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How come noone says that top colleges are full of Jews. Last time I checked, a huge number of smart white people over time were Jewish. Guess because they are white noone notices.
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<p>People say it all the time. It's just that it's old news.</p>
<p>My daughter has a classmate who is half-Jewish and half-Asian. I wonder whether this gives him a double disadvantage in admissions! (At least he's male!)</p>
<p>Marian, your post mae me smile. i've hafd personal experience with that mixture</p>
<p>I haven't read all the posts...but what about the UC system? This is probably the highest number of concentrated Asians students anywhere in the US.</p>
<p>What does that mean? The government grants groups there minority status?</p>
<p>I'm pretty sure minority status is just a matter of numbers.... You can't lost that status until your ethnic group has the greatest numbers.</p>
<p>Xiggi, You first reasoned the 1939 Princeton case was ancient, and now you mock 1995 as ancient history as well. LOL.</p>
<p>The point, as I tried to state here a few times, is not whether colleges do in fact discriminate, but the offensive nature of the first post and the caricature of Asians in the article. </p>
<p>No system which grants a 10% success rate to a self selected and largely qualified applicant pool can do a good job. Harvard Adcom will be the first to tell you that their selection process is less than perfect. We all live under imperfect systems. That is just life. One certainly does not have to argue that imperfections do not exist.</p>
<p>Wonder how the in-laws get on? LOL</p>
<p>PhatAlbert, to answer your question,
I am certainly not claiming a percentage. That cannot be implied from an unscientific sample. However, since my own sample is so heavily weighted toward the All or Nothing model, what I can say is that the stereotype in some form does exist, enough that it is an issue. (So does the Caucasian Soccer Mom stereotype exist, in some percentage -- enough to be noticed, enough to be an issue.) It can be said that the claims of some Asian students on CC & outside of CC are not just "rants" or exaggerations. And I've seen it up close & personal, & had Asian parents tell me that exactly what they have told their sons & daughters. (Later confirmed by those S's and D's.)</p>
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Xiggi, You first reasoned the 1939 Princeton case was ancient, and now you mock 1995 as ancient history as well. LOL.
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<p>Padad, why do you need to deconstruct my posts for points I did not make?</p>
<p>I did not reason that the Princeton case was ancient. I simply provided additional details. As far as the GOA report, it IS misleading to call a report of more than 10 years ... recent --as well as obfuscating the exact scope and contents of the report by omission.</p>
<p>Since when is it mocking to correct misleading information and offer additional details? </p>
<p>Rest assure that I try to make my points as clear as possible. As far as this thread, we may very well discuss different elements. Your point that "it is not whether colleges do in fact discriminate, but the offensive nature of the first post and the caricature of Asians in the article." is not one I am debating now, or ever in the past. My point of contention has always been that there is no verifiable evidence whatsoever to support the often- repeated claims of discrimations that a few are trying to pass for axioms. </p>
<p>You find the caricature of asians offensive; I find passing undocumented claims as accepted truths annoying. The positions are not incompatible.</p>
<p>Okay, my apology. peace and good night.</p>
<p>Just a grace note: There are tons of Asian Jewish kids out there. Off the top of my head, I know families that are Han Chinese-Jewish, Punjabi-Jewish, Japanese-Jewish, and Korean-Jewish (two of which have children applying to college this year). More importantly, numerically, the comparative ease and frequency of adoptions by Americans in China means that there are many, many ethnic Chinese girls with Jewish parents, being raised as Jews. My pretty small synagogue probably has 9-10 such kids.</p>
<p>Each of my two children had the experience once of getting to know an Asian classmate who seemed unusually relaxed about academics. Both turned out to be the adopted children of non-Asian parents. I doubt this is a coincidence.</p>
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You must be smoking something if you think that is what I said. ** I resent you putting words in my mouth that are nowhere in my post. ** My statement was that diversity is valued in institutions of learning, but not necessarily in institutions of incarceration. You are the one that said people should be jailed on ethnic quotas, a completely asinine statement in my book.</p>
