I would say that the purpose of the trial lesson is absolutely all about the teacher. Mine looked at teachers not only to assess teaching and communication style, but also sound, technique and style of playing.
Note that teachers who teach at more than one site will sometimes talk about their various programs, others will not. I know several Juilliard professors who teach at Bard who would review the pros and cons of those very different programs during sample lessons.
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Edited, because classical and jazz are not that different. This is just my kid’s individual experience. This may give context for him not putting as much emphasis on the teacher.
Just to provide a bit of different perspective, to add to those who find teacher to be the number one priority. I think this is different for each kid, and perhaps somewhat different for different types of music. (Not sure about that).
Mine did not decide based on teacher alone, or even primarily. He has not even met his teacher. He seems to feel absolutely comfortable with meeting him when he gets there. Context is he hasn’t had the experience of sticking with a particular guitar teacher for multiple years. He’s gone to School of Rock as his only guitar instruction for 12 years, with 7 different teachers. He’s never done a summer music program or camp.
His high priorities for making his decision were:
- ensembles! what are they? how many? who gets to play?
- collaborative school, not competitive
- city with lots of live music
- city where he can gig
- classic collegiate experience
- film department for possible collaboration
- bonus is that Loyola students often get work on the city’s many festivals and films
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Based on hanging around here too long, I do see the following for teacher selection:
Classical instrumentalist - very important - primary reason for picking a school
Classical vocalist (experienced - mainly opera focused) - important - makes a big difference
Vocalist (newer to classical including over to contemporary) - one key element amongst others
Contemporary/Jazz - I’m not sure…but sounds like above - important but other elements matter too
I’m sure there are others…
It reminds of a conversation a few years ago on “music theory”…where for vocalists…it’s not big deal if your theory is…kind of bad. No school will hold that against a budding vocalist. For instrumentalist…theory could matter a great deal. So, a general question like “how important is theory” can elicit very different responses depending on instrument etc. So it is good to point out the instrument and the type of music study - classical, contemporary, jazz etc - to get the best answers.
Adding my two cents…My son is a jazz guitarist who went to a jazz-based Arts Magnet high school with instruction from the same teacher for 4 years. Outside he had his private teacher (same for 11 years) and School of Rock (different alot!). The instructor , for him, was the single most important factor in his decision! I guess every student has their own list of priorities regardless of “discipline” or background! They are certainly an eclectic bunch! And, I’m certain they will ALL find their way!
For audition based undergrad music programs (other than for composition majors) music theory is not part of the application/evaluation for admission. Many top tier students enter with little to no formal music theory training. Just want to clarify that music theory is not a factor, so no worries if your aspiring musician has not studied much theory, regardless of instrument or genre. At times, applicants will be asked to sight read or sight sing, of course.
Just didn’t want to start a panic for upcoming students and parents that they need formal music theory.
Exactly! Your kid and mine play the same instrument and share some similar experiences with School of Rock and having a variety of SOR teachers, but they have different experiences with high school, long-term teachers, and summer camps. They went about choosing universities in two different ways. I guess it may sound in my post like I’m suggesting jazz is not the same as classical in terms of choosing a teacher. I was just pointing out my kid’s background for context.
Definitely. That’s why I gave the intro to my post about my kid’s experience.
Once again, this is a jazz guitar kid’s experience. He was asked to play and discuss chord progressions. That was the closest thing to music theory, I think.
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I just think it’s cool that they all approach it differently! Same discipline, same instrument…different approach…There’s no set formula!
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Adding a caveat - for percussionists having MULTIPLE teachers is key (or was for my kid’s selection criteria especially for UG). Having one who specializes in mallet instruments and another who does timpani and yet another for Latin percussion all factored into his decision-making. A couple of schools he looked at only had one or maybe two instructors and that made them less attractive.
