Choose school with greatest academic challenge OR more comfortable option?

Parent Cafe
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<p>I've been thinking about how to phrase this question for sometime so I think it's time to take a stab at it. </p>

<p>Let's say a kid is accepted to two schools -- one quite rigorous, one less so. </p>

<p>Do you encourage this kid to choose the school that is known for its rigor, even though you feel it could be pushing the boundaries of kid's intellectual and stress capacity?</p>

<p>OR</p>

<p>Do you encourage kid to select the one that is considered a good school but more relaxed than first school academically? At this school, kid would probably be able to participate and socialize quite a bit more than 1st school, and you know the kid could handle it academically.</p>

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<p>It depends on the kid’s personality. And, as long as the kid understands the difference between the two schools and the environments they offer, maybe the kid is the one best qualified to make the decision.</p>

<p>If one of my kids had asked me (which they didn’t), I would have suggested choosing the second school and making an effort to excel. Opportunities come to those who stand out from the rest of the pack.</p>

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<p>I wish I had the answer for you, but I actually have the exact same question!! I’m guessing that a student could still find ways to challenge themselves at the more relaxed school, but they have to really WANT to. I know for myself and my college experience, when easier opportunities presented themselves, I would take them. I actually went to Brown with its infamous policy of no requirements and taking any classes C/NC. I greatly took advantage of that and I regret it to this day. Looking back, it was a time to get educated. </p>

<p>Making the most of college is all about choices, and I think at either type of school, your s/d could make it what s/he wants. What a lame answer, huh? :)</p>

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<p>It totally depends on the student. Personally, I’d opt for a more relaxed approach with my children if they were wavering. Some students do so much better when they are at a school where they excel, because it gives them that extra boost.</p>

<p>What does the student want?</p>

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<p>It really depends on personality.
Oldest benefitted from the extra push from the über challenging school, while her sister who pushes herself pretty hard on her own, I hope is benefitting from a school that isn’t ALL about academics. Still challenging, but it is easier to find a balance by carefully selecting courses, so as to still have time for other activities.</p>

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<p>Read through these very recent threads…</p>

<p><a href=“http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/parents-forum/1322855-experience-second-tier-kid-third-tier-schools.html[/url]”>http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/parents-forum/1322855-experience-second-tier-kid-third-tier-schools.html&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;

<p>And this…</p>

<p><a href=“http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/parents-forum/1322764-experiences-smart-kids-second-tier-schools.html[/url]”>http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/parents-forum/1322764-experiences-smart-kids-second-tier-schools.html&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;

<p>As soomeone who graduated from Northwestern, took quite a few undergrad classes at Arizona State University, and teaches at a state flagship…I don’t think the difference in rigor at many schools is as great as many people on CC think it is. This is especially true in science , tech, and business type majors. I do think that there is a difference in rigor in some humanities and social science majors though.</p>

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<p>I guess another way to phrase my question is how do you know when a school is an academic and intellectual match for you? Is it all based off of the test scores and GPAs of other admitted students? Or are there other ways to gauge?</p>

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<p>I was talking with my son about this last night. He says he’d rather go to a school tht was academically challenging. He’s not an A student. I asked how he would feel if most of his peers were smarter than he is and he said that he wouldn’t mind at all as long as they didn’t flaunt their intelligence. But my son is one of those kids that doesn’t want to be at either extreme so I think he would just push himself enough to be at the middle of the pack. He’ll benefit from the push/pull to keep up.</p>

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<p>I am a FIRM believer that college is what you make of it. At every single school there will be at least on professor that the student connects with and can be given the chance to soar if the student so chooses. Honestly, is calculus at Harvard any more difficult than Calculus at State U? It’s still calculus.</p>

<p>From your numerous posts in this topic, I think the real issue you are having is what sticker you get to put on your car and what the reaction of your friends is going to be to that sticker.</p>

<p>Let your child go where he/she wants to go. It IS their life.</p>

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<p>Goodness, that’s kind of mean. I think the OP asks a legitimate question. I think we all want our kids to be stretched without being broken. There are, in fact, huge differences in rigor among institutions. Really.</p>

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<p>Education at a residential college is as much learning from one’s peers as from one’s professors. Ergo the question.</p>

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<p>Forester17–cbug has probably 5 threads running on this same subject, just worded differently. Mean or not, just trying to get to the root of the problem here. She has gotten great advice on every other thread on this topic.</p>

<p>No matter where you go, there will always be kids smarter than you are there.</p>

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<p>My D is a junior at an academically rigorous school. She works really, really hard. She had to make an adjustment from HS where she was one of the smartest kids who always got an A, to being in a place where everyone is smart, and the school’s grading policy is the average grade in a class can’t be higher than a B+.</p>

<p>I used to think there wasn’t much difference, but she had friends taking the same class she was in (beginning Arabic) at our state public university when she was taking it at her school. The state school started a few weeks earlier. They had the same textbook. State school gave 5 credits for the class; her school does 4 classes in a term so it was more like 4 credits.</p>