<p>@Marian. That statement is quite offensive. It sounds like you are saying that no asian child raised by asian parents can be relaxed about academics. Meeting an asian relaxed about academics is not some rare event that requires a celebration.</p>
<p>@mini. I just saw your post encouraging asians to start eating a lot and early and become football players.</p>
<p>My high school has actually had quite a few asian football players including an indian in my grade who was 6 foot plus, about 230 lbs, captain of the team, and played tight end and inside linebacker. Did not make the cut at any ivy he applied to.</p>
<p>Not big enough. He needed to eat more, and he showed a lack of commitment. ;)</p>
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<blockquote> <p>While there were indeed 13 cases discussed in the report, the nature of the claims as well as the identity of the schools from which where the complaints originated might NOT be exactly what one would have on his or mind. Would we not expect a few Ivies next to the sole case at MIT? Are the UC Schools really bastions of "Asian" discrimination?</p> </blockquote>
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<p>I guess that statistics are indeed misleading.</p>
<p>xiqi,</p>
<p>The point is there were cases/reports that Asian students were discriminated. It is certainly NOT zero.</p>
<p>My S's prep school usually sends 15 to 17% of graduates to HPY every year. But there was no single Asian American who was accepted by HPY in last ten years although there were Asian Americans who graduated on top 3 of their classes almost every year. These Asian graduates also played varsity sports and led clubs.</p>
<p>My Ss best Asian friend is on top of his class and applies to H this year. The CC is very upfront and told him: You are the strongest Asian American candidate in 10 years; but it does not mean you will be automatically accepted since the best outcome for Asian students was a wait-list last 10 years. </p>
<p>Is there discrimination against Asian Americans in college admissions? Go figure.</p>
<p>"These Asian graduates also played varsity sports and led clubs."</p>
<p>But were they RECRUITED to play sports?</p>
<p>Phatalbert, In regard to your post addressing marian's remark, you need to remember that stereotype bias persists not because of views held by racists but because it is embedded within the well-meaning majority of our society. Remarks such as "assimilation" as a virtue are well-meaning but carry the undertone of bias nonetheless. Such utterances would seem ridiculous if the person is making the remark pertaining a forest having a homogeneous population of trees, a garden with a single species of flowers, a diet that is always the same etc, etc...</p>
<p>Easydad, the sad part is that this message from CC or GC is given to many Asian high school seniors, including my D. What a way to introduce to our youngsters to the fact of life.</p>
<p>"I haven't read all the posts...but what about the UC system? This is probably the highest number of concentrated Asians students anywhere in the US."</p>
<p>Cali also has a lot of Asians in general. Shouldnt a state school's demographics mirror those in the state? The only complaint you can make is that they need more hispanics.</p>
<p>easydad,</p>
<p>Your examples do not prove discrimination. Nor are the "elites" just looking for the top 1-3 students. Many of them reject a high percentage of Vals OF ALL ETHNIC GROUPS during each admission cycle. </p>
<p>Second, depending on the region, and pocket of region, the elites of which you speak may have been flooded with very similar students (and Asian) with similar academic histories, similar extracurriculars. Heading clubs & joining varsity sports (esp. as mini said, if not recruited) is not viewed by elites as heavy-hitting e.c.'s. There are Asians and non-Asians who would have had more unusual e.c.'s & excellence in those. Those 2 e.c.'s are extremely common, & appear across all ethnicities, too.</p>
<p>Third, the top 1, 2, or 3 students who were also Asian, but from a different region where there had NOT been a history (which you mention) of admission might have been favored by those colleges, to alter the geographic mix. As I mentioned above, you don't get to continue with the same expectations, and then yell discrimination when a college broadens its admissions policies. Asians, including Northeastern Asians, continue to be overrepresented currently in elite colleges versus their representation in the college population.</p>
<p>Fourth, elites care about UNDER-REPRESENTED minorities. They believe it is in their interest to be more inclusive, not less so. If Asians were being discriminated against, they would then be considered under-represented, but they're not.</p>
<p>Fifth, UC Berkeley is considered a public elite. Their student body population is 47% Asian. Are these numbers high enough for you?</p>
<p>(Give me a break.)</p>