<p>Both Harvard and Brown have offered me a spot in next year’s freshman class, and I’m having a really hard time deciding between the two. I’ve been doing a lot of pro/con listing and all of that, but I was hoping I could get some input from cc members. What do you guys see as the pros and cons of each school? What generalizations exist about each one?</p>
<p>Prospective majors, general idea of what you’re looking for in a college, etc. please.</p>
<p>I’m looking to major in either political science or international relations and then I would like to attend law school. I want a healthy party scene but don’t want that to get in the way of goals. I’m worried about elitism, and want to enjoy my next four years (work hard, play hard).</p>
<p>Brown, Dartmouth and Yale are the ivies with the strongest undergrad programs. In the 90s, when US News ranked programs based exclusively on undergrad merit, Brown came up in number 2. Then, the methodology changed (Harvard probably complained)</p>
<p>Brown and Dartmouth really cater to their undergrads, unlike Harvard (where a lot of undergrad teaching is done by TAs and grad students). However, the quality and strengths of the academics and resources are essentially the same.</p>
<p>As far as atmosphere, just remember the lightbulb jokes. They can really give you the whole picture.</p>
<p>1- How many Harvard students does it take to change a lightbulb?
Just one. He grabs the bulb and waits for the world to revolve around him.</p>
<p>2- How many Brown students does it take to change a lightbulb?
Eleven—one to change the lightbulb and ten to share the experience :)</p>
<p>You know they truly answered the lightbulb question when they started Project 20/20 or whatever it is.</p>
<p>i was a brown undergrad and am graduating from harvard grad school this spring, where i advised harvard undergrads</p>
<p>there several are legitimate trade-offs between the two places</p>
<ol>
<li>academic freedom is undoubtedly greater at brown. this is a story about a brown student who transferred to harvard and then transferred back to brown after only one semester because she found harvard too restrictive (she went on to be a marshall and rhodes scholar)</li>
</ol>
<p>[Two</a> win Marshall Scholarships - Campus news](<a href=“http://media.www.browndailyherald.com/media/storage/paper472/news/2004/11/22/CampusNews/Two-Win.Marshall.Scholarships-813133.shtml]Two”>http://media.www.browndailyherald.com/media/storage/paper472/news/2004/11/22/CampusNews/Two-Win.Marshall.Scholarships-813133.shtml)</p>
<ol>
<li>certain resources are deeper at harvard – in internationals relations, this would include CGIS and the IOP at harvard. however, Brown’s Watson Institute is no slouch, with several former heads of state on the faculty that are legitimately devoted to engaging with undergrads.</li>
</ol>
<p>[Harvard</a> University Institute of Politics](<a href=“http://www.iop.harvard.edu%5DHarvard”>http://www.iop.harvard.edu)
[Center</a> for Government and International Studies, Harvard University](<a href=“http://cgis.fas.harvard.edu/]Center”>http://cgis.fas.harvard.edu/)</p>
<p>[The</a> Watson Institute for International Studies](<a href=“http://www.watsoninstitute.org%5DThe”>http://www.watsoninstitute.org)</p>
<ol>
<li><p>culturally, they are different. there is some elitism at both places but it is much more palpable at harvard. that being said, i’m not sure this should be a deciding factor. both places have very nice, humble people too.</p></li>
<li><p>generally speaking, access to star faculty and advising is better at brown. for most faculty there is no difference but for the real stars it can be hard for a harvard undergrad to get access unless they are very type A and persistent. also, the advising system at harvard is a little odd since they have people like me (grad students) do the bulk of it. for example, you would have a pre-law “tutor” based in your residential house responsible for writing your letter of recommendation, etc. i don’t think it is to your disadvantage, but i always found this strange</p></li>
<li><p>social life is more diverse at brown. at harvard social life and activities completely revolve around which house you live in. at brown, people tend to affiliate more by their interests than where they live.</p></li>
</ol>
<p>dcircle, u convinced me to take my name off the waitlist at Hahvahd.</p>
<p>Thanks a ton dcircle–I really appreciate you taking the time to give me your insight!</p>
