Charting outcomes is possibly my favorite document. So much info to gleam. This year’s edition features yours truly as one of the data points!
http://www.nrmp.org/wp-content/uploads/2018/06/Charting-Outcomes-in-the-Match-2018-Seniors.pdf
http://www.nrmp.org/wp-content/uploads/2018/06/Charting-Outcomes-in-the-Match-2018-Osteo.pdf
http://www.nrmp.org/wp-content/uploads/2018/06/Charting-Outcomes-in-the-Match-2018-IMGs.pdf
NRMP is rolling out an interactive version! https://www.prnewswire.com/news-releases/nrmp-publishes-new-interactive-data-tools-for-main-residency-match-applicants-300680209.html
iwbb - is there a link to the tool? I am bumping up against the documents but can’t find the interactive tool.
http://www.nrmp.org/interactive-charting-outcomes-in-the-match/
EDIT: oh, that’s still not it. I think maybe it can only be done with an NRMP account.
I think I’m getting the follow on to work.
The outcomes for Caribbean students is awful!..even if they’re us citizens!
I ran it for someone who posted using their stats and no matches for desired specialty
m2ck - what link is working for you? Did you logon?
Try this one: https://public.tableau.com/profile/national.resident.matching.program#!/vizhome/ChartingOutcomes_0/ChartingOutcomes
No log in required. Make sure you have cookies turned on in your browser. Worked for me, but it’s…finicky.
thanks wowmom. That helps!
Do the rotation grades have no impact?
Rotation grades have a big impact, but it’s not one directly captured by the data in Charting the Outcomes.
Rotation grades affect all of the following: class rank, specialty LOEs, MSPE (aka Dean’s Letter), and AOA eligibility. All of those will critically impact one’s ability to match into certain specialties or at particular programs.
AOA eligibility is getting tricky as schools (especially top ones) are starting to drop it. I don’t recall NRMP asking if my school offers AOA, only if I was selected or not so unless kids from those schools are skipping the question, they are getting counted as “no AOA” no matter what. The residencies know via the MSPE if AOA is offered.
I saw what WOW mom posted, I guess I assumed you’d be able to have something other than Step 1 as the X axis. It does kind of make sense to force it into all analysis though.
My school is one of ~70 that collected a lot of data from outgoing MS4s including what schools we got interviews at and where we actually ended up on our rank list in a an attempt to create an actual database for MS4s that would have similar data to the MSAR (e.g. the average step 1 scores of specific programs). For the really big specialties like internal medicine this will be huge because what it takes to match to MGH is very different from what it takes to match to a community hospital in rural South Dakota, and charting outcomes has no way of providing that info.
I was told it takes 265 on step 1 to get to MGH Internal medicine, same as getting into a speciality. The charting outcomes kind of throws me off in terms of how they are treating school grades outside of AOA. Does it mean without AOA it really wont matter where else you might fall?
I’d say it depends on what odds you’re looking for and of course what else there is. I almost did IM (gasp a hint about my specialty!) and was told I “certainly could, but shouldn’t expect to” match to MGH and did not break 250. Maybe if you want “reasonably expect to match” you need 265.
Charting outcomes does not include clerkship grades at all. AOA selection is entirely school dependent outside of the fact that you can’t have more than 16% of the class in it. My school used to have this whole complicated scoring system to try and make AOA more than just step 1 and clerkship grades. It was actually a point of contention for the MD/PhD program because the research metric had a maximum score that required way less research than a PhD and we always felt like it handicapped us. The selection process went through multiple, often significant, changes while I was there such that I guarantee there’s no way the AOA inductees from the class of 2011 would have stayed the same with each iteration.
when do they award AOA? Do different schools use different metrics for awarding them?
I hear different residency programs expect a much higher step 1 score based on their ranking. Psychiatry averages are not high but Columbia gets those in 260s?
Depends on the school and its policies. Junior AOA (not all programs that have AOA have junior AOA) nominations happen after Step 1 during junior year. AOA nominations usually happen early during senior year. But it really depends on how the particular school handles the process.
