Chances for a veteran to get into Columbia

<p>I will be ready to attend college during the fall 2010 term. By that time i will have served a 5 year enlistment in the Marine Corps as a helicopter mechanic. My service includes a 7 month tour to Iraq and 3 years at HMX-1 (The presidents helicopter squadron). As of now i have 30 credits with a 4.0 through northern virginia community college which i earned while on active duty on my time off. On top of a few recommendations i know i can get from my professors, my commanding officer (the president's primary pilot) is willing to give me a recommendation as well. On the downside my high school record is average, and my SAT score which i took once in 11th grade and didn't study for was a 1240. Does anyone out there think I have any kind of chance??? Thanks</p>

<p>Apply to the School of General Studies at Columbia--your chances of being accepted would be high.</p>

<p>I just quickly reviewed the school of general studies....it seems it's for non=traditional part time students. I will be able to attend full time with no problem. I'm not really looking to go to a school like that primarily because i just want to be normal again haha. But thank you.</p>

<p>You can attend full-time. They would deem you a nontraditional student because you enlisted in the military, and you had a break in your education. As a GS student you would take the very same classes that CC students take, and you would have to meet the very same degree requirements as well. If you don't equate this with normalcy, then shoot for CC! Good luck!</p>

<p>Sooo attending Columbia GS is the same as attending Columbia. It's going to be easier for me to get in because they welcome students with life experience and i will get the same degree there as i would at columbia. - thats what i got out of looking into it more am i right or wrong?</p>

<p>only problem is they dont have an engineering or business program at GS from what ive seen which are my first 2 choices</p>

<p>Yes, you're right. The only difference is that the diploma received by GS students reads: "School of General Studies," unlike the diploma received by CC students which is written in Latin. </p>

<p>I believe that the engineering major is only offered in SEAS, and not in CC or GS (as you already know).</p>

<p>You could major in economics rather than business at GS.</p>

<p>^
kplanders, fellow vet here.</p>

<p>It sounds like you're the type of person that makes a strong candidate for the GS program. If I were you, I'd apply. Keep in mind, though, that the School of General Studies has a very poor reputation in providing enough financial aid. I know you probably have veteran's benefits, but they may not be enough to finance your education and you should seriously consider whether going into substantial debt is wise especially if there are better options for you out there. </p>

<p>Other top colleges you might consider applying to are Brown's RUE program, UPenn's College of Liberal Arts and Professional Studies, UC Berkeley, and Amherst College. All of these schools, on some level, reach out to veterans and offer some unique opportunities. I hope I gave you some ideas that will help you broaden your search. Good luck, man. I wish you the best.</p>

<p><em>Edit</em> Oh one more thing concerning your SAT scores and secondary school record. I've spoken to numerous admissions reps from the aforementioned schools and their stance on the issue is pretty unanimous: nobody cares what you did in high school or what your SATs were in highschool. You've been in the Marines for 5 years. Chances are, you are not the same person you once were. All they want to know is what you've done LATELY. If I were you, if you're really serious about transferring to a great school, I'd take classes at a community college or state university, maintain that 4.0 GPA, take as many honors courses as you can, and transfer after you have about 60 credits. I'm talking two years of of full time coursework that will allow you to demonstrate that you're ready for the real deal. In light of that, these colleges won't care what you did eight years ago and, in my honest opinion, it's the best way to go. </p>

<p>Also, out of the colleges mentioned, Columbia GS is the only one that requires a standardized test score for people in our positions (uber lame).</p>

<p>Thanks a lot for your opinions and insight it definitely helped.</p>

<p>If you are not worried about financial aid, then go to Columbia. However, if you are worried about aid, then do the due diligence and apply to other prestigious universities because you will receive significantly more financial aid than the paltry 3250 for one semester from Columbia GS. Good luck and thanks for serving.</p>

<p>Another school to consider is Dartmouth--they have had articles about the veterans they have admitted, and seem to really support them. (Try going to the Dartmouth site here on CC, and search "veteran", also the Dartmouth newspaper may have the articles.)</p>

<p>I would guess they offer better financial aid than the Columbia GS. Best of luck in your admissions process.</p>

<p>Dartmouth is very veteran friendly. I would also look at Columbia GS. Columbia has no undergrad business at any school, but econ in GS with heavy math courses will be a strong degree.</p>

<p>^
I disagree with the comments about Dartmouth. Dartmouth's president has reached out to injured veterans and admitted a few charity cases as Freshman from what I understand. Trying to transfer, as a veteran, to Dartmouth is a nearly impossible task, especially since they require SAT I and two SAT II scores. Taking these tests when you're between 25-30 years old is a pretty humiliating experience.</p>

<p>I define schools who are "veteran friendly" as those that are willing to make necessary exceptions by considering the unique situation of veterans.</p>

<p>I didn't know Dartmouth made it so difficult--I guess the articles featured those rare cases. </p>

<p>As for the SATs being a "humiliating experience", I agree that would be the case with any adult who has been out of classes for many years. On the other hand, since the college has math and English requirements for graduation, I can see that they would want their transfers to be capable of passing the courses. Can community college courses provide preparation for the SAT I ? Or self-study DVD test prep?</p>

<p>Again, best of luck in your transfer process.</p>

<p>Dartmouth is starting a veterans club. Granted, the club consists of maybe ten veterans in the undergraduate college, I would venture to say that those are not charity cases, but I may be wrong.</p>

