Carolyn-Here is my Wheaton, Skidmore, Union trip report

Parents Forum
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<p>I have just returned with my S from a marathon 3 schools in 2 1/2 days, 12 plus hours of driving college trip. We went to 3 schools: Wheaton (MA), Skidmore and Union. Here is the report:</p>

<li><p>Wheaton. I wanted S to love this school, as I have heard good things about it. The campus is fairly compact. Upper campus is lovely-treed, with some nice old buildings and an open area. The lower campus has a pond and several buildings that appeared to need a face lift. They had a nice art gallery and decent indoor athletic facilities for a school of its size (1500 students). All pianos in the music practice rooms are Steinways. However, S and I both thought that the dorm and academic buildings that we were shown on the lower campus (where we spent most of our time on the tour) needed some refurbishment. Our tour guide took us to the least attractive dorm and explained that she did so because she wanted S to realize that it could only get better if he got into a newer dorm. S’s comment was-then why not show me the less attractive AND nicer dorms?? The science building that we were shown will be replaced by a newer building due to be completed in 2008. It also seemed a little tired. S also did not like Norton, MA (where Wheaton is located) very much. We did not get a lot of information about S’s interest area (East Asian studies). The school seems to try to get students into Boston to take advantage of cultural and athletic events. There is a program where students get transportation to Boston, dinner and event tickets for $5-but only about 10% of the student body can go at any one time. Has a Division I program in synchronized swimming.</p></li>
<li><p>Skidmore-An excellent choice for kids interested in the arts-great art and theatre facilities and multiple a capella groups. It appeared that many kids had a non-arts major and an arts minor. They also have 2 pre-schools located on campus-loooked like great real-world experience for education majors. About 50% of students do a term abroad. I thought the campus was beautiful-bordered by a lovely wooded area. The school seems to have put a lot of money into updating the insides of the buildings. Students seemed happy and friendly. There appeared to be an active gay community on campus-posters for the upcoming gay prom were abundant. More multicultural than other LACs we have visited (which S would view as a plus). Dorms are all almost identical to one another, although they are building townhomes for upperclassmen. Lots of notices about club and other meetings. The town of Saratoga Springs had lots of restaurants and shops. S did not like the “same-ness” of the campus-he thought that all the buildings looked alike (they were all built around the same time). S does not have an arts orientation, so the many arts opportunities were lost on him-but Skidmore appears to be a great choice for students with interest in this area.</p></li>
<li><p>Union-full disclosure time-I am an alum who LOVES her alma mater. S did not want to do tour because he has been on campus several times during his growing up years and felt he knew his way around already. Since Skidmore was so close, and since he had never been inside Union’s dorms or academic buildings, I insisted that we had to stop. We arrived to howling winds and rain (not predicted)-probably the worst possible time to do a tour, but we pressed on. Union is embarking on a new social experiment where fraternities and sororities (formerly a major presence on campus) are being de-emphasized. All incoming students are being assigned to a house and will remain affiliates of that house for all 4 years. I am interested to see how this turns out-sounds like a great idea, but since it is relatively new I could not get any hard data on what the students thought of the new system. S thought Union’s dorms were the nicest of any we have seen so far. It was hard for him to have enthusiastic mom in tow. I SWORE I would not be one of those obnoxious alumni parents on tour-and I fear that I failed-I was beside myself when we toured the freshman dorm and I passed by my old dorm room (which I had to point out to S as he rolled his eyes)-I also got teary when the bells of our Old Chapel played the Union “Alma Mater” and “There’s No Place Like Home” (penned by John Howard Payne, a Union alum). Like Skidmore, Union also seems to be sinking $$ into physical plant. Our tour guide ( a pre-med senior) was quite honest about how hard she was working. Union has an active term abroad program-like Skidmore, they send about 50% of their students on a term abroad. Students seemed happy and friendly. The jury is still out for S-he asked about the airport and also about restaurants in the area, so I believe he is mulling it over. I set the stage by printing out a copy of the Union East Asian studies newsletter for him.</p></li>
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<p>On the way home, S indicated that after this trip, he had decided that he wanted to be no more than 4 hours away from home (or be able to get home via plane relatively quickly). I guess I have raised 2 homebodies-D is less than an hour from home-I think S has noticed that D can get home relatively easily. Therefore, my thoughts of possible Midwest options for him may go out the window. Having these types of ideas take shape (i.e. how far do I want to be away from home) is a primary reason why I am a big proponent of the in-person visit (as tiring as they are) -even if you don’t always find the school of your dreams, your like and dislikes come more into focus.</p>