Different programs use different criteria for selection. D2’s med school uses class rank, Step scores, scholarship/research and leadership as their primary criteria. Nominations are vetted (recommended/not recommended) by the student AOA membership committee then voted on by the faculty membership committee.
Highly ranked/desirable residency programs do have much higher Step 1 scores than other programs in the same specialty simply due to the strong competition for desirable program & locations. Whether Columbia needs a 260 for psych, I can’t say. But it was true for D2 last year and most of her friends who interviewed at top residency programs in their respective specialties. Their step 1 scores (and more importantly the step 1 scores of most of their fellow interviewees) were about 20-30 points higher than the mean of those who matched into their specialties in general. And their Step 1s were on par with those who matched into things like ENT, plastics, derm, ortho, rad onc.
AFAIK, there is no source that will give you the average Step scores for those who match at specific residency programs. ERAS doesn’t. Neither does FRIEDA. Doximity’s residency navigator might, but you need to have an account for access.
wowmom - the MGH and Columbia numbers are based on what people have told me (I personally know one who attended MGH and Columbia number was given to me by another who is doing a specialty with a 260+ but said his friend was going to psychiatry despite being one of the top students at Baylor but needing that score to make it Columbia psych). With my limited knowledge 4 years ago, I thought they chose Psych because of a low score.
Since people seem to keep tally on the Step 1 score more than anything including this interactive tool, I am trying to understand where the rotation grades play a role or grades during the classes. D will be applying next year.
Rotation grades do get looked at by residency program coordinators and directors. They are an important consideration when deciding who to interview, but this data isn’t captured in Charting the Outcomes probably because it isn’t numerically quantifiable. (Too many different grading systems are used for clerkships.)
However, if you look at the annual NRMP Survey of Program Directors–
http://www.nrmp.org/wp-content/uploads/2018/07/NRMP-2018-Program-Director-Survey-for-WWW.pdf
There is a specialty specific breakdown of rankings, but here’s the general PD rankings of application pieces starting with the most often cited. The survey also gives the weighting of relative importance for each item on a 1-5 scale
And there are about another 20 items on the survey–all less important than these top items.
Note that Specialty LORs are #2. Clerkship grades are critical for getting the highest endorsement from your specialty preceptor which in turn is weighed heavily by PDs–probably moreso than the step 1 score itself.
And the clerkship grades earned in all rotations prior to residency application are #6 with an equal weighting to the Step 1 score.
It’s kind of like the MCAT is a bar for admission to med school. You have to score above XX to be considered for admission, but it’s not the only criteria. GPAs are also looked at. LORs are also looked at. Same is true for residency. You need to score at certain level to be considered by certain specialties or certain programs, but your score isn’t the sole criteria. Once you’ve surmounted the score barrier, then your performance in your specialty clerkships is looked at as well as a whole bunch of other things.
The software used by residency PDs has a bunch options the PDs can use to pre-screen applications. One is citizenship status. One is minimum Step 1 score. One is class rank/quartile. One is Step 2 scores. Non-numerical discriminators and non-binary discriminators (Y/N) can’t be set because there’s no way to score those. PDs and APDs spend a lot of time reading applications and LORs before they start to offer interviews. This is why there’s a big gap between the time applications are released to programs in mid-September and interview invitations start to be sent out in mid-October.
RE: went into psych due to low Step 1
I like to tell the story of my former PC doc. He was a family medicine doctor who was AOA from a top 10 med school. He picked FM because he liked FM, not because his scores were low.
I personally know several young doctors from D1’s and D2’s classes who have gone in primary care fields like peds, IM, Ob/Gyn, family medicine with Step scores >250.
Not everyone wants to be an ophthalmologist or orthopedic surgeon.
Did those example physicians choosing primary care specialties graduate medical school with lower than typical student loan debt? (i.e. less financial pressure to choose a high paying specialty to pay off the student loans)
Some, but not all.
One young physician has over $450K in student loans (undergrad + med school debt combined). His husband has another $250K in student debt. One’s IM; one’s FM. Both are doing PSLF.