k burning a hole in your pocket, then the decision is clear and easy. Invest that money and help your child with medical school. They could become a physician with no debt which is amazing.
Even if your child doesn’t go to medical school you could do the same with some of that money and use it for other things to help him along in life. Graduate school a home Etc.
For a career in engineering or computer science the premium you are paying for brown is really not worth it from a starting pay salary perspective. If the goal is grad school, the premium is definitely not worth it because then you won’t have any money to help pay for grad school.
Does your child like Tulane? Was Brown the “dream School”, clear first choice during this process?
Edited to add: just read about the Stamps scholarship. What an amazing opportunity and so many perks! At Brown your child will be just another smart kid, the stamps program sounds like an amazing opportunity.
@jsnowut : I totally agree with @suzyQ7 that you need to consider the question of "Does your child like Tulane? Was Brown the dream school, clear first choice during this process? " As I stated before, for STEM (outside premed), there is no difference in outcome. I am not familiar with Tulane at all. Brown never has any cluster of suicide. If any school has any cluster of suicide, you need to find out why. Schools are trying very hard to hide the news. In fact, one of the kids from my child’s HS recently died at Columbia. (I have stated at my recent post.) No news. What happened? We don’t know him but he is extremely talented. (on stage) If you check news article from last year, you will find http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-4184840/Frightening-wave-suicides-Columbia-University.html If you would like to know why, you can read http://features.columbiaspectator.com/news/2016/04/14/are-columbia-students-the-most-stressed-in-the-ivy-league/
Thank you all for your continued replies and feedback. Also, I don’t want to lead anyone astray, it’s my daughter not my son that is the subject of my post.
@dumbo11 sharing your experience is very valuable and helpful. I think it is very similar to the choices that my family are looking at. Thank you for you offer to put my daughter in touch with yours. It is very generous. Do not be surprised if I take you up on that because I think it could be extremely valuable. It may not be for a week or more as I want to let the acceptance/rejection emotions settle down before we talk decisions.
Interesting about your 2 Ds because my wife and I were having a discussion last night about a friend’s daughter that works at Google and whether it was the school or the person that is responsible for the success and I do think it is what the student brings to the school that is most important.
@suzyQ7 D likes Tulane [who wouldn’t - t seems awesome]. She would love to go to Brown, but I don’t think it is her dream school.I agree with your points and I appreciate you sharing them wth me.
@nrtlax33 Thanks for your additional thoughts. Right wrong or indifferent, I think many kids apply to prestigious schools to see if they are ‘good enough’ to be accepted. It is a measure of how successful they have been in high school, and for these kids it is part of the reason that many work so hard for so long. I think it may be easier for a child at a state flagship U to be able to say “I was accepted to _________, but my parents couldn’t afford it so I am here.” It allows them to know for the rest of their lives that they too were ‘good enough’ to be at one of these amazing schools when they meet and work with those that were fortunate enough to attend them. TMI??
Thanks again all, I really appreciate your thoughts.
If you google “Any school name here suicide rate” you’re guaranteed to find stories. It does appear Tulane suffered a spike in deaths in 2015 - several suicides, a murder-suicide of a law school student, an accidental death and a health related death. If schools hiding suicides is common, how can you tell if Tulane’s numbers are any better or worse than other institutions? (Note - I have no side in Tulane vs. Brown - I just like to see the facts on the table).
Losing someone to suicide is incredibly painful, and I grieve for those affected. But this is not unique to Tulane. Mental health issues, suicide ideation, and suicide attempts are increasing on college campuses across the country. It’s impossible to know what might trigger a particular student at a particular school. Perhaps the pressure of needing to keep a high GPA to maintain a scholarship at one school would do it. But then again, the pressure of needing to perform because your family is going into debt to send you to a prestige school could do it for another student. Penn suffered a recent increase (in 2017) in suicides that has been widely reported. Rather than being hidden, student mental health issues are garnering more publicity, which is a good thing if it leads to increased recognition and treatment.
While Brown may be a mecca of happiness, I really don’t see suicide as a reason to avoid Tulane. What is essential is to have open communication with your student about mental health issues and encourage them to seek help if needed.
Tulane is a great school, free is even better, add on the extra perks with the Stamps scholarship. If you had the money to burn to pay Brown’s tuition and provide all the extras of the Stamps, then it would be a more difficult decision. Given the sacrifice it would take to pay for Brown, and how it may impact future plans of the student, I would be team Tulane all the way.
OP congratulations on the tremendous achievement. I would say that if I were in your shoes (I am a parent) I would have a really really hard time turning down the Stamps scholarship. Best of luck to you.
@nrtlax admittedly has no familiarity with Tulane. I find it absurd s/he is making assertions about suicide and student happiness with no direct knowledge of the college. And really? Brown is a “happy” school and Tulane a “suicide” school? Please disregard this terrible advice.
Graduating from a fabulous school like Tulane with no debt and with all the extra benefits of a Stamps Scholarship seems like a dream, whether your daughter winds up going to med school or not. Congratulations to her!
I am sure seasoned posters here are quite familiar with the schools on the list. Do you see anything in common between them? Number one suicide school is on the list. I do believe OP’s daughter will be fine. It is those “holistic” admits which get into trouble.