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<p>Bxian, Thanks!!! A few questions about Skidmore in particular - how would you describe the kids? What were they wearing (a weird question but one that matters to my daughter). Did you get the feeling that there was enough to do on campus on the weekends? I particularly enjoyed your comments about Wheaton - very interesting to hear about the campus and the feeling of the dorms.</p>

<p>It sounded like your son may like Union more than Wheaton and Skidmore or am I reading into things (HA!!)? Actually, from what little I know of him, Union sounds like a good fit, although if he is like my daughter any school with a family connection (and heaven forbid a MOTHER connection) is a horror! I honestly don't know why Union doesn't get more play here on CC - it's a great school in my mind.</p>

<p>I do think your son is smart to recognize that getting home quickly is important to him. I think that my daughter would also prefer this but unfortunately there just aren't many schools that fit her within a four hour drive in Southern California unless she'll start considering some of the UC's or cal states. We are going up to the San Francisco area to look at two Catholic colleges next week - we'll see how it goes. </p>

<p>Thanks for the trip report.</p>

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<p>Carolyn-I don't think your question re: dress is odd at all-both of my kids key into that, too. We were there on a cool day-most kids I saw wore jeans and sweatshirts. Probably more toward the preppy than anything else, but it did not look like the kids were trying to make fashion statements-and they did not seem to be "crunchy granola." I know that your daughter rides horses-they claim to have one of the top 3 equestrian centers in the US.</p>

<p>As for weekends-it was hard to tell-there were a lot of posters about activities up (which I think is a good sign). The student newspaper was about twice the size of Wheaton's (although that may be due to the fact that Skidmore is larger). The town of Saratoga Springs is lovely-lots of places to eat and browse. Howver, it is not huge. The music venue that I used to go to and listen to folky type artists (like Livingston Taylor) while down the road at Union is still there. The downside is that you are 4 hours from NY and 3 to 3 1/2 from Boston. The nearest airport to Skidmore is Albany-about a half hour away.</p>

<p>I laughed when I saw your comment about your kids not wanting to go anywhere near where "Mother" went-the same holds true here! S is still getting over his being mortified about me tugging on his coat and showing him my old room at Union-I think he liked what he saw more than he will admit to me at the moment. I am going to let sleeping dogs lie for a while-if he decides he is interested down the line, he can apply-we still have almost a year. I spent some of the happiest years of my life at Union-but as I told D and now S, it is their choice, not mine.</p>

<p>As to the close to home thing-I guess I should be flattered :) Both D and I and now S and I have found late soph/early junior year to be the "low point" of our relationship-we have always been very close, and I have found that as they hit mid high school they tend to battle with me and pull away temporarily. It lasted about a year with D-and now we are very close once again. I am pleased that S is already thinking that he may want to come home for a weekend once in a while-guess H and I can't be that bad :)</p>

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<p>Bxian:</p>

<p>If your child likes East Asian studies, I might be able to give some pointers. Where about are you located, as your child does not want to go to college too far away?</p>

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<p>Marite-thanks for the offer-we are in NJ-not sure where S is rank-wise yet, GPA is aroud a 3.0 UW and a 3.6=3.7 weighted. Has not taken the SAT's yet-based on soph year PSAT's I expect he will score 1300 or better. He has taken a number of honors courses (but not all). Will have 4-5 years of history, 4 years of English, 5 years of math, 4 years of French, 4 years of science and 2 years of computer programming (including honors C++ and Java) by graduation. Decent but not spectacular EC's. Track/cross-country freshman year, aiming for the tennis team this year. I did a search on a competing website using "East Asian Studies," "Asian Studies" and "Japanese language and culture." It is not fool-proof-Union (my alma mater) and Franklin and Marshall both have programs fiting in these categories, but did not show up in my search. EAS is a passion for him-he spent some time in Japan this summer and is now teaching himself Japanese-spends HOURS with workbooks learning the various written forms of Japanese. He corresponds regularly with several people he met in Japan via e-mail using translation software (combined with Japanese that he has taught himself).</p>

