Chance me! Rising Junior, interested in majoring in poli sci or econ! [4.0 GPA, 1480 PSAT]

Chance Me / Match Me!
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Keeping this very broad for confidentiality! My dream school is Princeton, and I feel like I don’t have much of a chance with my stats since every profile I read feels more unique! I also feel like my interests are kind of all over the place and that I don’t have much of a theme. I’m hopeful, but feel free to be brutally honest! My school is located in a rural area with low funding, so finding activities and internships can be tough compared to others in more populated, funded areas.

Demographics

  • US permanent resident
  • School: Rural, public, uncompetitive, small
  • Gender/Race/Ethnicity: Caucasian Female

**Intended Major(s): Currently between political science or economics, maybe public policy or history

GPA, Rank, and Test Scores

My school calculates weighted GPA very strangely, but I have a 4.0 unweighted

  • Class Rank: Within the top 3 percent of about 80 students
  • Haven’t taken SAT yet but my PSAT was a 1480

Coursework
School offers 15 APS, I am on track to take 13 of them. Very rigorous schedule.

So far I have received 5s on AP Seminar, AP Biology, and AP European History which are the only APs offered to my grade level.

Apart from APs, the rest of my classes are honors.

Awards
Gold medal from Scholastic Arts and Writing
International DECA Award
(Hoping to be a national merit finalist)
(Also working towards earning a gold congressional medal)

Extracurriculars

Class President

Founder and editor in chief of school paper

Was selected to serve on a nonprofit grant board in district. (Nonprofit provides grants of up to 10,000 dollars to charities)

Currently interning virtually on a minor political campaign

Captain of Field hockey team

Chapter DECA president

Vice President of Drama (wrote and directed play)

National Honor Society

Ambassador of Key Club

Welcome coach to freshmen

Employee at local farm

Additional Information: I’m worried that I am too much of a well-rounded student rather than a student that has a “spike”. I am only a rising junior, so I still have time! There are a few things that I am considering participating in, in order to deepen my understanding of my interests and create a more common theme within my application. I’ve looked at a few programs online and I was considering running for DECA state office where I’d be able to use my skills working at a nonprofit to aid in creating more community and volunteer programs. Also, my financial knowledge would help me to advocate for more scholarships to DECA events. It’s kind of a long shot because I come from a small school, but I’m a decent speaker so I thought why not? Additionally, if I didn’t run for office perhaps I could apply to be a senate page? Not sure if I have enough political experience though. Suggestions are welcome!!!

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I think you shouldn’t worry.

You are spectacular and you have a lot going for you. But nobody can say - you’re a likely for Princeton. You just can’t - and while it’s great to have aspirations, you should just know you’re going to get an awesome opportunity somewhere.

What is about Princeton you like because perhaps there’s other similar schools in back up?

You certainly have accomplished all you can and that’s all you can do.

Until you’re accepted or not, you can’t worry - and if you’re not accepted and that’s likely, you can’t worry about why. You’ll never know - and frankly, you’re fantastic, so it’d be their loss.

What do you want in a school?

What is your cost situation - i.e. budget and if it’s not full pay, are you a a full pay family - meaning your parents may say $30K but schools would say you’d get no aid based on their finances.

Some can afford but don’t want to afford.

Also, what state are you from?

Let us know.

Thanks

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For the purpose of applying to universities, and for most other purposes, being a permanent resident is the same as being a US citizen.

Your GPA is great, so far.

1480 is very good for the PSAT.

You already have very strong ECs.

At this point I have perhaps three recommendations.

First of all, be you. Do not try to be whatever you think Princeton or any other school is looking for. Be yourself. As part of this, you might want to read the “applying sideways” blog on the MIT admissions web site. As I understand it the blog recommends that you do what is right for you and do it very well. This approach has worked very well for my family. However, what I did, what my wife did, and what our daughters did or are doing, are entirely different things.

Secondly, be a bit careful about trying to do too much. Understand what pace is right for you, and stick with it.

When it is time to apply to universities, keep and open mind, keep your budget in mind, and make sure that you apply to at least two solid safeties.

And yes, I agree with @tsbna44, you are doing very well.

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Thanks so much for the reply, your answer was reassuring!! Also to answer your question, I really fell in love with Princeton’s humanities department and undergraduate focus. The location, size, and financial aid was definitely a plus too! I have several other schools on my list, but I’d say Princeton is at the top. (To answer your other question, I’m from Vermont.) (Also, I come from a middle-upper class family, but financial aid is definitely important for me. My parents have done so much for me, so being able to not put a strain on them and pay mostly for myself is important to me.)

Thank you for your kind response, you’re definitely right in saying that nothing is for certain and I’ve done what I can. I’ll try to keep my mind open to other schools too, but hopefully I’ll have some luck with admissions!

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Thank you for your response, your recommendations were very helpful. I think you are right in saying that I need to reevaluate how much I can apply myself to time-wise. I’ll try to be more authentic, thanks again!

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The field of public policy relies on the disciplines of political science and economics for much of its foundation. If you were to choose public policy as your major, then much of your coursework would emphasize these supporting fields. For suggestions of colleges with notable public policy programs, this site may be of interest:

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Have you run the net price calculator? Is Princeton affordable?

I agree with not putting out your familiy and you can know up front if this will happen as there is no merit aid at Princeton.

Many schools have strong humanities departments but you said you want to be in social sciences.

And many have an undergraduate focus.

Step one is affordability since there are no merit scholarships. Have your parents run the net price calculator to see if Princeton is a financial possibility for you.