Over the course of four years he’s been able to work with specialists in all areas of percussion which has set him up for more specialization for his MM…
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My kid went to HS with a left hand dominant percussionist (classical) who had as his primary search criterion…availability of a teacher who was left handed. I believe he ended up at NEC. I had never even thought of this before. So fascinating that musicians and genres are so unique! Always exciting to learn from everyone’s experiences.
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@anotheroboemom just a quick comment on your post: in our experience the theory tests for composition applicants were placement only and did not affect admission: it was all about the music created.
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Yes, placement is another story. I’ve heard lots of the schools will have placement tests in music theory and piano.
@BeverlyWest I am referring to tests on audition day. Some schools will have them in the fall, especially BA programs.
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Oh brother…I was trying to say don’t fall in the trap of thinking that there is one set of rules (teacher is the primary consideration for all) and than I made some rules…and fell into my own trap!! Everyone seems to enter with a variety of backgrounds…and lots of talent.
@anotheroboemom - you would know best about instrumentalist!! So I stand corrected. And when I think back now…maybe the person was talking about sight reading…and it was jazz…still that’s beside the point. With a good audition, you shouldn’t have to worry too much about the music skills…I think!
@Lendlees - I found your comment insightful. My D, on hindsight, benefited from a robust faculty. I often think of mentioning it…but never do. I can’t decide if it’s simply my D who prefers the variety of teachers or truly a good thing. I do think that it depends on the kid and the instrument…it makes a lot of sense for a percussionist. In my D’s case, she worked with a teacher who did a lot of Mozart voices and mentioned to her once “I don’t know what to do with Bach.” In grad school, my D got a chance to spend a lot of time on Bach…and learned more about how to perform it with confidence. She loves Bach now. It’s all so interesting.
Mine had to do music theory exam as part of application though it could be re-taken for higher placement later if he decided to matriculate.
At one school he was told he could place out of first two classes into class three, but couldn’t just go directly into class two, and was given guidance as to which topics tend to trip people up who start in the third semester of the sequence. I think if a student is not up to the level of the first course, and enrolls, that the student is told to learn some theory over the summer.
Oberlin lets students take the test to get into a higher level five times, I believe. Once before audition, and then others later. They also have helpful videos available.
The stress of the last five days has been unbearable. As I mention last week, my son was offered a spot off of the waitlist at Colburn. He was overjoyed but then we both realized that Colburn was the school we’d done the least research on. Yes he knows and has worked with the professor but he is only teaching at Colburn on a temporary basis and is only committed for the next year. Apparently Colburn has not identified who would take over the studio and has not made the names of those being considered public. This scenario is less than ideal.
I told my son that he needed to do his due diligence before making a decision. He spoke with the studio professor at length. He then reached out to several current and former Colburn students. It became apparent that the singular focus on performance was not the best option for him. He would like to have an opportunity to explore his other interests, academics and otherwise. The past year, dealing with his illness, has made him realize that he has a desire to grasp as much as he can out of life. He wants to be able to explore and discover who he is both as a musician and as an individual.
So he is firm in his commitment as a dual degree major at Oberlin. It’s been a bit of a rollercoaster but I can now say (once again) that we are officially done.
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Absolutely agree! My husband (bass player) has a friend who is one of the most amazing fiddle players I have ever heard. A lifelong, full time musician…an icon at Disneyland. This man cannot read music. He compensates by learning his part (even in a new musical theater show) by listening to a recording ahead of time. Once. And can nail the show on the first rehearsal.
There are so many paths…talent and passion lead the way through obstacles. And brings music to the world!
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@1OboeMom ,
Your son has maturity well beyond his years. Congratulations on his decision!
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Yay! Welcome (back)!
It sounds like he made a very thoughtful decision not to accept the Colburn offer.
Congrats!
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Yes, at Oberlin you can test out of the first semester of theory with a score on the test of a 92 or higher, I believe. My S22 did that, and I was concerned about him skipping a semester, but it turns out that the class they can test out of is really an intro to theory class and he was absolutely fine skipping it.
I did not know you could try 5 times!
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