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<p>Immediately when I see Japan, I think Earlham. It is almost a reflex. He might even get some merit aid there.</p>

<p>But not 4 hours.</p>

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<p>Mini-How far is Earlham from a major airport?</p>

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<p>45 minutes (39 miles) from Dayton - college runs a shuttle. If you've got Earlham questions, I'm probably your guy.</p>

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<p>As a long time lurker whose daughter just started at Union this fall, I am so glad I finally have something to add to this forum! Bxian, my daughter absolutely loves Union, too. It was the first school we looked at and she immediately wanted to attend. After many long road trips to look at other similar size schools, (Dickinson, Gettysburg, Lafayette, Wheaton, Skidmore) Union was the place she applied ED and fortunately, she was accepted.</p>

<p>Union has instituted something called the Minerva house system which is supposed to supplement/replace the active frat social scene of the past. Each student is assigned to one of the seven or so houses and it becomes an alternate social space. Each house has a budget of about 30K per year to host events, speakers, parties, etc. I have asked her about her house and so far I don't think she's done much in connection with it. But any new social experiment probably takes time to catch on, so I think the jury is still out on this, but the concept is a good one and I hope it succeeds. The houses are beautifully refurbished with modern kitchens, big screen TV,s lounges, meeting rooms, etc. and faculty members are also assigned to houses so they can hang there, too. </p>

<p>My D loves her classes, they are small and the professors are really accessible to and interactive with the students. I happen to think the campus is beautiful...the Nott Memorial is a sixteen (?) sided building that is on the National Register of Historic Buildings and is a very distinctive symbol of Union. D is in a suite that has an enormous common room and decent sized bedrooms. She says the food is very good, but honestly, she is not a very fussy eater. She is a vegetarian and says there are lots of choices for her to eat.</p>

<p>Now for some of the negatives. My D says there is a lot of drinking on campus, but I'm not so sure that isn't the case for many, many colleges and universities today. Also, she was somewhat sheltered from that in HS and she seems to have calmed down about it now, so maybe my little "hothouse flower" was overly shocked in the beginning. Also, I think the reason Union is a little under the radar screen on these forums is that it is in Schenectady....not much to recommend there. The campus has a very noticeable security presence but I would not wander too far off campus alone. However, I live in CT and you could say the same thing about Yale and parts of New Haven (although New Haven has a lot more going for it than Schenectady). </p>

<p>My neighbor also has a sophomore D at Skidmore. She loves it there as well, but it I think it is a very different school from Union. The one thing she said is that Saratoga Springs is a nice college town, but in reality, much of the Saratoga action takes place in the summer when college is out. </p>

<p>If you have any questions about the Union admissions process, I'd be glad to answer if I can. The one thing I definitely recommend is to go for the interview; Union is one of those schools that places a great deal of emphasis on the personal interview.</p>

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<p>Momjd-I am really happy to hear that your daughter loves Union (I am also a mom and a jd by the way) -I hope her 4 years there will be as happy as mine were. I was impresssed by what they were doing with space for the house system-when we walked into South College, S and I noticed the oriental rugs-unusual for a college dorm! I understand that Union has taken over all of the existing fraternity houses-most of which are very attractive older home-like buildings. In fact, I was confused when I walked into Admissions, because it used to be a fraternity house in my day.</p>

<p>My only reservation about the house system is a question of what will be done in the case of conflicts. I understand that students are assigned to the same house for all 4 years. While at Union, I was a Resident Advisor for 2 years. Although the 2 floors I had were very cohesive for the most part, I did wind up having to mediate a couple of conflicts that resulted in room changes. It was not clear to me whether a student will actually live with the people in their house (which would seem unlikely in view of the fact that most freshmen live together in West College), or whether the houses are used more as a social gathering place.</p>