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Thanks for the clarification and website! I will definitely make sure to check that out! Also, I somehow forgot to add this to my main post but I am hoping to attend college on the pre-law track. However, debt from law school is a scary factor.

  • Do you think it would be wise to attempt to shadow or intern with a local lawyer to gain more understanding of the field?
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I have run the financial aid calculator, and I do believe that Princeton would be financially affordable if I was to be accepted. Also I meant to type social sciences, no idea how I mixed that up hahah. I’m specifically interested in Princeton as I appreciated a few of the professors work in political polarization which is one of my major interests. I was also a fan of a few of the more specialized classes within the social science field that I didn’t see listed at many other schools. I’ll be on the search for more with similar undergraduate focuses and characteristics, however!

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If you would like to pursue this concept further, then you may want to consider purely undergraduate-focused colleges. Hamilton, for example, would be excellent for your range of interests.

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That’s funny you mention Hamilton, I actually have a cousin who attends there! Hamilton is another school on my list, I was a fan of them as well.

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I also liked Boston College for its 3+3 prelaw and law school program, but I’ve heard they don’t give much aid. The price is a little out of budget, so I’d need a scholarship.

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Did you run the NPC ?

They are not the only school with a 3+3.

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Not yet, I only remember that bit of info from a local college fair. I’ll have to look for more colleges offering a 3+3!

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Also, I did run the NPC for BC. It wasn’t fantastic, but I’d honestly apply anyways. Who knows? Maybe I’ll get lucky.

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If you don’t use all your slots.

But if you have a budget please let us know so we can recommend schools
For example I was thinking W&M as a back up to Princeton.

But can you afford a potential $68k?

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I’d have to discuss more with my parents on budget, but 68k is a little on the high side without aid. With aid, the lowest I would want to go is around 40k. I haven’t looked at W&M yet, but I will make sure to research it! I also should’ve mentioned, that I do want to stay on the east side of the country.

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A grab bag of thoughts:

(1) The information that came out of the Harvard admissions lawsuit really undermined the premises of spike theory. Long story short, lots of people get admitted to Harvard with only normally very good academics and normally very good activities. The deciding factor was usually also getting a very good “personal” rating, not a “spike” as it is typically defined. Indeed, it was very hard to impress Harvard enough with academics or activities to get them to overlook a merely “generally positive” and not “very good” personal rating.

But this information has not seemed to do all that much to dismantle the industry that had sprung up around spike theory. Perhaps in part because helping kids understand how to become very good people is a lot harder than just telling them how to sign up for competitions or get published or whatever spike theory currently favors.

(2) I don’t think it is a good idea to become too fixated on one school, but for any holistic review college you might be interested in, it is generally worth checking out their version of a “what we look for” page. Here is Princeton’s:

https://admission.princeton.edu/apply/before-you-apply/helpful-tip

I suggest paying close attention to the Our Advice section in particular:

Our Advice

Instead of worrying about meeting a specific set of criteria, try to create an application that will help us see your achievements — inside the classroom and out — in their true context, so we can understand your potential to take advantage of the resources at Princeton and the kind of contribution you would make to the Princeton community. Show us what kind of student you are. Show us that you have taken advantage of what your high school has to offer and how you have achieved and contributed in your own particular context.

We look for students who make a difference in their schools and communities, so tell us about your leadership activities, interests, special skills and other extracurricular involvements. Tell us if you’ve had a job or a responsibility in your home. Most Princeton students were academic standouts in high school. Most of them also invested their energy and talents in significant ways outside the classroom. We want to know what you care about, what commitments you have made and what you’ve done to act on those commitments.

Note this doesn’t really support spike theory. Instead, Princeton is actually telling you that like with Harvard, being an academic standout and having strong ECs is only part of what they are looking for. They also want “students who make a difference in their schools and communities,” and they want “to know what you care about, what commitments you have made and what you’ve done to act on those commitments.”

Rather than rely on generic advice like spike theory, I’d take all this very seriously, and think about how you can be the sort of person Princeton is describing, in your own honest way. I’d also emphasize again there is something strikingly normal about this, meaning Princeton, like Harvard, is really putting a lot of weight on the concept of contributing to your school and local community. But that of course makes sense–these are schools, and they want to craft a college community where students will add a lot of value to each others’ experiences. And spike theory tends to emphasize individual striving and glory, and doesn’t typically address being a particularly well-valued member of your school community.

(3) There are many viable paths to law school, including many possible majors at many possible schools. But if you want to be competitive for the top law schools, you typically need to get really good grades. I would therefore strongly advise you, no matter where you go, to be very open minded about what you end up studying.

Because it is impossible to know for sure at your point in life what will actually interest you most in college, what you will actually be best at in college, and so on. Being open minded therefore gives you the best chance of following a path that will actually work for you, versus what you just imagine years in advance, without much real information, will work for you.

And in fact, I would say one of the better reasons to be interested in a legal career–versus, say, an academic career–is that a lot of legal careers allow you to be constantly learning new things. And for some of us that worked out very well.

But a lot of people also end up feeling trapped in a law job they don’t like, or actually hate.

Legal careers can therefore for be good for the sorts of people who are in fact open minded about where their curiosity and talents lead them. Maybe not so good for people who are too fixed on the plans they formed long ago, without yet really having the information and self-knowledge necessary to form such plans.

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Thank you for your response, it was very helpful! I had no idea about the research against the spike theory, it was very reassuring to hear that well rounded students have a chance. Also, you are 100 percent right in writing that I need to work on things I’m passionate for, not things that a college wants to see. Thank you again!

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