<p>Columbia GS's affinity for veterans exists because Columbia is smart. Have you heard of vocational rehabilitation? Ask any GS military veteran and a majority of them are in the voc rehab program. The program pays full tuition, books, housing and a monthly stipend to participants so it is easy to see that a veteran in voc rehab is a cash cow for Columbia GS. </p>

<p>As for the thread creator, are you stuck on attending Columbia? If you are, then apply to CC or SEAS as a transfer student. Second, if you are concerned about financial aid, then look at other options. Did/Do you enjoy your time near the DC area? Apply to Georgetown's TRADITIONAL programs and I guarantee you that you will receive more financial aid than GS will ever give you. There are plenty of great examples of veterans breaking down the traditional walls in prestigious universities without the use of non traditional programs. There are veterans attending Cornell, Stanford, and other prestigious universities without accumulating significant amounts of debt for the chance to witness discrimination at its finest. When you are in a lecture with CC and SEAS students knowing they practically get full rides while you take out loans to finance your education merely because you were admitted into a different program, the thought stings badly.</p>

<p>In conclusion, there are prestigious universities that will admit you and pay for you to attend, you just have to do the necessary research. There are many detractors on this website, "Forget about UPENN or Cornell based on your stats", but don't listen them. When someone tells you a door is closed, find an opening; when something seems impossible, shock everyone and do the impossible. Never settle...</p>

<p>"Dartmouth is starting a veterans club. Granted, the club consists of maybe ten veterans in the undergraduate college, I would venture to say that those are not charity cases, but I may be wrong."</p>

<p>I'm guessing most, if not all, were selected personally by the president of the university and did not follow normal admissions procedures. Most, if not all, were wounded veterans who probably spent some time at Walter Reed. I could be dead wrong, but if Dartmouth Admissions has some program reaching out to vets, they didn't mention it either times I called them for information. Instead, they gave me the same song and dance 90% of Tier 1 colleges and universities give: "The information for admissions is on the website, sorry we have no programs specific to your concerns", ect. I live in New Hampshire, Dartmouth would have been a very convenient choice for me, so believe me, I looked into them.</p>

<p>"There are plenty of great examples of veterans breaking down the traditional walls in prestigious universities without the use of non traditional programs."</p>

<p>Can you provide any of these examples? I guess we first have to define what a "non traditional program" is exactly. I believe a veteran's application should be viewed in a much different context than your average high schoolers application. Specifically, the fact that someone volunteered three or four years of service to the country's defense, especially in a time of war, should be heavily weighted and considered, far more than any list of extra curricular activities someone from high school could possibly offer. Furthermore, if the veteran has demonstrated academic excellence at a state university or CC, I really don't think standardized tests are necessary. This is a "non traditional way to screen applicants and I feel that prestigious universities who tout their "diversity" have an obligation to bend the standards in order to admit veterans. This is what I mean by a "non traditional program". </p>

<p>The simple truth is, there are some doors that will be closed to veterans at this current time because many universities simply don't think veteran's admission is important. Compare the way these institutions treated the veteran population after World War II and the way they treat veterans today, and you'll realize the differences are stark. There's an ethical issue here, and it needs to be addressed.</p>

<p>I took the ACT last weekend, at age 24, and didn't find it humiliating in the slightest. I fail to see why you see it that way.</p>

<p>Also, GS was originally established to educate vets, so seeking vets is consistent with the history of the school.</p>

<p>
[quote]
The simple truth is, there are some doors that will be closed to veterans at this current time because many universities simply don't think veteran's admission is important. Compare the way these institutions treated the veteran population after World War II and the way they treat veterans today, and you'll realize the differences are stark. There's an ethical issue here, and it needs to be addressed.

[/quote]

what's interesting is, after WW2, Columbia (all of its undergrad schools, really) was among the leaders in taking students on the GI Bill and promoting egaliatarian admissions at a time when there were still strong race and class biases in the admissions offices of other top schools.</p>

<p>"Also, GS was originally established to educate vets, so seeking vets is consistent with the history of the school."</p>

<p>It was established to help vets after world war II, back when the GI Bill actually paid for college. Now, it's a place where vets can receive 3200 dollar scholarships and at least 10 years of debt. I've done the research. You can combine the benefits of the Post 9/11 GI Bill and the average institutional aid provided by Columbia GS and not even come close to a reasonable figure. </p>

<p>"I took the ACT last weekend, at age 24, and didn't find it humiliating in the slightest. I fail to see why you see it that way."</p>

<p>When I took the SATs I had to stand in line with eighth graders who were taking the test in a different classroom. When I got into my classroom I was questioned by three high school faculty members who were suspicious about my age while a class full of 16 year olds snickered under their breath. Humiliating enough?</p>

<p>"what's interesting is, after WW2, Columbia (all of its undergrad schools, really) was among the leaders in taking students on the GI Bill and promoting egaliatarian admissions at a time when there were still strong race and class biases in the admissions offices of other top schools"</p>

<p>And, at the time, it was a great opportunity for veterans. Presently, it's a rip off. Why doesn't Columbia allow veterans to join CC, which would provide ample financial aid for their needs? Why should veterans, of all people, face a financial burden which far surpasses other undergrads at Columbia University. Other colleges such as Amherst College, Brown University, UC Berkeley, and others welcome veterans and treat them like any other student, with the perks of decent financial aid (oh and they even let them graduate with the same diploma as the other students. Shocking, I know). Columbia University might have been ahead of the pack at one time, but right now their program is sorely lacking.</p>