<p>Halfway into the term her school started a second textbook. The public university spent the entire term on the same textbook, which her school covered in half the time.</p>

<p>She’s someone who would have probably pushed herself regardless, but she’s acknowledged her academic experience would have been quite different at a less academically rigorous school.</p>

<p>It’s a question that can only be answered by the student, but it’s good the student is aware of it going in.</p>

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<p>Don’t know what field of study your child intends to follow but, many companies have a minimum GPA of 3.0 to hire a new grad. If he can go to the more challenging school and maintain a 3.0 (or hopefully higher) GPA, then go for it if he can handle the challenge.</p>

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<p>college_query–moving faster doesn’t always mean more knowledge though, especially retained knowledge. If your DD has progressed that quickly in a college course, she probably would have been recommended to skip to the 3rd level for next semester too. Even at your State U, there would have been options and challenges for her.</p>

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<p>Agree that its what he wants. My older s mugh preferred the academic rigor and intellectual stimulation. Younger s went to visit him and said “I dont want to go here, you have to work too hard!” He chose a school with comparatively less “rigor”, with a work hard/play hard reputation. Both are engineers so they are not academic slouches, but I agree each of my s’s made the right choice for their personality. Which type is your son?</p>

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<p>I also agree that there are plenty of classes that are very difficult for any kid at most any school. To me, the most important thing is that the student can succeed and be happy at a given school. I don’t mean over the top, always, ideally happy, either. You see, these are the years when all kinds of social, behavioral, mental issues come to the forefront, and even kids who were easy going and successful in school and life can have breakdowns. These are the dangerous years, psychologically. Subsance abuse, sex, social interacitons all enter the picture and if the kid is going away to school, there is no overseeing this. You parents are pretty much helpless. So the environment and the kid’s ability and willingness to a make sometimes great efforts come into play. I know a kid who took fraternity denials to heart way to hard along with a break up with a girl friend, and roommate situation for the following year not working out, and he did not like the school anyways which resulted in an ugly painful situation. In my 12 years of personally living this and seeing my kids friends and friends’ kids go through this, it is a powerful thing to have the school be the kid’s choice. THat if the atmosphere and things other than the rigor of courses are to the kid’s liking. Most every kid accepted to a school is capable of succeeding academically. Usually the failures, even academic ones, are due to difficulties in dealing with other issues along with the academics. The rigor is just one other thing in the picture. </p>

<p>My son turned down an ivy league school where DH and I, frankly would have loved for him to have gone. For, us it was perfect for him. Price wise, it worked perfectly. But he did not want to be in what HE PERCEIVED as the environment. Maybe he was right, maybe not. But that perception was there, and though we talked it out, we did not cross the line of forcing him to go. The rigor there would have been up there and he would have had the issue of not wanting to go there.</p>

<p>He picked a small LAC that he loved. Well, this year, he has been working constantly on his thesis, and getting his requirements for a dual math/econ major, and let me tell you: The work he has shared with DH who has a mathematics degree/masters from a top 25 school as well as a MBA in econometrics and finance from UCh and is actively working in the field, has DH shaking his head at the level. DS is working harder than a lot of grad students in those fields, but he loves his school and looks at is as part of what he has to do. Had he been pushed this way in an environment he disliked, there would be a higher likelihood of failure. </p>

<p>So all of these things come into play. ALso at schools where there is less competition, there is often a higher likelihood of a kid getting great opportunities if he so seeks. My friend’s son practically runs the computer department at his school and is really getting a PHD level education there. Had he gone to a school where there were many undergraduate computer brains, he would just be another kid and would not have these opportunities. It’s not a straightforward thing, and it really comes down to the student.</p>

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<p>No.
Not all schools with equal entering stats (let alone all majors) are equally rigorous or competitive. You need to read about and visit the schools to assess the academic atmosphere and “fit”. Grade inflation/deflation, reading loads, the academic calendar (trimester v. semester), the percentage of students in various majors or tracks (such as pre-med), grading policies, thesis or other graduation requirements, etc., all can influence stress levels.</p>

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<p>^ Wow! SteveMA — in all of my time here on CC I have never been attacked before!</p>

<p>Your quote:</p>

<p>"From your numerous posts in this topic, I think the real issue you are having is what sticker you get to put on your car and what the reaction of your friends is going to be to that sticker.</p>

<p>Let your child go where he/she wants to go. It IS their life."</p>

<p>Please enlighten me on how this thread or any of my threads smacks of what you speak. You are way off base. None of schools that we are now looking at have big names. My son is HS junior who has no idea of what he wants right now. I am using CC to educate myself and guide him the best I can. That is why I hope that all of us are here. However, you may be here to get a perverse thrill out delivering mean-spirited jabs. Hope you enjoyed yourself!</p>

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<p>Sorry…the above has NOTHING to do with anything here. Agree it is not a very pleasant jab.</p>