<p>A sentiment I’ve heard from a number of people who attended Harvard is that if you know precisely what you want to do as an incoming freshman, the resources may well be singular and, succesful in getting you where you want to go.</p>
<p>However, if you are pretty uncertain about the direction you want to take and/or want a safe space to explore my sense is that Brown gives you more support. People at Brown criticize it for not having good advising and, it is true that the formal advising at Brown can be bad. It also true though that the informal advising is phonomenal. My department even had a study space for its UGs. </p>
<p>Do you trust yourself enough to try to mold something meaningful out of Brown’s clay? That’s campy but, do not kid yourself.</p>
<p><em>This is IMPORTANT</em> You will work hard - not only academically but in ways you may not as readily elsewhere i.e. on creating a values system and, philosophy for adulthood. I say this because of the open curriculum. Many graduate without really wrestling with the meat and marrow of this white elephant but, many others do. </p>
<p>Sure, there are flakes, poseurs and, the just plain weird everywhere, but, I’d say if you know you want to be working for Microsoft in 4 years - go to Harvard, the line from point a to b is shorter than it is at Brown. </p>
<p>But, Brown will let you test yourself in fairly unique ways - You will know more about yourself (for better and worse) exiting it than many other schools.</p>
<p>Take a long look in the mirror and think it over. </p>
<p>I don’t mean to say that one can’t search for themselves at Harvard, but, I’m at a better point in my life for having had the safe space to fall off a horse or two and, pick myself back up at Brown</p>
<p>This sounds very abstract and, I’m writing this as a recent alum, so I’d be happy to tease out what this means but, I fear I’ll be fairly unsuccesful in it. Perhaps Wolf and Modest can chime in here?</p>
<p>This thread, in the parents forum a couple years ago, might be very helpful for you: <a href=“http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/parents-forum/312613-harvard-brown.html[/url]”>http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/parents-forum/312613-harvard-brown.html</a></p>
<p>I don’t know any happy Harvard students…and I know a lot of Harvard students.</p>
<p>
</p>
<p>Solid thread, even though there is a pretty crazy knock at Brown right by the end before it died that was almost completely inaccurate. DCircle swooped in and cleared up most of it though.</p>
<p>Short answer:
For undergrad- Brown
For some graduate programs- Harvard</p>
<p>Bottom line is that the focus at Brown is their undergraduate program. Achieving a balance of an amazing, challenging education with student well being is difficult. Brown has this down to an art. Harvard is the opposite. I had 5 friends go there for undergrad, they agree.</p>
<p>I looked at Harvard for undergrad, very quickly realized this and pulled my application. Harvard is a phenomenal school for graduate work. Just not undergrad. I’m generalizing and I’m sure it’s different within each focus of study but I truly believe that college is where you should be exploring out, not focusing in. Brown is a better place to do that.</p>
<p>I ended up deciding between Brown and Princeton. I made the right decision for myself and went to Brown. No regrets except that I wish I could have spent more than 4 years in undergrad at Brown. ;)</p>
<p>I’d say come to Harvard.</p>
<p>I agree with dcircle. I have attended Harvard for summer school, and from my experience, social life does indeed revolve around the house you reside in.</p>
<p>The house system is different for every house, but for the house I resided in the building is split in to small “entryways” of 4-5 dorms each, with each dorm housing 3-4 people. In each section, we had one proctor or residential “leader” who basically took organized all our study breaks etc. We sometimes mingled with the neighbor entryways but that was about it.</p>
<p>Though, Harvard College may be different than Harvard Summer School, so take this w/ a grain of salt.</p>
<p>EDIT: realized this thread is 2 years old. Nvm, new people can read this. Where did the OP eventually go?</p>
<p>It appears that the OP decided to go to Harvard: <a href=“http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/harvard-university/728875-help-my-daughter-turned-harvard-down-now-has-second-thoughts-4.html#post8446366[/url]”>http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/harvard-university/728875-help-my-daughter-turned-harvard-down-now-has-second-thoughts-4.html#post8446366</a></p>