<p>I'm nearing the end of my undergrad and want to go on to grad school in Classics, but I don't have the greek...I was considering doing a post-bac or a summer program or could I stay at my current undergrad uni and just take the greek and graduate later?</p>
<p>Graduate programs don’t really care how you get the Greek, I think, as long as you do. A few things to consider…
[ul][<em>]Most programs will want at least 2 or 3 years of Greek. Are you sure you want to stick around that long?
[</em>]Knowledge of at least one of German and French is virtually required for admission to most PhD programs. Do you have either?
[li]GRE scores are usually good for 5 years though sometimes only 2. Carefully consider the timing of the application process before taking the GRE, especially since it is becoming increasingly common to aim for a post-bac or MA program before a PhD.[/ul]</p>[/li]
<p>If your Latin background is strong (4 years or so), you may be able to get into a MA program, though they usually like to see at least a year in the weaker language. </p>
<p>[Here’s</a> a good resource if you’re not sure what language background you’ll need for various post-bac/MA/PhD programs.](<a href=“Golden Tiger Casino | $1500 Bonus | United States 2022”>http://classicaljournal.org/study_classics%20surveys.php)</p>
<p>Anything that has an intensive course so you can get your Greek in ASAP. Classics is so competitive that you may be best served to strengthen your application in a post-bac program or a MA.</p>
<p>Don’t apply for the PhD unless you have strong, STRONG Latin and Greek, and a modern language. Yes, 3 languages minimum for the more competitive ones. It’s the first thing they look for and use to make the first cuts.</p>
<p>The 2-3 year Greek requirement seems arbitrarily defined, doesn’t seem to take into account that every undergraduate institution is different with respect to the depth and breadth of courses offered, and in regard to the difficulty of these said courses.</p>
<p>Harvard requires only enough competence in the languages to enroll in 100 level courses. For Greek, the prerequisites to these courses appear to be intro to language, intro to attic prose, and intro to epic poetry.</p>
<p>Princeton simply demands “proficiency.”</p>
<p>Brown asks for a “substantial number of courses.”</p>
<p>Just what is enough?</p>
<p>kwu - It’s not really arbitrary - the curriculum has been pretty standardized for, well, <em>many</em> decades. Any school that teaches Latin and Greek does it in essentially the same way - 2 semesters of introductory material, then a semester of poetry and one of prose. Those are followed by upper level “author” courses that concentrate on one (or sometimes two related) ancient authors. That’s what the Harvard requirement is all about. Proficiency and “substantial” mean you’ve had several of the upper level courses. </p>
<p>ticklemepink may be slightly understating the PhD level requirements: 2 years of upper level courses in the stronger language and AT LEAST through the intermediate sequence on the weaker, PLUS a modern research language (there’s a strong preference for German, btw) is what will get your application read. In actual practice you would have to be an exceptional candidate to be admitted to a PhD program with that minimum level of preparation.</p>
<p>For Classics/Classical Archaeology the norm is quickly becoming a full undergrad schedule as indicated above followed by a post-bac year (or two if you’re light on the languages). There are also several very good “feeder” MA programs. </p>
<p>It really is unbelievably competitive.</p>
<p>WilliamC, the high school Advanced Placement (AP) curriculum has been standardized for a long time too. Are you going to argue that European History at an inner city public school is the same experience it would be at a New England boarding school? Would the same class even be comparable?</p>
<p>This is the point I’m trying to make by questioning these arbitrary demands.</p>
<p>A student who pursues four semesters of rigorous coursework at a university with a reputable program may be better prepared than a student who undertakes six semesters of less/inconsistently rigorous coursework.</p>
<p>I’m just curious as to whether admission committees take this into account.</p>
<p>I know Berkeley, thankfully, requires reading lists from all applicants.</p>
<p>Post-bac also seems like an unrealistic suggestion, considering these programs cost at least 11,000 dollars a year and given that no financial aid is available.</p>
<p>First we’re discussing college level work not high school. And I should add that by “many decades” I meant more than 10 
But yes, if an “inner city high school” offered AP European History I would expect the same results from that program as from one catering to bunch of collar-poppers :-). I suspect the score ranges are readily available - so it shouldn’t be too hard to check.</p>
<p>The quality of one’s program is taken into account to some degree. The world-wide Classics community is fairly small, at least in terms of full time faculty. At any given program someone on the adcom. will have a pretty good idea of the strengths and weaknesses of any given applicant’s program.</p>
<p>When I was applying every department asked for reading lists - it’s the norm as far as I know.</p>
<p>Post-bac is no more unrealistic than doing an extra undergrad year, an unfunded MA, or a summer intensive. The popularity of the programs is testament to that. </p>
<p>In any case, the “demands” are not arbitrary. They serve at least two very good and closely related purposes. First, they provide a way to very quickly weed out the <em>relatively</em> unqualified - remember, in Classics a BIG program might admit 9 or 10 students from an applicant pool of about 100 (all with near perfect GPAs, high GRE scores, etc.), with the expectation that 2 or 3 will accept. Programs like Penn’s, that can expect high levels of acceptance, may make 4 offers to an even larger applicant pool. </p>
<p>Second, the course load in modern Classics graduate programs is MUCH heavier than undergrad. For example at Penn we read 2 plays in an upper level Greek course (Frogs and Alcestis). The graduate survey that same semester read all (11) of Aristophanes plays - 5 times the undergrad rate. Add to that the need to write what amount to publishable papers in every class (which implies reading knowledge of German and French for research), make consistent progress through the reading lists… A new student who isn’t prepared to “hit the ground running” WILL fail. It does no good to admit an otherwise excellent student if he or she doesn’t have the background to succeed.</p>
<p>This whole discussion has been repeated several times over the years - if you use the search function you’ll get some idea of how consistent the replies have been (and also why I didn’t get in, thank goodness.). In addition to the 3 frequent Classics posters who’ve weighed in here, look especially for comments from Professor X who actually serves (or did serve) on an admissions committee.</p>
<p>I’ve asked several professors in history departments on how much language training should I have in x, y, and z. I had no idea whether my two years of X and Y were enough.</p>
<p>It all came down to this: Can you read the languages comfortably with minimum use of the dictionary?</p>
<p>But for Classics as WilliamC points out, you need to be able to hit the ground running with your ability to read in German, Greek, and Latin. So again, if you’re comfortably reading a play or can discern information from a scholarly article, then you may be ready for the PhD.</p>
<p>In any way, you’ll need to find a way to pay for Greek.</p>