<p>Schenectady is not a great college town-but I found that there was always enough happening on campus to keep me busy (and I worked very hard, too!) Once we reached upperclassman status and knew people with access to cars, it was a lot easier to get out and hit a nearby movie theatre or go listen to music up in Saratoga.</p>

<p>As for drinking-it was there 30 years ago-but-as you suggested-it is probably present on most campuses today-my D is a freshman at St. Joe's in Philadelphia and there is certainly access to alocohol there when the kids go to off campus parties.</p>

<p>Is your D living in Fox (my home sophomore year) or Davidson, or is she housed over in the new dorm that is a makeover of the Ramada Inn? What is her major?</p>

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<p>bxian, my daughter lives in Davidson. The new Ramada Inn is only for upperclassmen at this point, but I heard it is a very desirable spot because of the private baths in every room. </p>

<p>As for living in the Minerva Houses, only a few (guessing 50 per House, but it depends on the individual House capacity) students will actually live in their House, by their own choice. The House is really for socializing with other students and with the faculty, all of whom has been assigned to a House.</p>

<p>One thing your S might consider is the fact that Union is on trimesters. For my D that was mostly a plus except for the fact that as a rule her vacations don't coincide with her friends. (translation: boyfriend at another school). It is a very different schedule from most schools and for the 10 weeks the kids do work hard, as you pointed out. Not a lot of wiggle room during the trimester. The faculty just voted last spring to retain trimesters, so it will likely be around for a while.</p>

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<p>Since I was a Japanese/Asian Studies major in college, I have to toss in my little caveat about going to a small LAC for this major. With very few exceptions, Earlham being one, LACs do not offer enough depth in Japanese studies. At a minimum, look for 4 years of language courses taught by native speakers, and classes in other disciplines. Look at the number and qualifications of faculty. I went to a small university where I had to scrape together a major. There was one Japanese instructor - and he was just OK. For grad school, I went to a major University with a highly respected Japanese studies department. Some of the famous translators (at the time there were only two superstar translators - one at Michigan and one at Columbia) and historians taught at this University. Language classes were more challenging and taught by excellent native speakers. There was a Japanese studies center and they actually showed a Japanese movie and conducted a special lecture with a visiting scholar EVERY WEEK! I know there's a terrific fear that the large university classes will be huge and impersonal. In these oddball majors, that's not the case. Sure, at my small university, there were only 3 people in my 4th-year Japanese class. But at the big University, there were probably no more than 12.</p>

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<p>Where did you get your degrees, Topcat?</p>

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<p>For grad school, I went to Michigan - I wasn't in the Japanese Studies program, but took classes and hung around the Japanese Studies Center a lot. For undergrad, went to Univ of Rochester. Took everything they offered that was remotely related to Asia and took a junior year abroad in Tokyo. When I was in college, Japanese was a pretty exotic major and not that many schools offered any program at all. By now, many schools have beefed up their programs. Wanted to add -- that when I was a student, the Great Lakes College Association (Albion, Antioch, Denison, DePauw, Earlham, Hope, Kalamazoo, Kenyon, Oberlin, Ohio Wesleyan, Wabash, and Wooster) had a very active program in Japan - well ahead of most LACs. I'm not familiar with every one of these schools, but some of them may have more extensive offerings. Also, several of the Big 10 schools seem to have decent programs. I don't know much about Indiana, but it certainly seems to offer a lot in Asian studies - and it's not that tough to get in.</p>

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<p>Big school Asian Studies has much to offer.</p>

<p><a href="http://polyglot.lss.wisc.edu/east/Publications/Newsletter2004Smmr.pdf%5B/url%5D"&gt;http://polyglot.lss.wisc.edu/east/Publications/Newsletter2004Smmr.pdf&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p>

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<p>Does anyone know an easy way to identify which schols have East Asian Studies or Jaoanese language and culture programs?</p>

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<p>East Asian Studies Programs. You are right: Ohio Wesleyan University has a very strong East Asian Studies Program for an LAC.</p>